Ukraine and the Russian invasion, 2022-24

[Dogsauce]

Regarding the dam, these are some of the effects. This is not something Ukraine would logically do to itself.
(From Twitter)

as reported by the Ministry of Agrarian Policy and Food, the destruction of this dam has resulted in 94% of the irrigation systems in the Kherson region, 74% in the Zaporizhia region, and 30% in the Dnipropetrovsk region being deprived of a water source. (…). The consequences of this disaster will have a lasting impact on the Ukrainian people and nations that rely on Ukrainian food supplies for their food security in the years to come.

 

[The39thStep]

God knows but as it's out there here's something else to throw in the mix of who dunnits

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/06/06/nord-stream-pipeline-explosion-ukraine-russia/

 

[Ming]

I don't think sweeping your enemy away is as much a goal as causing them to divert huge amounts of resources to prevent and repair fuckloads of flood damage that would otherwise be employed on a military counter-offensive.

And it makes the Ukrainians' much vaunted counter offensive look a bit shit. It'll also play badly politically in the countries supplying support (especially in the US). This was a predictable option for the Russians though.

 

[Dogsauce]

They’re like Leeds United of yore, play dirty, everybody hates us, we don’t care. There’s Duma politicians smirking and laughing about the dam collapse on their political TV shows.

 

[teqniq]

 

[FabricLiveBaby!]

Post from my Russian friend here in Poland (and his fellow russians and Ukraininas) all reckon it was Russia that did it. Google translated post follows:

How dumb and petty bastards do you have to be to blow up the Kakhov HPP

Flooding territories, no matter whether your own or someone else's, heroically sink your own fleet, burn your capital and nightmare your own people so that others are afraid. That's what Russian Heritage is.
Strategically, and tactically, meaningless action, but it looks large-scale and insane.
It is quite obvious that the decision was made by Putler personally at the general staff meeting. And it was done for the sole purpose "Look how beaten we are, be afraid and surrender". But the effect is reversed. No one plunges into the logic of the gopnik anymore and follows him. Already got enough of the anger. They just give it an impudent slap, because it is obvious to everyone that this gopnik is the most cowardly creature.
Ukraine will win, return its territories and gain freedom, and the Russians will either plunge into the North Korea again, or will be worse than the Germans apologizing many generations ahead. Most likely the first one. Why did they need it they don't know, the only thing cemented in their minds for centuries is "didn't live well, shouldn't have started".
There will be no beautiful Russia of the future. This is the kind of "material". They only know how to and love to cause pain and destruction. Grandfathers killed, are killing and will kill.
If you don’t hit the face thoroughly.

The comments are choice. I've actually started teaching loads of Russians, Belarussians and Ukrainians since it all kicked off (so many came to Poland) and the one thing they all seem to have in common is they fucking hate Putler (as they call him).

 

[teqniq]

Prigozhin holds forth again:

 

[Pickman's model]

They’re like Leeds United of yore, play dirty, everybody hates us, we don’t care. There’s Duma politicians smirking and laughing about the dam collapse on their political TV shows.

Say what you like about Leeds United but they never flooded pitches

 

[Pickman's model]

Regarding the dam, these are some of the effects. This is not something Ukraine would logically do to itself.
(From Twitter)

Haven't we mentioned that logic has no place in war? Maybe dial down the rationality during this irrational period

 

[StoneRoad]

Say what you like about Leeds United but they never flooded pitches

no but they did let Ronnie Barker / David Jason pretend to have buried treasure [stolen money] under the centre circle ...
[that bit in porridge still makes me chortle]

/derail

 

[AverageJoe]

Say what you like about Leeds United but they never flooded pitches

<insert obligatory "so they could bring their subs on" joke here>

 

[StoneRoad]

After the Kahkovka reservoir has drained - how fully that will be depends on how deep the hole in the dam the explosion/collapse caused, plus subsequent scouring, the flood waters covering the delta / flood plain will drain away [eventually].
Summer weather will dry out the mess - so any "advantage" will be somewhat temporary but the environmental consequences will last longer - not to mention all the mines which will get moved around ...

Amphibious landings usually refer to crossing water - I wonder if there is a mud crossing alternative technique ?
Hovercraft tanks ?
Pontoon bridges are very vulnerable to counter-fire, as would a causeway ...

 

[The39thStep]

Post from my Russian friend here in Poland (and his fellow russians and Ukraininas) all reckon it was Russia that did it. Google translated post follows:



The comments are choice. I've actually started teaching loads of Russians, Belarussians and Ukrainians since it all kicked off (so many came to Poland) and the one thing they all seem to have in common is they fucking hate Putler (as they call him).

Funnily enough, I was reading something about gopniks the other week

 

[Pickman's model]

After the Kahkovka reservoir has drained - how fully that will be depends on how deep the hole in the dam the explosion/collapse caused, plus subsequent scouring, the flood waters covering the delta / flood plain will drain away [eventually].
Summer weather will dry out the mess - so any "advantage" will be somewhat temporary but the environmental consequences will last longer - not to mention all the mines which will get moved around ...

Amphibious landings usually refer to crossing water - I wonder if there is a mud crossing alternative technique ?
Hovercraft tanks ?
Pontoon bridges are very vulnerable to counter-fire, as would a causeway ...

The russians have a range of military hovercraft eg Russia's Zubr-class: Meet the world's largest hovercraft

 

[UnderOpenSky]

The russians have a range of military hovercraft eg Russia's Zubr-class: Meet the world's largest hovercraft

I wonder how many work?

 

[DaveCinzano]

The russians have a range of military hovercraft eg Russia's Zubr-class: Meet the world's largest hovercraft

So did the Ukrainian Navy before decommissioning its ones last millennium

 

[nogojones]

I wonder how many work?

Wiki says Russia has two. It doesn't say if either passed its MOT this year

 

[DaveCinzano]

Wiki says Russia has two. It doesn't say if either passed its MOT this year

They could maybe borrow some bits from Greece, China or, um, Ukraine

 

[planetgeli]

Say what you like about Leeds United but they never flooded pitches

Oh really?

Leeds United Series: Don Revie and His Dirty Football

“Before match against Real Zaragoza, Don Revie had asked the local fire brigade to flood the Elland Road Pitch to make the Spaniards…

haekal-nashville.medium.com

The Don Revie controversy was also captured in 1966 European Fair Cup’s semi-final against Real Zaragoza. Prior to the second leg against Real Zaragoza, Revie had tried to obtain an advantage by asking the local fire brigade to flood the Elland Road Pitch, reasoning the Spaniards would struggle with boggy conditions. It backfired; Leeds United fell three goals behind inside 11 minutes and was eliminated from the tournament.

 

[_Russ_]

Its heartbreaking, all those animals ...meanwhile in the Capital

 

[steveo87]

They’re like Leeds United of yore, play dirty, everybody hates us, we don’t care. There’s Duma politicians smirking and laughing about the dam collapse on their political TV shows.

I'm going to use that analogy next time someone wants the Ukraine War summed up in 'football terms'.

 

[teqniq]

Unrolled thread from Aric Toler of Bellingcat regarding the dam- looks most likely to be the Russians but added to that is the possibility that it was stupidity on their part.

Thread by @AricToler on Thread Reader App

@AricToler: The tweets are pretty specific, saying that the explosion happened at 2:35am. However, nothing from local channels yet. t.me/romanov_92/388… This was two hours ago, so the fact that it's news isolated to...…

threadreaderapp.com

 

[Flavour]

lots of people spending the night on their roofs in towns around Oleshky and along the banks of the river -- no rescue in sight. if the water level does not descend they will die

 

[FabricLiveBaby!]

lots of people spending the night on their roofs in towns around Oleshky and along the banks of the river -- no rescue in sight. if the water level does not descend they will die

Sad to say but this is classic Russia.

 

[FabricLiveBaby!]

If it's Russia, occupational territory rescue will not bother, because population replacement has and always will be Muscvoy's game.

It's an absolute distaster that will be (and is) twenty times worse than Mariopul. Not just the humanitarian crises, but also the ecological disaster.

I worry, that after this, only zaphiroziza nuke plant can be next. And Ukraine have been warning that's the next thing to go big bada boom.

As much as I hate NATO, if I were world king I would be making noises about sending in humanitarian aid about now... Cuz these cunts just won't stop until they murder everything in sight.

 

[Artaxerxes]

If it's Russia, occupational territory rescue will not bother, because population replacement has and always will be Muscvoy's game.

It's an absolute distaster that will be (and is) twenty times worse than Mariopul. Not just the humanitarian crises, but also the ecological disaster.

I worry, that after this, only zaphiroziza nuke plant can be next. And Ukraine have been warning that's the next thing to go big bada boom.

As much as I hate NATO, if I were world king I would be making noises about sending in humanitarian aid about now... Cuz these cunts just won't stop until they murder everything in sight.

I’ve already seen tweets saying that Russia has taken all the boats on their side of the river

 

[Kaka Tim]

in terms or long term devastation, destruction and the human cost its pretty much up there with dropping a nuke.
^ good point about international humantiarian aid. absolutely needs to happen and dare putin to try and stop it. Might stop the cunt bombing the people fleeing the flood.

 

[editor]

The BBC report today said that the Russians were still shelling the flooded towns.

 

[RedRedRose]

I have read assertions that Ukrainian shelling was insufficient to destroy the dam. At the same time, we also know the Russians mined the area. Is there any chance, unwittingly, the two sides could have damaged it together?

I guess there are 6 possible scenarios
1. Russians deliberately
2. Russians accidentally
3. Combination, but mainly natural causes / wear-and-tear
4. Ukrainians deliberately
5. Ukrainians accidentally
6. Combination Rus / Ukr accidentally

The most plausible explanation seems to be 2, followed by 6, then followed by 3. Either way, you could argue, as the occupying power Russia is more culpable for 3 and 6, especially as they should be maintaining the dam and they also employed explosives to a vulnerable infrastructure.

 

[xenon]

It’s not really accidental if you rig something with explosives and then it blows up.