Hamas/Israel conflict: news and discussion

[teqniq]

Hopefully UK Lawyers For Israel who are launching legal action against the government for it's paltry suspension of 30 arms licenses will find they have dug a very expensive hole for themselves.

Exclusive: UK Lawyers for Israel patron quits, says Starmer right to halt arms sales

Lord Carlile tells MEE he has resigned from pro-Israel group on same day it threatens government with legal action over weapons sales ban

www.middleeasteye.net

 

[two sheds]

There's this, too: BBC rejects claim it breached guidelines 1,500 times with Gaza coverage

Researchers found that Israel was associated with the term “war crimes” four more times and “genocide” over 14 times more than Hamas in BBC coverage. The report concluded that there were 1,553 breaches of editorial guidelines.

hmm

 

[teqniq]

There's this, too: BBC rejects claim it breached guidelines 1,500 times with Gaza coverage


hmm

The report is written by one Trevor Asserson of this law firm who it would appear lives in..... Israel:

 

[two sheds]

yes I suspected something like - funnily enough I didn't see that in the couple of articles I've read.

 

[teqniq]

yes I suspected something like - funnily enough I didn't see that in the couple of articles I've read.

Twitter still has it's uses

 

[Gramsci]

Novara media have covered this tonight.

The "research" was done using AI.

Its hardly surprising words like war crimes and genocide are said more times in relation to Israel as its Israel that has been doing most of the killing.

So BBC is just stating facts.

Report also has it in for Jeremy Bowen. He's been accused before of being anti Israel and biased against it.

Ash Sarkar was saying on NM these attacks on media outlets are to get people to shut up about Israel and what its doing in West Bank and Gaza.

I actually think BBC coverage has been fair. Reporters like Jeremy Bowen are very good.

Thing is Israel is losing the propaganda war abroad ( except where it matters) so only way for pro Israel people now to go is attack mode on any balanced reporting.

There is no need for biased reporting when Israel is doing a good pr job in full view of the world of killing thousands of civilians , destroying infrastructure and now launching attack on West Bank.

To make out reporting the facts of this shows anti Israel bias is laughable.

Plus way the settlers have been going on in West Bank to point where even some Western governments have taken action doesn't look good.

It also brings into public view the way Israel has built settlements on Palestinian land. Across the world images of settlers attacking poor farmers.

But this is how Israel lobby works. Unless BBC say Hamas are part of the axis of evil and Israel is doing its up most to prevent civilian casualties its going to be accused of bias.

 

[Gramsci]

Appears other BBC journalists are sticking up for Jeremy Bowen and BBC are rightly criticising the methodology of the report. Good.

 

[Gramsci]

Talking about reporting this interview with Mariam Barghouti , a journalist reporting from West Bank , has just come out on Democracy Now



I've put it here as she recounts talking to a Palestinian in Jenin who said what is happening in West Bank is part of what is happening in Gaza. You can't separate them out.

The IDF attacks on major Palestinian towns/ camps is in her eyes , after having seen it, part of strategy of IDF to destroy Palestinian civil society.

For example she looked at deaths of children. Most were killed by head or chest shots or in the back. This shows deliberate strategy to kill Palestinian children.

That the end aim of all this is to create in longer term a Greater Israel from the river to the sea.

West Bank IDF have not got the excuse of Hamas.

There are small groups of fighters. She was asked about them. They are young. Many as children were held in Israel detention. These young people have seen all peaceful methods fail. And Israel still building settlements. Settlers attacking Palestinians

The new armed groups are the newer generation. The Palestinian authority is discredited.

She says they told her they would rather die than live like they do under Israeli occupation

And see themselves as trying to defend their communities and liberate Palestine from Israeli brutal rule.

She says whole generation are growing up seeing violence of Israeli state all the time. They are traumatised. With nothing to lose.

She was asked what Palestinians thought of recent demos in Israel. She said they didn't mean anything to your average West Bank Palestinian. The demos were an argument amongst Israelis and it had nothing for them. They were about getting the hostages back. Basically an argument about tactics. What happens to Palestinians after that does not appear to Palestinians something Israeli society as a whole cares about.

Really worth a watch this,

Given the report attacking the BBC for bias this half hour programme is a wake up call about the reality of what is really happening. What the IDF and Israeli government strategy is in relation to Palestinians. As shown by what they do on the ground.

Reporters like her are taking great risks to try and cover this. Give the Palestinian side. IDF and Israeli government don't want reporting from the ground to happen.

 

[teqniq]

Another massacre overnight:



E2a the crater left by the bombing is huge. The IDF are claiming that they targeted a Hamas command and control centre:

 

[planetgeli]

I think you mean humanitarian aid? Oh, no you don't.

 

[agricola]

Novara media have covered this tonight.

The "research" was done using AI.

Its hardly surprising words like war crimes and genocide are said more times in relation to Israel as its Israel that has been doing most of the killing.

So BBC is just stating facts.

Report also has it in for Jeremy Bowen. He's been accused before of being anti Israel and biased against it.

Ash Sarkar was saying on NM these attacks on media outlets are to get people to shut up about Israel and what its doing in West Bank and Gaza.

I actually think BBC coverage has been fair. Reporters like Jeremy Bowen are very good.

Thing is Israel is losing the propaganda war abroad ( except where it matters) so only way for pro Israel people now to go is attack mode on any balanced reporting.

There is no need for biased reporting when Israel is doing a good pr job in full view of the world of killing thousands of civilians , destroying infrastructure and now launching attack on West Bank.

To make out reporting the facts of this shows anti Israel bias is laughable.

Plus way the settlers have been going on in West Bank to point where even some Western governments have taken action doesn't look good.

It also brings into public view the way Israel has built settlements on Palestinian land. Across the world images of settlers attacking poor farmers.

But this is how Israel lobby works. Unless BBC say Hamas are part of the axis of evil and Israel is doing its up most to prevent civilian casualties its going to be accused of bias.

It is worth remembering at this point that the IDF killed a member of Bowen’s film crew in 2000:

Jeremy Bowen: The man in the middle

For the BBC's Middle East Editor, steering a neutral path can sometimes seems impossible. Jeremy Bowen tells Ian Burrell how he deals with the challenge of 'objectivity'

www.independent.co.uk

 

[two sheds]

I'm surprised the report didn't criticize the BBC for saying that the IDF has killed more people than Hamas has.

 

[frogwoman]

That report seems to have been written by a single crank tbh

 

[teqniq]

No surprises here:

Israel lobbying US Congress to press South Africa to drop ICJ genocide case: Report

Israeli diplomats instructed to tell South African diplomats their country will 'pay heavy price' if it doesn't change Israel policy

www.middleeasteye.net

However their lobbying efforts may (though I hope not) have more impact as the ANC has been forced into a coalition government having lost it's majority:

South Africa’s ANC loses 30-year parliamentary majority after election

African National Congress vote share drops to 40 percent, forcing it to seek coalition partners to form government.

www.aljazeera.com

 

[planetgeli]

The IDF are claiming that they targeted a Hamas command and control centre:

I can't believe you bothered to type that out. I think this is the 2,637th Hamas command and control centre the IDF have attacked?

While at the same time, the Israeli Defence Minister is claiming "Hamas as a military formation no longer exists".

Erm...

Ok, let's clear that up. Turns out the IDF actually bombed a safe haven of 380,000 people, displaced and living in tents. And in this tent city are horrific and dehumanising conditions with limited food, filthy water and no sanitation.

So, fascism then.

 

[Pickman's model]

I can't believe you bothered to type that out. I think this is the 2,637th Hamas command and control centre the IDF have attacked?

While at the same time, the Israeli Defence Minister is claiming "Hamas as a military formation no longer exists".

Erm...

Ok, let's clear that up. Turns out the IDF actually bombed a safe haven of 380,000 people, displaced and living in tents. And in this tent city are horrific and dehumanising conditions with limited food, filthy water and no sanitation.

So, fascism then.

Somewhere they deemed a safe haven which is why anyone was there. It's disgusting and disgraceful

 

[frogwoman]

The editor of my synagogue's magazine is getting a lot of abuse from angry zionists because she included an article by someone who goes to the synagogue and attended the palestine encampment in the latest edition.

 

[_Russ_]

That report seems to have been written by a single crank tbh

Every time an Israeli Official or lobbyist is given airtime we see that the narrative he puts forward is far from being a unique point of view

 

[Gramsci]

Another massacre overnight:



E2a the crater left by the bombing is huge. The IDF are claiming that they targeted a Hamas command and control centre:

View attachment 442059

I wonder what David Lammy thinks when he sees this?

According to him there is not enough evidence

Despite the mass casualties of the conflict, it has not been possible to reach a determinative judgment on allegations regarding Israel’s conduct of hostilities

Summary of the IHL process, decision and the factors taken into account

www.gov.uk

Im just a layman. Not one of the officials In government.

How is it I can see that Israel's conduct of hostilities is designed to kill large numbers of civilians.

 

[Pickman's model]

I wonder what David Lammy thinks when he sees this?

According to him there is not enough evidence

Summary of the IHL process, decision and the factors taken into account

www.gov.uk

Im just a layman. Not one of the officials In government.

How is it I can see that Israel's conduct of hostilities is designed to kill large numbers of civilians.

Like Clint Eastwood says in fistful of dollars, things look different from higher up

 

[Gramsci]

Talking about reporting this interview with Mariam Barghouti , a journalist reporting from West Bank , has just come out on Democracy Now



I've put it here as she recounts talking to a Palestinian in Jenin who said what is happening in West Bank is part of what is happening in Gaza. You can't separate them out.

The IDF attacks on major Palestinian towns/ camps is in her eyes , after having seen it, part of strategy of IDF to destroy Palestinian civil society.

For example she looked at deaths of children. Most were killed by head or chest shots or in the back. This shows deliberate strategy to kill Palestinian children.

That the end aim of all this is to create in longer term a Greater Israel from the river to the sea.

West Bank IDF have not got the excuse of Hamas.

There are small groups of fighters. She was asked about them. They are young. Many as children were held in Israel detention. These young people have seen all peaceful methods fail. And Israel still building settlements. Settlers attacking Palestinians

The new armed groups are the newer generation. The Palestinian authority is discredited.

She says they told her they would rather die than live like they do under Israeli occupation

And see themselves as trying to defend their communities and liberate Palestine from Israeli brutal rule.

She says whole generation are growing up seeing violence of Israeli state all the time. They are traumatised. With nothing to lose.

She was asked what Palestinians thought of recent demos in Israel. She said they didn't mean anything to your average West Bank Palestinian. The demos were an argument amongst Israelis and it had nothing for them. They were about getting the hostages back. Basically an argument about tactics. What happens to Palestinians after that does not appear to Palestinians something Israeli society as a whole cares about.

Really worth a watch this,

Given the report attacking the BBC for bias this half hour programme is a wake up call about the reality of what is really happening. What the IDF and Israeli government strategy is in relation to Palestinians. As shown by what they do on the ground.

Reporters like her are taking great risks to try and cover this. Give the Palestinian side. IDF and Israeli government don't want reporting from the ground to happen.

Inside the brutal siege of Jenin

Article by the Journalist in the news report from Democracy Now.

I do think the attacks on West Bank by IDF and settlers should be seen as part and parcel of the Israel state attack on Gaza.

The settlers are imo effectively part of the state. An armed militia.

One of the more tragic things for Palestinians is that the so called peace process has led to PA now being unable to defend Palestinians from attack.

A lot of the attacks by IDF are in area that's supposed to be under PA control. Under peace process they are allowed in to go after so called terrorists. That is anyone who might take up arms to defend Palestinians.

These attacks in West Bank need to be seen in context of decades of Zionist occupation and gradual take over of Palestinian land to make a Greater Israel.

Some kind of limited PA control would be allowed. This would mean the Zionist state does not have to allow the remaining Palestinian to be citizens of Israel.

When Netanyahu goes the Zionist state will still be there. And that is the problem.

 

[GarveyLives]

But this is how Israel lobby works.

Sky News has ended its contract with presenter Belle Donati several months after she compared Israel's campaign in Gaza to the Jewish Holocaust.

It comes after the broadcaster was earlier forced to apologise after she made the comparison during an interview with Danny Danon, a member of Benjamin Netanyahu's Likud party.

She had likened his comments about the war on Gaza with the way Jewish people were treated in the Jewish Holocaust.

At the time of the interview, in January 2024, Oxfam said that Israel’s military was killing Palestinians at an average rate of 250 people a day - a figure it claims is higher than any other major 21st century conflict:

(Source: as stated in image)​

Sky News presenter exits broadcaster after Holocaust-Gaza comparison

 

[hash tag]

Agree and long overdue

Email your MP now and demand they stop the UK from transferring arms to Israel

The human rights violations taking place in Gaza are at catastrophic levels. Despite this, the UK still hasn’t suspended all transfers of arms to Israel - there should be no loopholes and no workarounds. It's time to remind our MPs to champion human rights. Email your MP today...

www.amnesty.org.uk

 

[GarveyLives]

But this is how Israel lobby works.

"Pro-Israel lobbyists have donated to 13 out of Labour’s 25 cabinet members since they were first elected to parliament, Declassified can reveal.

The list of recipients includes prime minister Keir Starmer, his deputy Angela Rayner, chancellor Rachel Reeves, foreign secretary David Lammy and home secretary Yvette Cooper.

Jonathan Reynolds, who will oversee arms exports to Israel as UK trade secretary, is another beneficiary, alongside Labour’s election mastermind Pat McFadden, whose responsibilities now include national security ..."

Israel lobby funded half of Keir Starmer’s cabinet

"Over a dozen new MPs accepted funding from pro-Israel lobby groups before they were even elected to parliament.

The donations were provided by the Labour and Conservative Friends of Israel groups, which aim to promote Israel’s interests in Britain but do not disclose their own sources of funding ..."

Israel lobby funded 15 new MPs before election

 

[teqniq]

The usual fucking excuses:

Six Unrwa workers among estimated 18 killed in Israeli strike on Gaza school sheltering displaced

The UN Palestinian refugee agency said the attack on Nuseirat led to the highest death toll among its staff in a single incident

www.theguardian.com

e2a it is the 6th time they have targeted this school:

 

[CNT36]

The usual fucking excuses:

Six Unrwa workers among estimated 18 killed in Israeli strike on Gaza school sheltering displaced

The UN Palestinian refugee agency said the attack on Nuseirat led to the highest death toll among its staff in a single incident

www.theguardian.com

View attachment 442256
e2a it is the 6th time they have targeted this school:
View attachment 442259

They must have missed the command and control centre with the previous five precise strikes.

 

[Gramsci]

Reports of six Unrwa staff members
being killed in an Israeli strike are appalling. My thoughts are with their families and all those who continue to carry out lifesaving work. Aid workers must be able to do their jobs safely. We need a ceasefire and hostage release deal now.

Our pathetic minister for support of Israel David Lammy comment.

Notice no criticism of IDF here. Or Israel.

 

[agricola]

Another fine mess….

IDF investigates claim Jewish Chronicle published stories based on ‘fabricated intelligence’

Israeli military launches inquiry into claims that stories may have been planted as part of disinformation campaign

www.theguardian.com

 

[Wkdloz]

Our pathetic minister for support of Israel David Lammy comment.

Notice no criticism of IDF here. Or Israel.

No doubt anything he says about it has got to be approved by the US.

 

[Duncan2]

No doubt anything he says about it has got to be approved by the US.

Lammy is replacing Blair as the US' poodle of choice.