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Ukraine and the Russian invasion, 2022-24

www.ifw-kiel.de

Ukraine Support Tracker: Europe clearly overtakes US, with total commitments now twice as large

Europe has clearly overtaken the United States in promised aid to Ukraine, with total European commitments now being twice as large. A main reason is the EU’s new €50 billion “Ukraine Facility,” but also other European countries have upped their support with new multi-year packages. For the...
www.ifw-kiel.de www.ifw-kiel.de

Support to Ukraine from Europe is now more than twice as high as US support. $70 billion to $156 billion.

This is good as it reduces the risk to Europe caused by the possibility of a Republican victory in the next US election.
 
Rimbaud said:
www.ifw-kiel.de

Ukraine Support Tracker: Europe clearly overtakes US, with total commitments now twice as large

Europe has clearly overtaken the United States in promised aid to Ukraine, with total European commitments now being twice as large. A main reason is the EU’s new €50 billion “Ukraine Facility,” but also other European countries have upped their support with new multi-year packages. For the...
www.ifw-kiel.de www.ifw-kiel.de

Support to Ukraine from Europe is now more than twice as high as US support. $70 billion to $156 billion.

This is good as it reduces the risk to Europe caused by the possibility of a Republican victory in the next US election.
Click to expand...

I think that's focusing on financial aid? Which is very important, but not just weapons.

It does mention weapons, but I don't think that's what the stats are.
 
It's a good thing, but there's still the issue of the reliance on the originator state giving permission for the buying state topass X or Y on to a third state.

Now, this is something the UK uses to make life hard for its potential adversaries - so Argentina for example, and there we think it's great, because for the last 40 years it's meant that the Argentine Air Force has been on the bones of its arse with the UK expending nothing more than a shake of the head - the problem that Europe has is that many of the systems we want to transfer to Ukraine are either US in origin, or have US components.

If Trump wins, I fully expect him to not just stop US deliveries, but to ban the transfer of US originated systems, and probably those European systems with US components.

This is where Macrons' phrase 'strategic autonomy' rears its head, but as we've seen, 'Europe' isn't always a team player on Ukraine, so we've seen Germany and Switzerland (and probably, less publicly, others as well) decide to withhold permission for second states to export this or that to Ukraine.

It's a reminder that if you want to be on control of something, you need to do it yourself.
 
UnderOpenSky said:
I think that's focusing on financial aid? Which is very important, but not just weapons.

It does mention weapons, but I don't think that's what the stats are.
Click to expand...
www.ifw-kiel.de

Ukraine Support Tracker - A Database of Military, Financial and Humanitarian Aid to Ukraine

The Ukraine Support Tracker lists and quantifies military, financial and humanitarian aid promised by governments to Ukraine.
www.ifw-kiel.de www.ifw-kiel.de

You can filter by military aid here.

I haven't added it all up but it looks close. US is the largest with 42billion in support, followed by Germany with 17 billion. Adding together Germany, Norway, UK, Denmark, Netherlands, Sweden Poland as well as EU institutions looks similar to US total.
 
ska invita said:
Good... Weapons are not aid
Click to expand...
We could get all semantic and define "aid" as something which doesn't involve weapons.

But if a country - as Russia has often done - uses, say, food shortage as a weapon, then providing food aid is essentially providing a countermeasure to that weapon, and that doesn't - in my mind - make it so very different from providing actual weapons to defend against a country using invasion, torture, rape, and attacks on civilians as their "weapon".

I don't think we can necessarily draw a hard line between non-kinetic aid, and the kind that goes bang.
 
LDC said:
Ideology leading the field ahead of everything else again I see.

Reminds me of Brass Eye a bit.

Click to expand...

Id hope the cost of UK sending weapons isn't coming out of the UK's international aid budget, which should as the name suggest be for humanitarian aid, it should be coming out of the ministry of wars budget. If it is being paid for from the aid budget that's really shit
 
More here -

news.sky.com

Ukraine strikes Russian submarine and landing ship in audacious assault on Crimea naval base

British Storm Shadow missiles may have been used in the assault, while Ukraine's military said its forces had struck naval targets and port infrastructure in Sevastopol.
news.sky.com news.sky.com

If confirmed, it would be the first known successful attack against a Russian submarine of the war.

Offering further detail, Ukraine's military said its forces had struck naval targets and port infrastructure in the bay of the Crimean port of Sevastopol.

Russia's defence ministry said Ukraine had launched 10 missiles and three speedboat attacks on the port.

Seven of the missiles were intercepted and all three boats destroyed, it said in a statement on its Telegram channel.
Click to expand...
 
ska invita said:
Id hope the cost of UK sending weapons isn't coming out of the UK's international aid budget, which should as the name suggest be for humanitarian aid, it should be coming out of the ministry of wars budget. If it is being paid for from the aid budget that's really shit
Click to expand...
I half thought that there was a special , and pooled , Ukraine budget but now you have raised the point ?
 
LDC said:
UK aid to Ukraine Commons docs:

Click to expand...

I browsed that earlier but was put off by having to dig through a myriad of other documents. The UK ODA report for 2022 does say that an additional 2.5 billion was announced for Ukraine and Afghanistan and also reports on the freezing of non essential aid ( due to overspend ) to a number of countries including Ukraine . I certainly can't be arsed to go accounts reading tbh.

​

 
kebabking said:
It's a good thing, but there's still the issue of the reliance on the originator state giving permission for the buying state topass X or Y on to a third state.

Now, this is something the UK uses to make life hard for its potential adversaries - so Argentina for example, and there we think it's great, because for the last 40 years it's meant that the Argentine Air Force has been on the bones of its arse with the UK expending nothing more than a shake of the head - the problem that Europe has is that many of the systems we want to transfer to Ukraine are either US in origin, or have US components.

If Trump wins, I fully expect him to not just stop US deliveries, but to ban the transfer of US originated systems, and probably those European systems with US components.

This is where Macrons' phrase 'strategic autonomy' rears its head, but as we've seen, 'Europe' isn't always a team player on Ukraine, so we've seen Germany and Switzerland (and probably, less publicly, others as well) decide to withhold permission for second states to export this or that to Ukraine.

It's a reminder that if you want to be on control of something, you need to do it yourself.
Click to expand...
Having worked with Dassault lol
 
tim said:
Any insights into the British volunteerwho has been murdered. The news reports don't seem to suggest that he was a prisoner of war who was slaughtered, so my assumption is that he must have upset somebody within the Ukrainian forces.


www.google.com

Former British soldier fighting in Ukraine found dead with hands tied

Jordan Chadwick, 31, who served in Scots Guards, had ‘passion to support freedom’, his mother says
www.google.com www.google.com
Click to expand...

Telegraph article on the death of another British combatant speculates both murdered by other foreign fighters

www.telegraph.co.uk

Death and disappearance of British volunteers in Ukraine exposes rivalry in foreign legion

Comrades fear two men may have been killed not by Russians but by fellow foreign soldiers
www.telegraph.co.uk www.telegraph.co.uk
 
Yossarian said:
17 murdered, 32 injured in attack on market in Ukrainian city - maybe one of the stalls had military significance?

www.reuters.com

Russian attack kills 17 in east Ukraine as Blinken visits Kyiv, officials say

At least 17 people were killed and 32 wounded in a Russian attack on a crowded market in the eastern Ukrainian city of Kostiantynivka on Wednesday as U.S. Secretary of State Antony Blinken visited Kyiv, Ukrainian officials said.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com
Click to expand...
editor said:
It's just a regular market attacked by a missile sent by war criminals. Fuck Russia.

Click to expand...

Quite a few people immediately after that footage was released pointed out the reflection of the missile on a car roof suggested it was fired from the west, therefore by the AFU. NYT has investigated and tend towards the same conclusion (although a "mishap" rather than the "false flag" narrative being peddled by the usual suspects).


www.nytimes.com

Evidence Suggests Ukrainian Missile Caused Market Tragedy (Published 2023)

Witness accounts and an analysis of video and weapon fragments suggest a Ukrainian missile failed to hit its intended target and landed in a bustling street, with devastating consequences.
www.nytimes.com www.nytimes.com
 
Bahnhof Strasse said:
Rostov-on-Don submarine…

View attachment 392142



T-cut and a buffing cloth…
Click to expand...
The "Minsk" in the next dry dock over is in a similar condition ... as in probably scrap.

Being somewhat nasty-minded, IF I had control of a couple more missiles, I would wait until some time later when either the dry docks are being cleared of the scrap or repairs are under way and then give the lock gates a similar "love pat" ... clearing underwater debris is much harder.

(In a similar vein, I would also be expending a few more drones / missiles / marine drones on smacking the various bridges & their ferry / pontoon counterparts - and Chondar & Kerch in particular).
 
StoneRoad said:
The "Minsk" in the next dry dock over is in a similar condition ... as in probably scrap.

Being somewhat nasty-minded, IF I had control of a couple more missiles, I would wait until some time later when either the dry docks are being cleared of the scrap or repairs are under way and then give the lock gates a similar "love pat" ... clearing underwater debris is much harder.

(In a similar vein, I would also be expending a few more drones / missiles / marine drones on smacking the various bridges & their ferry / pontoon counterparts - and Chondar & Kerch in particular).
Click to expand...
Drive to Ukraine and join up?
 
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