Israel's apartheid wall - The Guardian

[rachamim18]

"There are time/date stamps on photos so Rachamim will have to show that Balata was shelled at such and such time.": You think? First off, time/date stamps can be manipulated, or conversely they can just be highly inaccurate.

In addition, it could have been aerial, it could have been "Palestinian" bullshi$ or it could even be from another country. Sadly for you, time/date stamps do not tell a person where a photo was taken. In that any vanadlising is reported post haste by "Palestinians" in order to cadge a cash payout from the Civil Authority, I would imagine that had it been true vandalism on the part of Israelis one would not need me to prove anything.

"Arrested all men between 14 and 60.": WHAT? BULLSHI%. Now you again reveal yourself. We only detain between age 15 and 45. We haerd them into the schoolyard near the main entrance. That is textbook Israeli doctrine so you need to stop that right there. You might also want to remember that in 02 I also took place in the Balta portion of D. Shield as I have said many times and my last deployment was Shechem, although I ran a Checkpoint and have not been in Balata since 05. If there is one thing in which I can call myself an expert it would be that Camp.

"IDF proceeded to vanadlise every home in the Camp for 3 days.": Yeah, right, and it is a Jewish Conspiracy that kept this smoking gun of a story from being plastered on the world's airwaves, right? Got it, thanks for the tip.


"Did Rachamim watch the video?": Yes, I told you that, did I not? 50 soemthing seconds of an APC spending 10 odd seconds prying off a wooden door that was already half off its hinges. OOOOOH, BOMBSHELL!

"The APC had no trouble taking off the door.": So? My dead grandmother could take that door off. It was hanging on its hinge! IF you had ever gone there you would know that we have highly specialised equipment to use for simple jobs like that. Since it was half open they pried it off instead of dismounting, and? International Law fully permits it, so what is your point? You have argued that the APC destroyed the interior which of course it did not.

 

[ymu]

^^That's not the shop we filmed being "kicked in", by the way. The video was taken at one end of the row - the photo above is in the middle of the whole row, after they've all had the same treatment.

 

[rachamim18]

Take a look at your last picture, the interiro of the shoppe. Do you not see the very large opening? Even a D9 cannot do that neat a hole. Do you even realise how small an M113 is? There is a great reason why we sit on benches. then look at the size of your hole. When you are done, look inside the shoope at the damaged fridge.How could the M113 enter the premises and only damage odds and ends? You make no sense, as usual.

 

[ymu]

Ugh. Just got this when trying to access a page ...

You attempted to reach mailman.gush-shalom.org, but instead you actually reached a server identifying itself as *.secured.co.il. This may be caused by a misconfiguration on the server or by something more serious. An attacker on your network could be trying to get you to visit a fake (and potentially harmful) version of mailman.gush-shalom.org. You should not proceed.

Take care guys - Israel leads the world in hacking.

 

[rachamim18]

"The shoppe in the last picture is not the same one as in the video.": OK, but it makes no difference. AGAIN, see the fridge? Then look to the right, there is untouched oven. How do you suppose the APC avoided damaging the oven?

 

[rachamim18]

You simply reached a secured server, do not be so paranoid. As for leading the world in hacking, I do believe that is Russia but I am sure Israel is close since we invented IM technology and most CPUs in current use, etc.

 

[ymu]

Take a look at your last picture, the interiro of the shoppe. Do you not see the very large opening? Even a D9 cannot do that neat a hole. Do you even realise how small an M113 is? There is a great reason why we sit on benches. then look at the size of your hole. When you are done, look inside the shoope at the damaged fridge.How could the M113 enter the premises and only damage odds and ends? You make no sense, as usual.

I have video of a shopfront being demolished by a small Israeli armoured vehicle. There were tanks and bulldozers present also.

But your concern over accurate identification of the vehicle does seem to miss the point. Do you think it's acceptable to do that sort of damage? And don't the soldiers get into an awful lot of trouble when they run up such huge bills, seeing as they make good the damage before leaving (obv)?

 

[ymu]

"Arrested all men between 14 and 60.": WHAT? BULLSHI%. Now you again reveal yourself. We only detain between age 15 and 45. We haerd them into the schoolyard near the main entrance. That is textbook Israeli doctrine so you need to stop that right there. You might also want to remember that in 02 I also took place in the Balta portion of D. Shield as I have said many times and my last deployment was Shechem, although I ran a Checkpoint and have not been in Balata since 05. If there is one thing in which I can call myself an expert it would be that Camp.

There were certainly boys younger than 15 and men older than 45 taken away. I saw one elderly gentleman in a wheelchair and one sprightly grandfather, in a camp that was home to ~20,000 people. But regardless, do you really think it's OK to arbitrarily detain all the men between those ages?

They were taken ~3 miles away, to Askar camp IIRC, and not allowed to return for 3 days.

 

[Grandma Death]

Grandma: "Is Rachamim still standing behind his staement that there is no proof that Israel is at all responsible for most deaths attributed to it in the case of either 'Palestinians' Or foreigners?": YES. I will repeat it: Y-E-S.

So how have the majority of 'foreigners' died then if not by the IDF?

"Provide a link about 'Palestinians' going into kindergartens and killing Jewish toddlers," or riflebutts with toddler brain matter...": I do not have to, as you highlighted, because it is very easily had with a simple search.

Yes I think we've been here before. How much longer are you going to keep hiding behind this rather flimsy excuse? Its simple-make a claim and when asked you should back it up. If its to hand and easy to find then you wont mind quickly providing it would you? Of course I doubt you ever will because your spiel ranges from economical with the truth to downright lies.

Thats pretty bloody obvious for most to see.

.

As for your nonsense replying to "Fraction," about speeds of rocks, you are not cute. You are supposed to be an adult. This is an issue that kills people, you might try recognising the gravity of the dynamic. Radar Guns ar elike any other electronic eevice, they can be faulty but speeds have been recorded quite often by many, many, many people. Again, if you doubt me, and that of course is your choice, research the issue. I would prefer you do that anyway.

The difference between the two speeds you quoted (100mph and 120kph) means only one thing-the IDF need to take back their speed guns job lot to their suppliers or you were lying.

Whats it to be Rach?

 

[frogwoman]

Take a look at your last picture, the interiro of the shoppe. Do you not see the very large opening? Even a D9 cannot do that neat a hole. Do you even realise how small an M113 is? There is a great reason why we sit on benches. then look at the size of your hole. When you are done, look inside the shoope at the damaged fridge.How could the M113 enter the premises and only damage odds and ends? You make no sense, as usual.

The shoppe?

verily, the time hath cometh for ye olde rachamime18e to telle us more or shutte uppe

 

[frogwoman]

"The shoppe in the last picture is not the same one as in the video.": OK, but it makes no difference. AGAIN, see the fridge? Then look to the right, there is untouched oven. How do you suppose the APC avoided damaging the oven?

Gadzooks!

 

[nino_savatte]

The shoppe?

verily, the time hath cometh for ye olde rachamime18e to telle us more or shutte uppe

LOLe!

 

[ViolentPanda]

^^That's not the shop we filmed being "kicked in", by the way. The video was taken at one end of the row - the photo above is in the middle of the whole row, after they've all had the same treatment.

Mate, you need to face facts, admit to yourself and everyone else that your photos are fakes, that you don't know what you're talking about, and that only Rachamim ben Ami holds copyright over the truth of what goes on in Israel/Palestine.

Remember: Everyone who doesn't agree with Rachamim is wrong. Rachamim and those few who agree with him are right, even when you have proof otherwise.

 

[rachamim18]

YMU: YMU has a video of an IDF APC smashing a shoppe, tanks and D9s were nearby.": I know you believe that, that much is clear. Has a member of Armoured ever willfuly and carelessly destroyed the privatye property of a "Palestinian?" Sure, no doubt though I have never seen it. I HAVE certainly heard of it, along with the long IDF Prison sentences meted out for it. APCs , at least ours (Strykers would probably be able), are not equipped to do demolition work.

As I told you yesterday, a very few are outfitted for Engineering Companies, which every Brigade has. They can be used as deminers, as ambulances, and a few other things but they are NOT used to demolish buildings. As I told you, M113s, which is what the APC you have shown is, are not work horses. They are death traps that have to carry half a payload worth of sandbags to even deploy in Hot Zones.

We only have 2 APCs that could even do soemthing like that, and even then only when upgraded: The Nagmachon (which is not really up to that type of job) and the Puma, which could easily demolish a 1 story building but rarely used outside of Engineering. We have a new APC coming online later this year, the Nameer, and that will be more than able to take a building down (based on the Mk4).


"Does Rachamim feel its acceptable to this kind of damage?": It depends entirely on the Op. If it is a legitmate Op than certainly, by all means and then some. That is the nature of it. If instead it is routine Admin work, as in Patrols, then of course not and not only would I not find it acceptable, I would do whatever is within my power to stop it and if that is not possible then I would take it up with the proper Super.

The thing is, your video only showe an M113 removing a wooden door. Your second picture, or rather what you say is an entirely different store very near the first one, shows a fridge in terrible condition, and next to it a stove in perfect condition. Do you not imagine that were an APC to ride into that shoppe nothing would be standing? Do you know how much an M113, the lightest of our APCs weighs?


"Do soldiers get into trouble causing so much damage and costing so much money?": It only costs money if the Op was not legitmate OR a soldier fails to act within Guidelines. Certain Guidelines are static, never bending and one of them is the prohibition against defiling a civlian's home regardlesof who that civilian is or is not. IF a soldier makes a mess, and of course it is going to happen from time to time, and the occupant is not satified with the cash payout we almost always leave before exiting, they file suit. A good example would be the family of the Merkaz Yeshiva terrorist who killed 8 Jewish students a couple of months ago.

Defence ordered his family home razed, but we had discontinued what foreigners call Ounative Demolitions in 2005. The dead man's father filed suit and it quickly was bounced up to the High Court (our highest court). He won his case. If a person in that situation can win their case, of course innocent "Palestinians" can also win...and they do, quite often.


However, if we are undertaking a legitmate Op and the domicile or edifice is property of a militant there is no payout, etc.

I have no way of knowing if your photo of a disheveled parlor is even in the so called "WB" let alone "Palestinian." It could be anywhere. However, if it was not a construction demolition (and the furniture and tv tell me of course it was not), that damage could only result from 1 of 3 things: I) Aerial shelling, II) Armour shelling (we do not use artillery as a rule outside of actual war), or III) Mouseholing, the doctrine I very briefly described to you yesterday.

Depending on the building, using a finger could easily cause a great deal of dust and such.

"There were men younger than 15 and older than 45...": the age paramters are what we use for broad sweeps and such, which we often employ in Balata and jenin. Both Camps are rife with militants, Jenin having been formerly known as "Martyr's Capital." However, if Intel offers other tips, or an individual outside the parameter is observed engaging in illegal activity, or soem other similar dynamic, they will certainly be detained.

When 12 year olds stone us we detain them whenever possible, although in street demos this rarely will happen. The same for a 60 year old, or a person in a wheelchair. Sheikh Yassin was in a wheelchair, that has nothing to do with a threat.


BUT, when we enter a Sector and sweep, we only sweep 15 to 45, males only.

"Is it ok to summarily detain everyone within the paramter?": I realise you have no military experience but surely you can understand the nature of Assymetrical Warfare. In addition, it allows for HUMINT and whatnot. Suspected collaborators are Necklaced, but when we interrogate every male within a given group, noone knows who is doing what on the militants' end.

"Men were trucked to another Camp.": That is basic doctrine as well as common sense. You obviously find it unfair, but then you have never had to wonder whether you will ever see your family again, EVERY SINGLE DAY. IF they do not like it, and I imagine none do, they should stop condoning and otherwise engaging in illegal militant activities and its related terrorist actions.

 

[rachamim18]

Grandma: "How have the majority of foreigners died if not by the IDF?": I have already answered that at least 3 times.

"How long will Rachamim hide behind his telling people to do their own research and that facts are easy to find? If it was indeed so easy, he could easily offer a link, etc.": Pretty sad but ok, this ONE TIME I will oblige you. From now on you need to do your own research.

www.palestinefacts.org/pf_1967to1991_terrorism_1970s.php

Be sure to read the following entries, in their chronological order:

I) Nahariya/Avivim School Bus Attack
II) Kiryat Shmona (sic)
III) Ma'alot

Then, if you really care, research the issue and you will find similar atrocities from the decadees before and after, Preceeding the first entry, which took place in 1970 you will find one that took place in 68, and if you go in the other direction you will find one from 1982, among others.

"Disparity in figures for speeds, etc.": IDF equipment is gauged on the metric system, not English measurements. While I have a bit of familiarity with English meansurements from my time in the US, I am not comfortable in it and would have to take time to do the conversion, and obviously since I already know the fact, why would I do that, to appease you? Please, try again.The figure is 120 kmh.

"Was Rach lying?": Were you not the one who asked me when the last IDF soldier died from a stone? It could have been another poster but I believe it was you. As I posted in response in THAT thread, it was in 2005 and he was not the first and sadly probably not the last. Then if you wish to review non-fatal injuries such as the loss of eyes and so on the numbers go into the many hundreds which on a per capita basis is an astronomical figure. I myself have 2 facial scars from it, along with my damage from Lebanon . Unfortunately it is an issue I am all too familiar with as are almost all Infantrymen my age or older.

 

[rachamim18]

Panda: I realise that you are a Professor of Semantics who carries Israel in his heart and who admires deeds upon land and not land itself but perhaps you might acknolwedge the gravity of a situation where people die, as opposed to simply looking for a soapbox. I know that measuring the density and weight of various pieces of gravel take up a great deal of your time but just maybe you will doscover a modicum of humility and take a different tact. I do not think it likely, but still wish for it.

 

[ymu]

"Arrested all men between 14 and 60.": WHAT? BULLSHI%. Now you again reveal yourself. We only detain between age 15 and 45. We haerd them into the schoolyard near the main entrance. That is textbook Israeli doctrine so you need to stop that right there.

"Men were trucked to another Camp.": That is basic doctrine as well as common sense.

Care to explain why in the first quote you claim that the detained men are not removed further than the entrances to their camps, yet in the second trucking them to another camp is "basic doctrine as well as common sense"?

You wouldn't be making it up as you go along, now would you?

 

[rachamim18]

YMU: I never said anything about anyone "not being removed from Camps." I simply related that when we sweep Balata we gather the males in the schoolyard near the main entrance. From there we truck out detainees. Obviously we will not vet detainees in their usual surroundings, for safety reasons as well as interrogation methodology.

"Making it up.": I would suggest that you contact the IDF Press Laison if you have actual questions and wish to corroborate what I say. It does not take a brain surgeon to understand what I posted. It seems to me that you see things in a thoroughly singular way.

 

[nino_savatte]

"Making it up.": I would suggest that you contact the IDF Press Laison if you have actual questions and wish to corroborate what I say. It does not take a brain surgeon to understand what I posted. It seems to me that you see things in a thoroughly singular way.

Not exactly an objective source of information are they? It doesn't take a brain surgeon to understand that all you're concerned about is making noise and posting propaganda.

 

[Grandma Death]

Grandma: "How have the majority of foreigners died if not by the IDF?": I have already answered that at least 3 times.

Sorry I must've missed it. Tell me again please.

"How long will Rachamim hide behind his telling people to do their own research and that facts are easy to find? If it was indeed so easy, he could easily offer a link, etc.": Pretty sad but ok, this ONE TIME I will oblige you. From now on you need to do your own research.

www.palestinefacts.org/pf_1967to1991_terrorism_1970s.php

Be sure to read the following entries, in their chronological order:

I) Nahariya/Avivim School Bus Attack
II) Kiryat Shmona (sic)
III) Ma'alot

Then, if you really care, research the issue and you will find similar atrocities from the decadees before and after, Preceeding the first entry, which took place in 1970 you will find one that took place in 68, and if you go in the other direction you will find one from 1982, among others.

Wow a link! *GD picks himself up off the floor*

Cant seem to find anything in that link that says this:

"Provide a link about 'Palestinians' going into kindergartens and killing Jewish toddlers," or riflebutts with toddler brain matter...":

Which was your claim. So please if you will....can I see this evidence?

"Disparity in figures for speeds, etc.": IDF equipment is gauged on the metric system, not English measurements. While I have a bit of familiarity with English meansurements from my time in the US, I am not comfortable in it and would have to take time to do the conversion, and obviously since I already know the fact, why would I do that, to appease you? Please, try again.The figure is 120 kmh.

So you're admitting then that you have posted incorrect figures?

"Was Rach lying?": Were you not the one who asked me when the last IDF soldier died from a stone?

No.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Panda: I realise that you are a Professor of Semantics who carries Israel in his heart and who admires deeds upon land and not land itself but perhaps you might acknolwedge the gravity of a situation where people die, as opposed to simply looking for a soapbox.

Quoted for posterity.

I know that measuring the density and weight of various pieces of gravel take up a great deal of your time but just maybe you will doscover a modicum of humility and take a different tact. I do not think it likely, but still wish for it.

Wow, a lecture on humility from one of the most intransigently arrogant posters on this board.

Guess what, genius? It doesn't take measurement of gravel (you do realise that there's no such thing as "fist-sized" gravel, don't you? You are supposed to have worked in construction, after all), just a quick check on the specific density of granite local to the area (there's a couple of handy websites on the geology of the region) and a little applied mathematics; about a minute's worth of time.
That's right, a minute. Hardly a "great deal", is it?

 

[rachamim18]

Nino: I would have to be mentally ill to sit here as long as I do and just pull random garbage out of the ether. I know that you most likely limit yourself to those sites that echo your so very narrowed opinion but IF you ever evolve into actually looking for alternative sources of info you just might find mmy views and opinions to not be so out of touch so to speak,

Gradnma: "Surpised Rachamim provided a link but Gradnma still does not see a link about 'Palestinians' entering kindergartens and killing toddlers so please provide one.": Clearly you did not bother to read the proffered link and then you have such a mental block as to why I could not care less about providing you with umpteenth sources?

Try SLOWLY reading the entire link I sourced. You sdhould get it in say, less than 11 times. When you do, be siure to list an apology to me and never again ask me to source something because wasting my time is not soemthing I am particularly keen on.

Want to try this together, holding hands? 3 events, 39 children by
Western standards anyway. Some were 6, in kindergarten. Clear yet? ALL relevant info was in the link so you are just playing games again and what makes it so sickening is that you are doing it with the lives of youngsters.

If you cannot argue your own watered down opinion then at least have the common decency to let children rest in peace. I made a claim. You had the audaicty to ask for proof as if you are unable to simply corroborate via Google, etc. I complied and yet we find you still take issue.

1 event was a school bus, 2nd was a school, 3rd a private home full of children.


Then we can talk about evens like Kuntar smashing a 4 years old's brains with his rifle stock. Or ydo you want a litany of others? THEY ARE CHILD KILLING GARBAGE. End of story.

 

[rachamim18]

PAnda's New obseesion with calculating specific gravities of various rocks." Hey, everyone needs an outlet and deducting your personality from our few but gratifying conversations on old U75 I would say more power to you. If you need some gravel, and can pay for the ship load, let me know. I would be happy to what I cxan.

As for working, no more. Now I sit and take up air, that and help my wife, run our businesses, and try to expand our family. Thanks for caring.

 

[nino_savatte]

Nino: I would have to be mentally ill to sit here as long as I do and just pull random garbage out of the ether. I know that you most likely limit yourself to those sites that echo your so very narrowed opinion but IF you ever evolve into actually looking for alternative sources of info you just might find mmy views and opinions to not be so out of touch so to speak,

So you admit that what you do is "pull random garbage out of the ether"? You are also projecting: you're the one who posts "garbage". You're the one who pollutes this forum with endless propaganda and lies. So before you accuse anyone of being "mentally ill", you should take a good long look in the mirror.

Your "views and opinions" are lies and distortions. As I have said on many occasions, you are not interested in other people's views or opinions.

 

[nino_savatte]

PAnda's New obseesion with calculating specific gravities of various rocks." Hey, everyone needs an outlet and deducting your personality from our few but gratifying conversations on old U75 I would say more power to you. If you need some gravel, and can pay for the ship load, let me know. I would be happy to what I cxan.

As for working, no more. Now I sit and take up air, that and help my wife, run our businesses, and try to expand our family. Thanks for caring.

Oh, do fuck off.

 

[ViolentPanda]

PAnda's New obseesion with calculating specific gravities of various rocks."

If you're enough of a cretin to quantify spending a minute or two finding some basic information and making a basic calculation "an obsession", then you're even more of a dolt than I originally thought.

Hey, everyone needs an outlet and deducting your personality from our few but gratifying conversations on old U75 I would say more power to you. If you need some gravel, and can pay for the ship load, let me know. I would be happy to what I cxan.

If you want to make me happy then you could occasionally make an attempt at intellectual honesty.

As for working, no more. Now I sit and take up air, that and help my wife, run our businesses, and try to expand our family. Thanks for caring.

I said that "you are supposed to have worked". That's past tense.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Oh, do fuck off.

Amazing how he can construct an "obsession" out of the work of a few minutes, isn't it?
And this is the guy who claims to never use straw men or ad hominem[/] arguments, too!

 

[DexterTCN]

....just maybe you will doscover a modicum of humility and take a different tact. I do not think it likely, but still wish for it.

 

[rachamim18]

Nino: "So, Rachamim is admitting that he merely pulls things ouf of the ether as opposed to actual facts.": Slipping kid, really slipping. Tune up that prescription, you are beginning to regree.


The rest were insults and expletives which is your soup de jour. Been there, done that, excuse me for being just a tad bit more non-plussed about your latest fall from grace.

Adjuant Professor Panda III: Keep up the good fight. The thought is what counts .

 

[Grandma Death]

Gradnma: "Surpised Rachamim provided a link but Gradnma still does not see a link about 'Palestinians' entering kindergartens and killing toddlers so please provide one.":

You see this constant (and lets face it deliberate) misquoting is what gets peoples backs up. I asked you for evidence contained within that link of YOUR quote:

"Provide a link about 'Palestinians' going into kindergartens and killing Jewish toddlers," or riflebutts with toddler brain matter..."

Now here are the ENTIRE contents of the link you provided:

What happened at Ma'alot, Kiryat Shmona, and other terrorist targets in the 1970s?

The decade of the 1970s witnessed a series of horrific terrorist attacks against Israel as the Palestinian Liberation Organization (PLO) carried out its war of terror against Israel. A common theme was terrorist attacks after infiltrating from Lebanon, then the PLO base, attacks that eventually led to Israel's invasion of Lebanon in 1978.
Nahariya/Avivim School Bus Attack, 1970

On May 8, 1970 there was a brutal attack on an Israeli school bus by Palestinian terrorists who crossed the Lebanese border.

Avivim, an agricultural community established in 1963, is just metres from the border with Lebanon. Settled and built from the ground up by Moroccan immigrants, the majority of the residents belonged to one of two families; Peretz or Biton. The local council bus picked up children each morning to take them to two schools.

The terrorists knew the schedule of the bus and were able to ambush it. They fired on the bus, killing the adults instantly. The bus driver continued until he himself was shot. Then the bus crashed, injuring many of the remaining children. The attack caused the death of 9 children (aged between six and nine) and 3 adults, and left 19 others crippled for life.

The terrorists were never apprehended.
Lod Airport Massacre, 1972

On May 30, 1972, a three-man hit squad from the Japanese Red Army attacked civilians at the Lod Airport in Tel Aviv, Israel in an operation planned and supported by the General Command of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP-GC). Twenty-six people were killed in the massacre and 78 were injured.
Yom Kippur War, 1973

In October 1973, the terrorists were upstaged by the outbreak of war when the forces of Egypt and Syria invaded Israel with a surprise attack on Yom Kippur. The end of the Yom Kippur War was not the end of hostilities between Israel and its neighbors. While formal warfare between opposing armies stopped with the cease-fire in 1973, terrorist attacks increased during the rest of the decade, a few of the most egregious attacks described here.
Kiryat Shmona (or Quirat Shemona), 1974

On April 11, 1974, a team of three members of the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine General Command penetrated the Israeli border town of Kiryat Shmona from Lebanon. Although they had apparently been instructed to take hostages, they instead entered an apartment building and killed all eighteen residents they found there, including nine children. The terrorists then barricaded themselves in one of the apartments and were eventually killed in an exchange of fire with Israeli forces.
Ma'alot (or Maalot), 1974

The beautiful northern Israel town of Ma'alot is located in the Western Galilee, 20 km east of Nahariya, and less than an hour's drive from Haifa. Ma'alot was founded in the 1950s when hundreds of thousands of immigrants came to Israel from North Africa, refugees from hostile Arab nations where they were no longer safe. The Israeli Government at that time decided to place new immigrants in development towns such as Ma'alot.

On May 15, 1974 (Israel's Independence Day) a group of 11th grade students from Safed (Tsfat) were on a field trip to the Golan, a full day of hikes. That night, the children were housed at a school in Ma’alot where they slept on the floor. During the night, three Arab terrorists dressed as IDF soldiers attacked the school, killing the guard and some of the children. Some of the children escaped by jumping out of a window on the second floor and the rest were held as hostages.

In the morning the terrorists were identified as members of the Democratic Front for the Liberation of Palestine (DFLP) who had infiltrated from Lebanon. The DFLP is a Marxist-Leninist and formerly pro-Soviet group that split from the Popular Font for the Liberation of Palestine (PFLP) in 1969. They presented their demands: release Arab terrorists from Israeli prisons, or they will start to kill the children. The deadline was set at 6:00PM the same day.

The Knesset met in emergency session. Although Israel’s policy forbid negotiation with terrorists, the plight of the children forced an exception. By 3:00PM a decision was reached to negotiate, but the terrorists refused a request for more time.

At 5:45PM a unit of the elite Golani brigade stormed the building. All of the terrorists were killed in the assault, but not before they took the lives of 21 children. There were a total of 26 victims, including several people murdered by the terrorists on their way to the school the night before.

In Beirut, eloquent demonstrations honoring the fallen fedayeen as noble martyrs of the cause were ordered by Nayef Hawatmeh, the DFLP leader.
Tel Aviv Savoy Hotel, 1975

On March 5, 1975 eight PLO terrorists arrived in Tel Aviv, coming by sea in a rubber dinghy, and landing without being spotted. They entered the Savoy Hotel and took dozens of hostages including a Dutch boy, 15, two Swiss, a Somali, and several Israelis. The terrorists barricaded themselves in the top floor of the hotel with the hostages.

Azmi Zrayir, a hero of the PLO, and Abu Jihad, one of the founders of "Black September", have been linked to this attack as organizers.

The terrorists demanded the release of their followers from Israeli jails. Israel Defense Forces started a rescue mission in the afternoon. Three IDF soldiers were killed and eight hostages wounded during the operation. At the end of the battle, the terrorists retreated to a room and blew themselves up when the commandos broke in. Seven terrorists were killed and one captured. Eight hostages were murdered and 11 wounded by the terrorists.
Bus Hijacking on Coastal Road, 1978

On March 11, 1978 eleven terrorists, again coming from Lebanon with Zoadic rubber commando dinghies, landed at the beach of Kibbutz Ma’agan Michael. They killed an American photographer and a taxi driver and hijacked a bus, whose passengers, including many children, were on a day-trip to the north. The hijackers forced the driver to return to Tel Aviv. Driving on the coastal highway, the terrorists fired on passing cars from the bus.

When the bus approached a blockade set up by the police at an entrance to Tel Aviv, a shootout took place. The terrorists left the bus and fired missiles. The bus burst into flames and most of the passengers were either burned alive or killed by terrorist gunfire.

The massacre left 35 innocent people dead and 100 injured. The terrorists were identified as belonging to Fatah; nine were killed and two captured.

Now please stop arguing the toss and provide me with evidence contained within that link of:

"Provide a link about 'Palestinians' going into kindergartens and killing Jewish toddlers," or riflebutts with toddler brain matter..."

I'm not interested in anything else but evidence of the above. You've provided a link and from what I can read its devoid of your claim.

Some were 6, in kindergarten. Clear yet?

Nowhere near clear. Show me in that link where exactly did it say a kindergarten was attacked and some of the children attacked were 6?

ALL relevant info was in the link so you are just playing games again and what makes it so sickening is that you are doing it with the lives of youngsters.

Please spare me the speech You've made a very SPECIFIC claim so away with your flowery language and prove to me within that link where a kindergarten was attacked and in that kindergarten there were children as young as 6 killed. More importantly there appears to be no mentioned of toddlers brains on rifle butts as you suggested there was?

You see Rach this isn't about hair splitting. I don't doubt for one minute children have been killed on both sides in this conflict. What I question is the way you twist words to fit your own agenda. The way you take different components of history and put them together and present them as 'facts' when, the reality is, upon close scrutiny your lies are as transparent as you are.