[Refugees] spoke of relentless pro-Russian propaganda in the occupied lands.
One refugee from the occupied territories, Larysa, told the EBU's Investigative Journalism Network that one of her friends was not provided with insulin for her diabetes - a key part of treatment - until she applied for a Russian passport.
Another friend had to become a Russian citizen to have her broken arm treated, Larysa said.
"Pensions are not provided without Russian passports, food is not provided without Russian passports, and medical services are out of the question. There are lots of checkpoints on the roads. And every time they stop you, they check your documents, and then say they will not let you through without a Russian passport next time."
The Minsk accords come to mind.Russia isn’t asking for a ceasefire for the same it would only benefit the West allowing them to build up and train their forces and have another go
We have people here confidently talking about how many or most Ukrainians are willing to fight to the end, or whatever, rather than accepting a compromise settlement. In one case seemingly based on conversations with Ukrainians in the UK, but it turns out that while they might "want to kill Russians" they aren't people who are actually going to go to the frontline and put own their lives at risk.
And we have the fact that Ukrainian men have been banned from leaving the country with many going to some lengths to escape.
I get it, the desire to believe that the Ukrainian people will do whatever it takes to get the Russians out, and the desire to believe that a victory is somewhere around the corner.
But if this is just wishful thinking, and if it's the thinking that prevails in "the West" then the result is that Ukraine continue to be given support but not too much support. Enough to keep the line in about the same place, not enough to actually do the job. And that just means people killing each other, day after day, month after month, and to no end.
It's what Ukrainian politicians have complained about tbfI think most of the talk on this thread about how willing or not Ukrainians are to fight is speculation based more on what people wanted to believe than anything of real substance.
But I'm also a bit suspicious about the idea that "the West" is giving Ukraine enough support to keep fighting, but not enough to "actually do the job", which is something which seems to have popped up a few times.
The reason I'm suspicious is because it suggests that this is the deliberate policy of "the West", to keep the war and the loss of life on both sides going indefinitely, and this suggestion is as little rooted in substance and as much based on what those making it want to believe as any claims about the willingness or otherwise of Ukrainians to fight.
Well, what do you think it is that determines the amount of support that Ukraine is given?I think most of the talk on this thread about how willing or not Ukrainians are to fight is speculation based more on what people wanted to believe than anything of real substance.
But I'm also a bit suspicious about the idea that "the West" is giving Ukraine enough support to keep fighting, but not enough to "actually do the job", which is something which seems to have popped up a few times.
The reason I'm suspicious is because it suggests that this is the deliberate policy of "the West", to keep the war and the loss of life on both sides going indefinitely, and this suggestion is as little rooted in substance and as much based on what those making it want to believe as any claims about the willingness or otherwise of Ukrainians to fight.
The reason I'm suspicious is because it suggests that this is the deliberate policy of "the West", to keep the war and the loss of life on both sides going indefinitely, and this suggestion is as little rooted in substance and as much based on what those making it want to believe as any claims about the willingness or otherwise of Ukrainians to fight.
What happened to NATO?'The West' is clearly not acting as a single bloc on this. The Ukrainians are scrounging different resources from different countries. Off the top of my head they've had artillery from Germany, planes from the US, drones from Turkey, tanks from Poland etc etc. But nobody outside Ukraine has co-ordinated that. It's all a question of what each country can spare, how much they're invested in a particular outcome, their domestic political situation etc. Poland might have less resources to throw around but also a more pressing reason not to want the Russians to reach Kyiv.
I don't think stalemate suits anyone, I don't think it's something anyone decided to make happen.
We have people here confidently talking about how many or most Ukrainians are willing to fight to the end, or whatever, rather than accepting a compromise settlement. In one case seemingly based on conversations with Ukrainians in the UK, but it turns out that while they might "want to kill Russians" they aren't people who are actually going to go to the frontline and put own their lives at risk.
And we have the fact that Ukrainian men have been banned from leaving the country with many going to some lengths to escape.
I get it, the desire to believe that the Ukrainian people will do whatever it takes to get the Russians out, and the desire to believe that a victory is somewhere around the corner.
But if this is just wishful thinking, and if it's the thinking that prevails in "the West" then the result is that Ukraine continue to be given support but not too much support. Enough to keep the line in about the same place, not enough to actually do the job. And that just means people killing each other, day after day, month after month, and to no end.
"Seemingly" are you intimating that I am a liar?
I see a lot of statements that seem quite confident that the majority of Ukrainians want to keep fighting to the end. But what does that actually mean? Wanting your military to keep fighting is not the same thing as being willing to risk your own life, or those of your friends and family.
For me it means sitting in class with students saying they want to kill Russians.
They actually want to go to the front and kill Russians?
Yes.
Why are they not fighting, are they too young? Who are these students - are they school students? Are they in the UK or Ukraine or somewhere else?
'The West' is clearly not acting as a single bloc on this. The Ukrainians are scrounging different resources from different countries. Off the top of my head they've had artillery from Germany, planes from the US, drones from Turkey, tanks from Poland etc etc. But nobody outside Ukraine has co-ordinated that. It's all a question of what each country can spare, how much they're invested in a particular outcome, their domestic political situation etc. Poland might have less resources to throw around but also a more pressing reason not to want the Russians to reach Kyiv.
I don't think stalemate suits anyone, I don't think it's something anyone decided to make happen.
,"Joe Biden, America’s president, set objectives at the start of Russia’s invasion: to ensure that Ukraine was not defeated and that America was not dragged into confrontation with Russia. This means that arms supplied by the West have been sufficient in sustaining Ukraine in the war, but not enough to allow it to win. "
Ukraine's chief military commander Valery Zaluzhn, speaking three weeks ago. The occupied territory has changed little in 18 months. The They Don't Dare For Us To Win complaint has been around for ages.
Zaluzhn and others clearly want more arms and other support, but just because they want something doesn't mean they should automatically get it, unless you think Biden should do something which would lead to America being dragged into confrontation with Russia or that attempting to avoid such escalation is inherently illegitimate.
The "They Don't Dare For Us to Win" complaint is part of that demand for greater support, greater involvement from the West. It's part of the Ukrainian state's propaganda narrative, but that doesn't mean it's true, so it's disappointing to see that you and others appear to have accepted it uncritically
What is the US's role in these three major conflicts?The US is holding back because there is presently potential for three major conflicts around the world. Its also not helped that Republicans are trying to de-couple overseas funding and ensure Israel gets all it needs but not Ukraine.
For those who missed it, Nikkormat in post #27,598 posted the Rachman review that discussed the 'stalemate'. Which was in part a cue taken from Zaluzhnyi who seems to think a technological edge will be the deciding factor in the conflict.
The guest speaker on Rachman pushed back on the idea of there being a 'stalemate' indicating Europe hasn't supplied the ammunition it promised; Russia has initiated something akin 'total war' mode and the west hasn't woken up to this and Ukraine prioritised mobilising ex-reservists and did this at the expense of providing sufficient military training which has now been rectified. If these are corrected good things will follow.
With Russian elections looming and doubts about the success of the counter-offensive being brought to the surface, Russia is upping its meat waves. This will begin to chip away and I suspect they may make moderate gains everywhere bar the south bank of the Dnipro. For me, even if Ukraine was abandoned, I can't conceive of Ukrainians acquiescing in Russian rule and for that reason we should do all we can to support them. I also can't see how the losses Russia is incurring are sustainable.
Absolutely grim in that this is an article not only whitewashing the OUM and the Waffen-SS Galicia Division but also omitting to mention the role of West Ukrainians who supported the Nazi occupation and used its protection to identify and slaughter the local Jewish population. This article is a great example of the postwar revisionism that began to dominate the Ukrainian diaspora in Canada, the US, the UK and Australia aided and abetted by the Banderites threatening and often killing any rivals or opposition and the US and UK's support for them in the Cold War.This is fucking grim:
Once Again, Russian Tyranny Is Forcing Young Men in Ukraine Toward a Moral Precipice
As Putin drafts soldiers from the country’s occupied east, the author reflects on why his father fought with Germany against the Soviets in WWIInewlinesmag.com
Which conveniently, and dismissively, rules out the agency of the OUN itself ( which is what the article is about) . Even Wikipedia describes it as pursuing 'a strategy of violence, terrorism, and assassinations with the goal of creating an ethnically homogenous and totalitarian Ukrainian state.'First the Russians came and murdered people then the Nazis came and murdered people then the Russians came back.
Ukraine WW2 history is horror on horror.
Between the Nazis and Stalin's Russia slaughter. OUN crimes are barely a drop in the ocean in comparison. Ukraine trying to get big up a resistance movement even one as dodgy as they are is kind of understandble if repellent the more you learn about it.Which conveniently, and dismissively, rules out the agency of the OUN itself ( which is what the article is about) . Even Wikipedia describes it as pursuing 'a strategy of violence, terrorism, and assassinations with the goal of creating an ethnically homogenous and totalitarian Ukrainian state.'