Hamas/Israel conflict: news and discussion

[Spymaster]

So why won't you condemn 'the events of the past couple of weeks' then?

Hang on; when I was asking this of people the day after the Hamas attack, pulling teeth would've been easier than getting the condemnations.

Why has this now become a legitimate line of questioning?

 

[platinumsage]

Of course he's being tagged and quoted, that is how forums work, especially when there's a plonker posting complete nonsense.

I'm fine with being tagged and quoted, although when people harangue me for not responding to every post, or insist on me repeating things I've already said, it gets a bit annoying when others say I should shut up.

 

[Spymaster]

Of course he's being tagged and quoted, that is how forums work ...

Not really. He's only being chased around by a few of you. Others, like Bish, have attempted to drag things back on track and been ignored, and loads of people simply aren't posting much any more.

 

[Pickman's model]

Mezzer maybe you're right, I'll give it a go

 

[Rob Ray]

I'm fine with being tagged and quoted, although when people harangue me for not responding to every post, or insist on me repeating things I've already said, it gets a bit annoying when others say I should shut up.

Tbf if you said "I'm shutting up and leaving the thread" the requests would probably stop. That's not a request, but you're not actually obligated to be doing this.

 

[mojo pixy]

Hang on; when I was asking this of people the day after the Hamas attack, pulling teeth would've been easier than getting the condemnations.

Why has this now become a legitimate line of questioning?

I mean, it always was a legitimate question as far as I'm concerned, anyone who won't condemn what happened on October 7th is as bad as anyone who won't condemn what's happening now. It all has a context, and that must be understood, but there's literally no reason not to condemn the violence on 7/10 and all the other violence every day since.

But specifically, because platinumsage , you specifically wrote

For the actions in the past couple of weeks i’m withholding judgement. Sorry about that.

and you have not given an answer to why, when asked specifically. And no, I won't read back over loads of absolute rubbish to find an answer which is not there.

I've already made it clear that there isn't any good reason for a non-Israeli to be supporting what's happening in Gaza right now, unless they happen to hold antipathy towards Palestinians - which I might expect from an Israeli, but genuinely find hard to comprehend from a foreigner. So I am assuming racism is at the heart of the double standard where Israelis are allowed to lash out in attack/defence, but Palestinians are not. Sorry / not sorry.

 

[teqniq]

I've got to say, I think this was entirely deliberate:

Israel-Hamas live updates: 6,500 Palestinians killed by Israel in Gaza

Al Jazeera Arabic’s Wael Dahdouh’s wife, son and daughter among family members killed after home hit.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[platinumsage]

I mean, it always was a legitimate question as far as I'm concerned, anyone who won't condemn what happened on October 7th is as bad as anyone who won't condemn what's happening now. It all has a context, and that must be understood, but there's literally no reason not to condemn the violence on 7/10 and all the other violence every day since.

But specifically, because platinumsage , you specifically wrote



and you have not given an answer to why, when asked specifically. And no, I won't read back over loads of absolute rubbish to find an answer which is not there.

I've already made it clear that there isn't any good reason for a non-Israeli to be supporting what's happening in Gaza right now, unless they happen to hold antipathy towards Palestinians - which I might expect from an Israeli, but genuinely find hard to comprehend from a foreigner. So I am assuming racism is at the heart of the double standard where Israelis are allowed to lash out in attack/defence, but Palestinians are not. Sorry / not sorry.

Post 5121, hth etc

 

[LDC]

Which other countries have 'settlers' ( not had )

Probably unwisely looked at this thread again, and wanted to answer this, even if it is a bit late...

A few, Indonesia for example used settlements in West Papua as part of a plan to pacify the country & people The39thStep.

Indonesian Settler Colonialism in West Papua

During the late 20th century Indonesia resettled 300,000 farmers to the restive province of West Papua, transforming its demographic composition. Such resettlem

papers.ssrn.com

West Papua - Transmigration

www.cs.utexas.edu

Why Indonesia fails to address the West Papua conflict

The country’s government has focused on containing, rather than resolving, a crisis with roots in a dubious referendum.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[Ax^]

hmm you have to wonder about the people in power in Israel who are not reflecting how their handy work lead to the current situation

For years, Netanyahu propped up Hamas. Now it's blown up in our faces - The Times of Israel

 

[mojo pixy]

Post 5121, hth etc

I see. You think that post full of weasel words explains everything.

 

[The39thStep]

Probably unwisely looked at this thread again, and wanted to answer this, even if it is a bit late...

A few, Indonesia for example used settlements in West Papua as part of a plan to pacify the country & people The39thStep.

Indonesian Settler Colonialism in West Papua

During the late 20th century Indonesia resettled 300,000 farmers to the restive province of West Papua, transforming its demographic composition. Such resettlem

papers.ssrn.com

West Papua - Transmigration

www.cs.utexas.edu

Why Indonesia fails to address the West Papua conflict

The country’s government has focused on containing, rather than resolving, a crisis with roots in a dubious referendum.

www.aljazeera.com

Ta . You must be looking forward to the discussion within Angry Workers

 

[platinumsage]

I see. You think that post full of weasel words explains everything.

It explains my position, take from it what you will.

 

[Kaka Tim]

No they haven't, Egypt is denying them a choice. Surely it's the Palestinians who should decide whether to say "fuck off" or not, that's what self-determination means.

So, tell me, what happens to the palastinians who "choose" not to flee?

 

[Ax^]

It explains my position, take from it what you will.

your position from your posting today is that the British empire should of raised every major city in country of Ireland for the Easter rising

ya gobshite

 

[PTK]

Security concerns aside, what right do Egypt or other countries have to make that decision for them by refusing to accept refugees?

Irony?

What right indeed has the State of Israel to not allow Palestinian Arab refugees to return to the land from which they were expelled?

 

[Mr.Bishie]

I've got to say, I think this was entirely deliberate:

View attachment 397048
View attachment 397049

Israel-Hamas live updates: 6,500 Palestinians killed by Israel in Gaza

Al Jazeera Arabic’s Wael Dahdouh’s wife, son and daughter among family members killed after home hit.

www.aljazeera.com

My friend Medyan worked for Al Jazeera many years ago & knew Dahdouh. Just been chatting via WhatsApp now, he’s worried about his three photojournalists, two of which have now made contact ( electric/internet) & Sat phone probs. But no word from the third.

 

[mojo pixy]

It explains my position, take from it what you will.

Thanks, I shall. What I take from it is that you don't know enough about what's happening in Gaza to condemn it, but do you know enough about it to go on justifying it all day in an Internet forum.

 

[brogdale]

Why has this now become a legitimate line of questioning?

You going for full-on unhinged today?

 

[LDC]

Ta . You must be looking forward to the discussion within Angry Workers

We've pretty much 'officially' dissolved as a group very recently. But suspect we'd be pretty much on the same page with this tbh. Part of me staying off this thread/topic was to do some reading and thinking on it all as well.

 

[Spymaster]

You going for full-on unhinged today?

Mental health slurs now, Broggers?

Why am I not surprised?

 

[platinumsage]

Irony?

What right indeed has the State of Israel to not allow Palestinian Arab refugees to return to the land from which they were expelled?

Weird that Israel are bad for “turning Gaza into a prison” yet Egypt are good for not letting Palestinians emigrate because they need to stay where they belong.

 

[PTK]

.

 

[platinumsage]

.

 

[Gramsci]

Given the amount of border creep since it was drawn up ...just how viable is the 2 state solution these days? Genuine question

I don't think it is viable. Mentioned some of this in previous posts.

Agree the border creep means its no longer viable in a real sense.

I also think no Israeli government has been serious about the two state solution.

Zionists and their supporters in the west trot out this line that they of course they want a two state solution

The Oslo peace process has been shown to be a farce. A farce that has fed into the present conflict.

To add

So One state solution - people like Ilan Pappe / Tony Judt are ones I know who support this.

Tony Judt the British historian now sadly deceased got a lot of stick as a Jew from Zionists for supporting a one state solution.

In some quarters supporting a one state solution is anti semitic as it is ( so the argument goes) denying the Jewish people their right to self determination,

Something I think is nonsense

 

[The39thStep]

Wrong narrative

 

[platinumsage]

I don't think it is viable. Mentioned some of this in previous posts.

Agree the border creep means its no longer viable in a real sense.

I also think no Israeli government has been serious about the two state solution.

Zionists and their supporters in the west trot out this line that they of course they want a two state solution

The Oslo peace process has been shown to be a farce. A farce that has fed into the present conflict.

Neither side have been interested in a 2-state solution unless it gives them more than the other side is prepared to give. That's been the case for over a hundred years.

 

[cupid_stunt]

.

And, that's about the best point you have made so far.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I don't think it is viable. Mentioned some of this in previous posts.

Agree the border creep means its no longer viable in a real sense.

I also think no Israeli government has been serious about the two state solution.

Zionists and their supporters in the west trot out this line that they of course they want a two state solution

The Oslo peace process has been shown to be a farce. A farce that has fed into the present conflict.

To add

So One state solution - people like Ilan Pappe / Tony Judt are ones I know who support this.

Tony Judt the British historian now sadly deceased got a lot of stick as a Jew from Zionists for supporting a one state solution.

In some quarters supporting a one state solution is anti semitic as it is ( so the argument goes) denying the Jewish people their right to self determination,

Something I think is nonsense

There's only one thing the Israeli government wants less than a two state solution, and that's a one state solution shared with the Palestinians.

 

[Ax^]

Neither side have been interested in a 2-state solution unless it gives them more than the other side is prepared to give. That's been the case for over a hundred years.

you are no history expert are you ?