Hamas/Israel conflict: news and discussion

[Elohim]

Do you have a view re the civilians killed and kidnapped by Hamas at the start of this?

Yes they are innocent and what Hamas did is sick and unforgivable.

 

[TopCat]

Yes they are innocent and what Hamas did is sick and unforgivable.

Subhuman?

 

[Knotted]

Norman Finkelstein on Al Jazeera



I think he's someone who has his problems eg. underplaying anti-semitism. But he's still good on this.

 

[Elohim]

Subhuman?

It was a horrible act that Hamas did. Can't call hamas sub human for doing this it upsets people.

I apologise for calling hamas sub-human. Didn't realise it would anger people on here.

The festival crowd were innocent civilians.

 

[TopCat]

It was a horrible act that Hamas did. Can't call hamas sub human for doing this it upsets people.

I apologise for calling hamas sub-human. Didn't realise it would anger people on here.

The festival crowd were innocent civilians.

It didn’t upset people as such. It just gave a big glimpse as to you.

 

[PTK]

It was a horrible act that Hamas did. Can't call hamas sub human for doing this it upsets people.

I apologise for calling hamas sub-human. Didn't realise it would anger people on here.

The festival crowd were innocent civilians.

The killing of unarmed civilians by the military wing of Hamas was despicable but not inexplicable. If people are treated in a dehumanising fashion, then they are more likely to behave in an inhumane way.

 

[TopCat]

Blinken returning to Israel to try to limit death toll from an invasion of Gaza

US is concerned heavy Palestinian casualties caused by expected ground assault will provoke Iran and inflame wider tensions

www.theguardian.com

 

[Kid_Eternity]

You can refuse to pick a side if you want, but you can't deny which side has all the power in this asymmetrical situation. You cannot deny which is the dispossessed people nor who dispossessed them. How can Israel arrive at a position from which it can negotiate a meaningful settlement without acknowledging these basic, obvious facts.

It never will while people demand others pick aside against it. Which underlines the point. Tribalism like this only ensure conflict.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

It was a horrible act that Hamas did. Can't call hamas sub human for doing this it upsets people.

I apologise for calling hamas sub-human. Didn't realise it would anger people on here.

The festival crowd were innocent civilians.

The festival people were friends of the Palestinian people. Hamas slaughtered them precisely because they could allow people to realise that the sides in this are an illusion designed to continue conflict.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Blinken returning to Israel to try to limit death toll from an invasion of Gaza

US is concerned heavy Palestinian casualties caused by expected ground assault will provoke Iran and inflame wider tensions

www.theguardian.com

Oh great….

 

[Ax^]

It never will while people demand others pick aside against it. Which underlines the point. Tribalism like this only ensure conflict.

hmm at we have 2.2 million people without heat , power of food in an illegal act of collective punishment

and the same time Israel is lining up tanks to level a city

from a humanity stand point that should give a suggestion

 

[Bingoman]

Oh great….

Looks like the two state Solution is now never going to happen?

 

[PTK]

War on Want is encouraging people to email their MPs. If you click on the link and enter your postcode, an email to your local MP will be generated, which you may amend.

War on Want | Fighting Global Poverty

secure.waronwant.org

 

[cupid_stunt]

Looks like the two state Solution is now never going to happen?

It never was, Israel may sure of that.

 

[TopCat]

Looks like the two state Solution is now never going to happen?

Now?

 

[Larry O'Hara]

Norman Finkelstein on Al Jazeera



I think he's someone who has his problems eg. underplaying anti-semitism. But he's still good on this.

I think he happens to be Jewish from a family of Holocaust victims…

 

[Bingoman]

Now?

Or should I say was never going to happen

 

[PTK]

Blinken returning to Israel to try to limit death toll from an invasion of Gaza

US is concerned heavy Palestinian casualties caused by expected ground assault will provoke Iran and inflame wider tensions

www.theguardian.com

"Israeli diplomats deny their goal is to expel Palestinians from Gaza as they fight Hamas, although the defence minister, Yoav Gallant has said the plan is to “eliminate everything”. Another minister, Gideon Sa’ar, has said Gaza “must be smaller at the end of the war”."

 

[Gramsci]

War on Want is encouraging people to email their MPs. If you click on the link and enter your postcode, an email to your local MP will be generated, which you may amend.

War on Want | Fighting Global Poverty

secure.waronwant.org

Done. Thanks for the link. War on Want do good work.

Secondly that website worked well. Put in my postcode have got my MP right away.

 

[Favelado]

Madrid today. 10000-15000 demo I’d say.

 

[teqniq]

Looks like the two state Solution is now never going to happen?

It's been dead in the water for years. Anyone thinking otherwise is deluding themselves.

 

[elbows]

2000 tiny islands you won't have heard of apart from Guam maybe, which definitely has US connections.

Yes they are equal votes. But the UN means shit with the vetos.

Theres even a wikipedia entry:

Israel–Federated States of Micronesia relations - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Includes examples of various votes, and also:

Micronesia is a former United Nations Trust Territory administered by the United States. It became sovereign in 1986 through a Compact of Free Association, which establishes mutual economic and defence responsibilities between the two countries. The Marshall Islands and Palau -the other two countries which consistently support Israel at the United Nations[12]- are also former U.S. territories bound by the Compact.

 

[Knotted]

2000 tiny islands you won't have heard of apart from Guam maybe, which definitely has US connections.

Yes they are equal votes. But the UN means shit with the vetos.

It's only Security Council resolutions that are binding not General Assembly ones and the former get vetoed by the US when it involves Israel.

 

[Johnny Vodka]

DJ/musician Nabihah Iqbal sharing out some very pro-Palestinian words on social media after attending one of the demos yesterday.

 

[Elohim]

It didn’t upset people as such. It just gave a big glimpse as to you.

Sorry but I have have little respect for Hamas same as I have little respect for the zionists.

The people I do respect are the civilians on both sides who are caught up in this.

 

[Rimbaud]

Yes, which leads to stuff like this:

Spoiler: Front cover of the Socialist Worker

View attachment 395553

Don't want to derail with lefty trainspotting stuff, but I'm genuinely surprised by how much they are glorifying the attacks last weekend. I was a member for a bit as a student over a decade over and while I have a lot of criticisms of them, unqualified support for terrorism - including killing children - was not something I could imagine from them back then. Wtf is going on with them or has the world in general just gone mad?

 

[Johnny Vodka]

Don't want to derail with lefty trainspotting stuff, but I've genuinely surprised by how much they are glorifying the attacks last weekend. I was a member for a bit as a student over a decade over and while I have a lot of criticisms of them, unqualified support for terrorism - including killing children - was not something I could imagine from them back then. Wtf is going on with them or has the world in general just gone mad?

Yeah, it's really horrible and potentially discrediting to the left.

 

[emanymton]

Don't want to derail with lefty trainspotting stuff, but I've genuinely surprised by how much they are glorifying the attacks last weekend. I was a member for a bit as a student over a decade over and while I have a lot of criticisms of them, unqualified support for terrorism - including killing children - was not something I could imagine from them back then. Wtf is going on with them or has the world in general just gone mad?

Thought I'd look at reading the actual articles to see if it was more nuanced. And well...

It’s no time for the left to get defensive on Palestine

The Labour Party removed the phrase “end apartheid” from the advertised title of a Palestine Solidarity Campaign event at its conference.

socialistworker.co.uk

Jeremy Corbyn was far too even-handed when he tweeted, “The unfolding events in Israel and Palestine are deeply alarming. We need an immediate ceasefire and urgent de-escalation.”

That was just as Hamas fighters were defeating their oppressors. Corbyn added, “Ending the occupation is the only means of achieving a just and lasting peace.”

 

[Kid_Eternity]

Looks like the two state Solution is now never going to happen?

I fear you may be right…I just can’t see how that based on the pre 67 borders will for part of a settlement while Hamas (and Iran) exist and while Israel is ruled by a criminal.

 

[Kid_Eternity]

hmm at we have 2.2 million people without heat , power of food in an illegal act of collective punishment

and the same time Israel is lining up tanks to level a city

from a humanity stand point that should give a suggestion

Humanity also includes the Jews and their well being. Until they feel truly safe and Iran funded groups like Hamas are gone the occupation will continue…