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Ukraine and the Russian invasion, Feb 2022 - tangentially related crap

Not sure how useful these are but somewhat interesting (for me at least as explanation of theoretical possibilities) I've linked to the comments, too but duplicated the map in case it's deleted from reddit.




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eta: interesting comment, what do people think?

At this point the damage to russia is so massive, I'm not sure even a "complete" victory wouldn't be pyrrhic in nature.
They've had basically no new orders for their military hardware (a major export item) in the last year and a half. I'm not talking about stuff that someone might want delivered now. Orders for things like aircraft, tanks, etc, are the sort of thing that you make 5-10 years in advance of when you think you need them.
Europe has been massively pushed towards finding alternative sources of fossil fuels, not to mention shifting towards renewables in a fairly massive way.

Even if russia randomly achieved a total-victory, Finland, Sweden, etc are not just going to go "Oh, now that that's over, I guess we should leave NATO.".

They've lost an absolutely staggering number of people, both in terms of deaths and severe injuries. Twenty years from now on whatever reddit-successor exists, people will be posting on the future r/DataIsBeautiful type locations graphs showing the huge dip in the population charts for russia.

Then there's the economic consequences of all of this. Even if they don't try to rebuild all their stocks of weapons back to pre-war levels (which would take decades at their current war-time production levels), their economy has taken a massive hit on par with named recessions, and it's unlikely that import/export bans will be lifted quickly following a cessation of hostilities (ESPECIALLY if they are allowed to win).

Even just looking at their air travel sector, you can see decades-long consequences. The way that airlines grow is that they lease aircraft for new routes. If after several years, the route seems sustainable and profitable, then they will purchase an aircraft (again, with a lead time of several years before delivery) to directly own it. All of russia's orders from Boeing and Airbus were functionally canceled by government order (even if not literally cancelled, they've been shoved to the back of the many-years-long queue). All those planes they seized at the outset of the war? They will never be allowed to fly to any modern nation, because the maintenance gaps mean no insurance company will issue a policy on the aircraft (not without a maintenance overhaul which will rival the cost of just buying new). And due to that same seizure, no leasing group is going to let russia lease their aircraft without an absolutely crippling set of leasing fees for the next decade or so.

So far all the territory they've temporarily seized from Ukraine has been pummeled into dust and has lost a lot of its economic value. The factories in those areas are completely scrap at this point, not to mention all the skilled laborers at them will have long since left. Sure, there's those various mines (like the big salt mines), but they'll have to completely rebuild the towns/cities that served the workforce in question at ridiculous expense before they can even support such activities.
 
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Novorossiya version most likely IMO - thats basically what it is now

Yet that will be an Afghanistan situation for Russia as it was for the USSR and USA.

btw, Ukraine can't have a Phyrric (sic) victory, defeat = no Ukraine, ergo whatever is left of Ukraine once the scumbags fuck off back to Russia is what they'll have to work with.
 
Explain the similarities?

If the war stops at today's boundaries with Russia claiming parts of Ukraine that the locals don't want to be Russia, the rulers of those areas will face a relentless campaign against their rule, most certainly supported and encouraged by The West. At some point, as the USSR then later the USA found, you have to give up and fuck off.
 
If the war stops at today's boundaries with Russia claiming parts of Ukraine that the locals don't want to be Russia, the rulers of those areas will face a relentless campaign against their rule, most certainly supported and encouraged by The West. At some point, as the USSR then later the USA found, you have to give up and fuck off.
I agree, it will rumble on for decades...though theres more than one possible final outcome..."novorussiyan" areas are the russian speaking areas - thats very unlike the Afghanistan comparison

russian.png
 
I agree, it will rumble on for decades...though theres more than one possible final outcome..."novorussiyan" areas are the russian speaking areas - thats very unlike the Afghanistan comparison

View attachment 435710

I really don't know enough about it, but Russian speaking area seems to be one of Putin's many canards with regards to Ukraine; Zelensky is a Russian speaker, for example, I get the impression he doesn't want to be part of Russia...

The Soviet Union imposed Russian on to Ukraine and the other countries it stomped on, much like England did with Wales. To my mind it counts for fuck all and is just one of the lies the Kremlin puts out to satisfy credulous fools who seem keen on this invasion.
 
Russia has already spent a great deal of time sending the existing residents of novorussya to meat grinder or away from Ukraine and importing new residents
 
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First Russia-China barter trade may come this autumn, sources say
August 8, 2024
MOSCOW, Aug 8 (Reuters) - Russia and China may begin using barter trading schemes, three trade and payments sources told Reuters, with two expecting deals involving agriculture as soon as this autumn, as Moscow and Beijing try to limit using banking systems monitored by the United States.
Bilateral payment delays were high on the agenda when President Vladimir Putin visited China in May and although workarounds have emerged, such as using small, regional Chinese banks whose activities are harder for Washington to detect, payment issues remain.
Barter trading would allow Moscow and Beijing to circumvent payment issues, reduce the visibility Western regulators have over their bilateral transactions, and limit currency risk.
Sanctions are starting to bite?
 
The Soviet Union imposed Russian on to Ukraine and the other countries it stomped on, much like England did with Wales. To my mind it counts for fuck all and is just one of the lies the Kremlin puts out to satisfy credulous fools who seem keen on this invasion.
The suppression of the Ukrainian language goes back a lot further than the Soviet Union.





'However, in the Russian Empire expressions of Ukrainian culture and especially language were repeatedly persecuted for fear that a self-aware Ukrainian nation would threaten the unity of the empire. In 1804 Ukrainian as a subject and language of instruction was banned from schools.[12] In 1811, by order of the Russian government, the Kyiv-Mohyla Academy was closed.'



'During the seven-decade-long Soviet era, the Ukrainian language held the formal position of the principal local language in the Ukrainian SSR.[53] However, practice was often a different story:[53] Ukrainian always had to compete with Russian, and the attitudes of the Soviet leadership towards Ukrainian varied from encouragement and tolerance to de facto banishment.[citation needed]

Officially, there was no state language in the Soviet Union until the very end when it was proclaimed in 1990 that Russian language was the all-Union state language and that the constituent republics had rights to declare additional state languages within their jurisdictions.[54] Still it was implicitly understood in the hopes of minority nations that Ukrainian would be used in the Ukrainian SSR, Uzbek would be used in the Uzbek SSR, and so on.[citation needed] However, Russian was used as the lingua franca in all parts of the Soviet Union and a special term, "a language of inter-ethnic communication", was coined to denote its status.'
 
The suppression of the Ukrainian language goes back a lot further than the Soviet Union.





'However, in the Russian Empire expressions of Ukrainian culture and especially language were repeatedly persecuted for fear that a self-aware Ukrainian nation would threaten the unity of the empire. In 1804 Ukrainian as a subject and language of instruction was banned from schools.[12] In 1811, by order of the Russian government, the Kyiv-Mohyla Academy was closed.'



'During the seven-decade-long Soviet era, the Ukrainian language held the formal position of the principal local language in the Ukrainian SSR.[53] However, practice was often a different story:[53] Ukrainian always had to compete with Russian, and the attitudes of the Soviet leadership towards Ukrainian varied from encouragement and tolerance to de facto banishment.[citation needed]

Officially, there was no state language in the Soviet Union until the very end when it was proclaimed in 1990 that Russian language was the all-Union state language and that the constituent republics had rights to declare additional state languages within their jurisdictions.[54] Still it was implicitly understood in the hopes of minority nations that Ukrainian would be used in the Ukrainian SSR, Uzbek would be used in the Uzbek SSR, and so on.[citation needed] However, Russian was used as the lingua franca in all parts of the Soviet Union and a special term, "a language of inter-ethnr communication", was coined to denote its status.'
At the moment there are three official languages in the sakha republic, formerly yakutia: Russian, sakha/yakut and english
 
Pretty clear that Trump would basically like to abandon support to Ukraine and resume his relationship with his chum

Trump said of the war in Ukraine: “Russia defeated Germany with us, and they defeated Napoleon. You know, they’ve been around a long time. They’re a big fighting force, and it’s very unfair … We’re in a very bad position. And I’m not going to blame, exclusively, but I can tell you, I could have stopped that.”
I should add, this is from his get together with Musk on X platform last night
 
Trump's just outright bullshitting these days.
"I got along with (Russia's President Vladimir) Putin very well, and he respected me," Trump told Musk. "We would talk about Ukraine. It was the apple of his eye. But I told him, don't do it."

"You can't do it, Vladimir. He said 'no way', and I said 'way'," Trump said.

Ha. I thought I dreamt this as it's so ridiculous, but that clip obviously seeped into my dream from the radio this morning (I have radio 4 automatically switch on at 6am).
 
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