Ukraine and the Russian invasion, 2022-24

[Spymaster]

the whole of his speech to russian population with translation is on RT. it is mad.

Can't find it. Got a link?

 

[bimble]

Does he want the Soviet union back then?

definitely no imperial ambitions here no.

 

[bimble]

Can't find it. Got a link?

Not far from the last section of this video, wood panelling background.

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[Bingoman]

Breaking news, the EU to impose sanctions on russia

 

[weltweit]

definitely no imperial ambitions here no. View attachment 311344

That is some social distancing

 

[Crispy]

So Putin is talking of empires, well the Soviet Union anyhow.

Trouble is I don't think there is any way back once an empire has found itself in decline. I don't think there is any evidence from history of an empire having more than one peak.

The Soviet Union had its time, there is no going back.

Romans after the 3rd century crisis, arguably. A lower peak, but a recovery nonetheless.

 

[sleaterkinney]

If you want a hollow and depressing laugh have a look at the Stop the War coalition web page. Basically it's 'NATO hands off Ukraine', no mention of Russia. About as incisive as some of the 'analysis' on here and the how close are we to war thread.

Well, has anyone asked Putin if those tanks are his?

 

[agricola]

So Putin is talking of empires, well the Soviet Union anyhow.

Trouble is I don't think there is any way back once an empire has found itself in decline. I don't think there is any evidence from history of an empire having more than one peak.

The Soviet Union had its time, there is no going back.

The Romans had a few recoveries from decline (at the start of the first century BC, then under Vespasian, then under Diocletian and finally Justinian I) , as did the English or British (after the loss of the Hundred Years War and then again after the loss of America) - decline can be reversed but it’s rare and usually requires a series good/great leaders acting rationally, that working and coinciding with promising circumstances.

Obviously sooner rather than later the idiots get in charge again and then the decline really is terminal.

 

[weltweit]

Thanks Crispy and agricola I know very little about the early Romans. I did read a book though entitled the rise and fall of the great empires. I thought a premise of the book was that once up but not more than once. It was a long time ago, perhaps I misunderstood.

 

[Spymaster]

Thanks Crispy and agricola I know very little about the early Romans. I did read a book though entitled the rise and fall of the great empires. I thought a premise of the book was that once up but not more than once. It was a long time ago, perhaps I misunderstood.

What would a bloke called agricola know about Romans?

 

[Artaxerxes]

The Romans had a few recoveries from decline (at the start of the first century BC, then under Vespasian, then under Diocletian and finally Justinian I) , as did the English or British (after the loss of the Hundred Years War and then again after the loss of America) - decline can be reversed but it’s rare and usually requires a series good/great leaders acting rationally, that working and coinciding with promising circumstances.

Obviously sooner rather than later the idiots get in charge again and then the decline really is terminal.

The whole decline thing for Empires is somewhat overstated anyway, especially in terms of decadence and loss. The world moves on an empires either change with it or fall because of it. The British Empire fell because the world caught up to it and America had simply more stuff to flood the market with. Rome may have fallen (it wasn't even that important by the very late Empire anyway) but its administrative and ruling class limped on and integrated in Italy and France while the clerical side evolved and morphed to become the Catholic Church.

 

[Kevbad the Bad]

So Putin is talking of empires, well the Soviet Union anyhow.

Trouble is I don't think there is any way back once an empire has found itself in decline. I don't think there is any evidence from history of an empire having more than one peak.

The Soviet Union had its time, there is no going back.

He's talking Russia, not the Soviet Union. No way is he harking back to the latter failed attempt at socialism.

 

[Aladdin]

“The televised meeting of the powerful Security Council, which usually meets strictly behind closed doors, offered an extraordinary glimpse into the intense pressure at the top of the Russian elite.

At one point, Putin told spy chief Sergei Naryshkin to be more forthright, prompting the official to blurt out that he backed the idea of Russia absorbing the regions before correcting himself to say he supported recognition.”

Watched the whole lot of the meeting.
They were all afraid.
And Putin sat there drumming his fingers on the table and biting his lip.
He knows that a war that drags the west into it will lead to WW3
And he will blame his security council for it when it happens.

 

[Aladdin]

Can't find it. Got a link?

 

[Aladdin]

That is some social distancing

Pity they can't all socially distance themselves to the moon. And take their troops with them

 

[tommers]

He's ordered "peacekeeping" troops into the separatist states.

 

[bimble]

you don't need thousands of troops if you're just planning to sit at a desk and recognise some states.

 

[Flavour]

it's on. ball in kiev's court. slightly higher pressure here than when they did the same thing to south ossetia and abkhazia

 

[zahir]

A view from a journalist in Kiev.

 

[The39thStep]

Does he want the Soviet union back then?

He actually criticised the Soviet Union (at least the period under Lenin) saying Ukraine was a historical mistake with no tradition or right to sovereignty, claiming that it was, in full, “created by the USSR” and “Lenin was an architect of Ukraine”

 

[Crispy]

Yeah, not the USSR, the Russian Empire. Autocracy, Orthodoxy, Nationality.

 

[Doctor Carrot]

I suppose all the predictions of him not pissing on China's winter Olympics parade have come true. The day after the closing ceremony he gives a crazed speech about Ukraine not being real, then some weird council meeting where everyone's shitting a brick in front of him, says Donetsk is Russian and then sends troops in.

Am I right in thinking that short term this is for his own audience as his popularity is in the shitter because of covid handling. Long term it's a plan to secure more of his own backyard to keep a buffer between Russia and Nato/EU and to pal up with his Chinese mate?

 

[Humberto]

He's not going to go to war with Nato is he. But neither can any Nato power stop him doing what he wants on his doorstep.

 

[Humberto]

I'd imagine he would fuck it up, piss the wrong people off (from within) and meet a sticky end if he goes too far down the chaos and protracted bloodshed route that these wankers always seem to go for.

 

[Hollis]

Blimey! It must be serious... there's going to be a COBR meeting..

 

[Pickman's model]

Blimey! It must be serious... there's going to be a COBR meeting..

A?

 

[Pickman's model]

Watched the whole lot of the meeting.
They were all afraid.
And Putin sat there drumming his fingers on the table and biting his lip.
He knows that a war that drags the west into it will lead to WW3
And he will blame his security council for it when it happens.

He doesn't want to get the party started before xi jinping is ready, and it takes 3 years for him to get his make up on

 

[A380]

Can't wait to see why this is all the fault of NATO and the USA. I imagine there are some urgent zoom calls underway right now...

 

[Hollis]

I checked with the journos on twitter. They called it a COBR meeting.

 

[Pickman's model]

The Romans had a few recoveries from decline (at the start of the first century BC, then under Vespasian, then under Diocletian and finally Justinian I) , as did the English or British (after the loss of the Hundred Years War and then again after the loss of America) - decline can be reversed but it’s rare and usually requires a series good/great leaders acting rationally, that working and coinciding with promising circumstances.

Obviously sooner rather than later the idiots get in charge again and then the decline really is terminal.

The Roman empire lasted to 1453 of course, after the hundred years war and in the reign of Henry vi