Ukraine and the Russian invasion, 2022-24
- Thread starter kebabking
- Start date
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
Give Putin everything he asks for as they are naturally in his, sorry Russia's, sphere of influence, apologise and pay reparations for daring to resist. Detain anyone who opposed Russian policy. Bake a lovely cake that reads ' Vlad, protector of the working classes'....
Spandex
A crazy bulbous punchbag of sound
Is that all you see in the post you quote? That's your whole take away? PROPAGANDA!
No interest in what is going on in Ukraine. No horror at a huge loss of life - Russian and no doubt Ukrainian. Just some which side are you on? internet debate mithering to pass the time.
This isn't a big story. I saw it mentioned in passing and did some looking around and was sickened by this minor detail in the war. A huge battle with thousands killed. Mostly a paragraph here and there. That it's happening doesn't seem to be in doubt. Yes, there's some crowing about HUGE RUSSIAN LOSSES in the pro-Ukraine media. There's some head shaking and grumbling amongst pro-Russian military bloggers. An 'it's all fine' comment from Putin. It'll be a minor footnote in the war, forgotten about by most people soon enough, if they ever noticed it. Thousands of people killed.
TopCat
Putin fanboy
You open your wee mouth and all this shite flows out.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
this is like getting directions in the country, 'i wouldn't start from here!'
TopCat
Putin fanboy
You don’t know my mindset. I think this war is pure horror and want it to end soon and with no repetition.
How does the war possibly end though? Russian regime change is a delusional fantasy. With all the western weapons the Ukrainians have not advanced. Soldiers and civilians getting killed and maimed every day.
How do you see a path to a peace? How would it be achieved?
Spandex
A crazy bulbous punchbag of sound
I don't see a path to peace any time soon. The West gets bored supporting Ukraine? The forecast Russian offensive takes enough territory for Putin to declare victory and the West say that's enough to Ukraine? Russian losses get too big to continue and it grinds to a halt, unsatisfactory for everyone, ready to start up again in the future? it all kicks off into a major international war? Heroic Volodymyr leads his troops to southern tip of Crimea and everyone lives hapily ever after? Who knows.
I was just highlighting this huge battle and massive loss of life as a horror of the war. Not looking to get into a pointless Yay Goodies! Boo Badies! argument.
Chz
Stark Raving Sane
I'm rather surprised there aren't more "advisors" on the ground in UKR, given past form of both the Russians and the Americans. At least we don't have a 21st century MacArthur gagging to nuke everyone.
Reminds me, and totally random direction, there's a guy on HMS Belfast who gives a great info piece on the Korean War that really gets into the hows and whys and politics of it rather than just "Belfast delivered 3500 tons of shells on target". I mean there's that too. It all starts with "Some of this will seem very familiar to you, even if you know nothing about the Korean War..."
Reminds me, and totally random direction, there's a guy on HMS Belfast who gives a great info piece on the Korean War that really gets into the hows and whys and politics of it rather than just "Belfast delivered 3500 tons of shells on target". I mean there's that too. It all starts with "Some of this will seem very familiar to you, even if you know nothing about the Korean War..."
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
Top debating Skillz. Socratic almost.
TopCat
Putin fanboy
Well stop misquoting people and making shite up then you prat.
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
I see your poster identification skilz are at a similar level to your ability to construct a coherent argument ones.
Cool.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
TopCat
Putin fanboy
I was responding to you. Come on, you are an adult, advance your argument with less make it up and ascribe to an opponent.
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
Sorry, I recognise each individual word but frankly have no idea what this means.....
strung out
💩 🤣 🍆 💦 🧐 👻 🐝 🐈⬛
They haven't launched any offensives recently, so it's no wonder they haven't advanced.
Chz
Stark Raving Sane
Yeah but MacArthur meant it. But at least he could get fired from the job, unlike Vlad.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
he's saying don't attribute to him views he has not expressed
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
Why am I not surprised?
FWIW, his job is to ask for the moon. He'd be a fool to himself, and his nation, if he wasn't doing that.
The West's job is to decide how much they actually want to support Ukraine, no doubt short of the highest hopes, and thus strike some kind of balance between what they're asking for, and what we can actually give.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
his usual job is making people laugh. he's not making them laugh now.
Crispy
The following psytrance is baṉned: All
The conditions for a Ukrainian advance into Donbas or Melitopol are not yet met. The Kharkiv advance was "easy" as the Russians had no defence in depth. Once through the first line, they could motor through and roll them up right back across the Oskil river, with relatively lightweight vehicles. The current frontline is much better defended and supplied in the rear, so needs better vehicles. This means things like the American Bradleys (looks like a tank but carries infantry) and actual tanks like the Leopards. Sufficient numbers of these are not all in the country yet. The second condition is the state of the ground. The winter has been relatively warm, so much of the ground is still muddy, or thaws/freezes unpredictably. The ground needs to either freeze properly, or the spring mud season needs to pass. Otherwise any advance is constrained to roads and therefore vulnerable to ambush.
This summer will prove whether all this Western heavy infantry equipment is enough to win the war. If Ukraine can pull off a successful mobile advance, I suspect more vehicles (and other things like long range missiles) will continue to flow, and the chances are higher that they can restore their borders. If it fails, I odubt there will be much appetite for a second attempt and you'll start to see some calls for "compromise".
It looks like Russia are going to attempt a counter of their own before then. They have the men for the "human wave" tactics demonstrated at Bakhmut, but do they have the tactical/logistical ability for a mobile advance? The results of the intitial invasion says no. Maybe they have learned?
Either way, the war will be tipping decisively one way or the other by the end of the year.
______________________________________________________
Oh yes, it's a very comfy armchair; why do you ask?
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UnderOpenSky
baseline neural therapy
They aren't advancing because there's been a massive reluctance to give them tools to do so. Which might slowly be changing, but still no where near in the quantities they need.
Some people might argue this is deliberate so Russia exhausts itself.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
i think Crispy has it more right, that the mud's rather an obstacle. the ukrainians have been given a vast quantity of weapons, tanks, artillery, missiles, rockets etc etc etc, it's very far from your assertion they've been left high and dry
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
TBF, I think he's done all right, all things considered.
Comedy has transferable skills - if you can't communicate, you can't be a comedian, and I think it's inarguable that Zelenskiy's communication skills have been well up to the mark.
And how many former comedians might well have taken the offer of a ride out of Ukraine, rather than stay and defend their country?
SpookyFrank
A cheap source of teeth for aquarium gravel
But nor are they being completely squished by a much more powerful enemy. Which they would be without any ordnance or logistical support.
existentialist
Tired and unemotional
Well, of course it is. But then Russia, with a massive dominance in troop numbers, isn't exactly doing brilliantly, are they?
UnderOpenSky
baseline neural therapy
Not so much that they've been left high and dry, but the Western tanks and similar haven't arrived in huge numbers yet. Of course the artillery and similar has ensured that they are still in the fight. But I don't disagree with anything Crispy says.
Let's hope they can withstand the coming Russian onslaught.
SpookyFrank
A cheap source of teeth for aquarium gravel
I think the UK should send troops to support Ukraine. Lord knows we've got enough of them sat around doing fuck all at ludicrous expense.
E2a: Actually I think UK forces should make their own way to Ukraine and volunteer to fight en masse. They're such brave lads after all, I'm sure they'd be happy to fight against a country with a non-zero capacity to defend itself for once.
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