'Needle spiking' in UK nightclubs wtf?

[equationgirl]

Um, it wasn't a pile-on at all. But the source quoted whilst on topic was not a robust study as spanglechick has pointed out.

Perhaps look at why you're feeling so defensive?

I was referencing a report which is completely relevant to the topic at hand.

I didn't write the report, but you are having a pop at me by prwhilst initially relevant
Still, I understand the rules- a spiteful pile on is to be taken with good grace

 

[8ball]

And that's before dealing with somebody judging you for drinking too much or using recreationally. Because a lot of people won't believe it isn't down to the alcohol consumed, or that one must have overindulged.

Understandable that youngsters may get caught out a couple of times and mistakenly think they were spiked.
I once suspected it, but got told later my inhibitions had dropped a bit and I had clearly lost track of what I was drinking.

Stories where someone isn’t even drinking are obv a different matter.

As are cases involving any kind of attack, regardless of how hammered someone is.

 

[D'wards]

Um, it wasn't a pile-on at all. But the source quoted whilst on topic was not a robust study as spanglechick has pointed out.

Perhaps look at why you're feeling so defensive?

Because I have been around here a while and see how people resort to nastiness and rudeness very quickly when disagreeing with someone in a way they never would in an office or pub for example.

Basically I'm saying that despite the view that U75 is a kind and supportive place its actually a hive of scum and villainy, much like Mos Eisley.

I am defensive in here, cos you are never far from a snide comment and you should not accept snide comments

 

[sojourner]

Um, it wasn't a pile-on at all. But the source quoted whilst on topic was not a robust study as spanglechick has pointed out.

Perhaps look at why you're feeling so defensive?

S'what I thought.

 

[8ball]

Because I have been around here a while and see how people resort to nastiness and rudeness very quickly when disagreeing with someone in a way they never would in an office or pub for example.

Basically I'm saying that despite the view that U75 is a kind and supportive place its actually a hive of scum and villainy, much like Mos Eisley.

I am defensive in here, cos you are never far from a snide comment and you should not accept snide comments

I think @spanglechick’s re-appraisal of the figures is useful - it wasn’t all just piling on.

Imo a bit of both things is happening, can be disorienting if you have slipped into out-of-character drinking and had a blackout, but lots of the stories don’t fit this.

Is worthwhile to point out where there is a lack of evidence for specific kinds of spiking. Helps be on guard for more likely dangers.

 

[LDC]

There’s a muddy continuum that can occur by topping up someone else’s drink while interacting with them, though (which I wouldn’t count as spiking but which I’d consider dodgy).

That's an interesting topic I think and I've been pulled up for doing that (by a partner, nothing more dodgy) and now have stopped. My thinking it through has made me think it was partly something that comes from my parents in the 80s, when people came round and you'd make sure to keep their drinks 'topped up' as that was polite. Which in practice meant going around and doing so, sometimes as they were talking or happened not to be paying attention.

I mean it's obviously dodgy now, and some of the culture around alcohol has changed thank fuck. Back then the adults I knew used to regularly drink and drive too, refusing to get in the car with my dad when he was clearly very pissed was one of the few flaming rows we had.

 

[8ball]

That's an interesting topic I think and I've been pulled up for doing that (by a partner, nothing more dodgy) and now have stopped. My thinking it through has made me think it was partly something that comes from my parents in the 80s, when people came round and you'd make sure to keep their drinks 'topped up' as that was polite. Which in practice meant going around and doing so, sometimes as they were talking or happened not to be paying attention.

I mean it's obviously dodgy now, and some of the culture around alcohol has changed thank fuck. Back then the adults I knew used to regularly drink and drive too, refusing to get in the car with my dad when he was clearly very pissed one of the few flaming rows we had.

I’ve never tried to get anyone drunk, but making sure everyone is topped up is what I always figured was good manners (not
without say-so or at least eye contact, mind).

The 70’s/80’s attitudes to drink driving are pretty scary now.

 

[equationgirl]

Because I have been around here a while and see how people resort to nastiness and rudeness very quickly when disagreeing with someone in a way they never would in an office or pub for example.

Basically I'm saying that despite the view that U75 is a kind and supportive place its actually a hive of scum and villainy, much like Mos Eisley.

I am defensive in here, cos you are never far from a snide comment and you should not accept snide comments

But you weren't getting snide comments! Also, it's standard practice to look objectively at any reference provided and determine if it's a sensible source or not. In this case, the results did not withstand scrutiny.

Honestly no-one's getting at you.

 

[D'wards]

A common form of drink spiking ive heard about anecdotally is when someone gives a tee-tottaller a coke with a couple of vodkas in it to try and lure them back to the booze, so they can have someone to drink with.

I gave up drinking years ago, but I've had people buy me pints cos they couldn't understand the concept. Not friends I might add, but people in the wider group. No way would I accept a diet coke from them!

 

[equationgirl]

A common form of drink spiking ive heard about anecdotally is when someone gives a tee-tottaller a coke with a couple of vodkas in it to try and lure them back to the booze, so they can have someone to drink with.

I gave up drinking years ago, but I've had people buy me pints cos they couldn't understand the concept. Not friends I might add, but people in the wider group. No way would I accept a diet coke from them!

Yeah, I had that happen, from a then- colleague no less. I asked for an orange juice and he got the barman to add a vodka to it.

Unfortunately I am allergic to alcohol and spent the afternoon being sick.

 

[D'wards]

But you weren't getting snide comments! Also, it's standard practice to look objectively at any reference provided and determine if it's a sensible source or not. In this case, the results did not withstand scrutiny.

Honestly no-one's getting at you.

Sorry about that. I just believe in politeness in all discourse unless someone picks a fight of course, and due to the nature of online bizniz challenges can be seen as aggressive, even if not intended.

 

[equationgirl]

Sorry about that. I just believe in politeness in all discourse unless someone picks a fight of course, and due to the nature of online bizniz challenges can be seen as aggressive, even if not intended.

That's ok, please don't worry about it.

 

[D'wards]

Yeah, I had that happen, from a then- colleague no less. I asked for an orange juice and he got the barman to add a vodka to it.

Unfortunately I am allergic to alcohol and spent the afternoon being sick.

Such a nasty thing to do.

My uncle is 60 and works in an estate agent. The rest of the office are all typical young estate agents- you know, pricks.

He is often the butt of their jokes. He's very mild mannered. Eg sending offensive emails to people when he was away from his computer.
At their last Christmas do before lockdown they spiked his beers with vodka, and he barely drinks from one month to the next.
He got horribly pissed and ended up saying stupid things and generally making a disgrace of himself.
Makes me sad to think of that incident

 

[equationgirl]

Such a nasty thing to do.

My uncle is 60 and works in an estate agent. The rest of the office are all typical young estate agents- you know, pricks.

He is often the butt of their jokes. He's very mild mannered. Eg sending offensive emails to people when he was away from his computer.
At their last Christmas do before lockdown they spiked his beers with vodka, and he barely drinks from one month to the next.
He got horribly pissed and ended up saying stupid things and generally making a disgrace of himself.
Makes me sad to think of that incident

That's such a shitty thing to do. People don't drink for all sorts of reasons - religious, medical or just 'i don't want to'.

I suspect him not drinking made them think about their own relationship with alcohol, and not in s good light.

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

Yeah drink spiking is defo a thing, I know that's been said already but just wanted to add my voice here. I'm unsure about the injecting but to my mind saying "you would feel it" doesn't mean much because there's a big difference between drunkenly feeling a pinch on your arm or leg, and actually realising immediately you were being injected and acting on that. The latter I don't think would be a given even if you did feel it. So it is entirely plausible that it has been happening, and not surprising. And these cunts would certainly be wise when it comes to choosing their victims.

 

[equationgirl]

Yeah drink spiking is defo a thing, I know that's been said already but just wanted to add my voice here. I'm unsure about the injecting but to my mind saying "you would feel it" doesn't mean much because there's a big difference between drunkenly feeling a pinch on your arm or leg, and actually realising immediately you were being injected and acting on that. The latter I don't think would be a given even if you did feel it. So it is entirely plausible that it has been happening, and not surprising. And these cunts would certainly be wise when it comes to choosing their victims.

I may not feel it - the meds i'm on mean I don't always notice when i've broken a toe (((my toes))) so even if I felt something I might dismiss it as scratching my hand or arm on something sharp like. I might not realise for a while that I wasn't next to a wall.

Spiking of any description is a cunt's trick and potentially dangerous to the unlucky recipient, not just due to any substance being injected but needle safety - are these people so considerate that they will always use a fresh needle? I'm thinking not.

 

[HoratioCuthbert]

I may not feel it - the meds i'm on mean I don't always notice when i've broken a toe (((my toes))) so even if I felt something I might dismiss it as scratching my hand or arm on something sharp like. I might not realise for a while that I wasn't next to a wall.

Spiking of any description is a cunt's trick and potentially dangerous to the unlucky recipient, not just due to any substance being injected but neddle safety - are these people so considerate that they will always use a fresh needle? I'm thinking not.

Nope, not a fucking chance.

 

[spanglechick]

I was referencing a report which is completely relevant to the topic at hand.

I didn't write the report, but you are having a pop at me by proxy.

Still, I understand the rules- a spiteful pile on is to be taken with good grace

You brought the report to the thread with no evaluation of its validity, and your post seemed to present it as fact.

I would have thought that a piece of statistical analysis that flies in the face of so many people’s lived experience, and common sense, would automatically provoke you to ask questions. It apparently didn’t, which suggested to me that you were unaware of the many, well documented ways in which healthcare ignores the concerns of women and their knowledge of their own bodies. So that’s what I suggested, albeit with some frustration- because it is exhausting having to raise awareness of this stuff with men.

The only alternative is that you saw that report, knew that healthcare is structurally misogynist in many ways, but still bought the report because you think it’s actually likely that women are making this stuff up. But I didn’t assume that. And even now your fragility is shitting on the thread, ftr I still don’t think it’s that.

The fact remains that posting that report here without criticism, and saying that drug spiking rarely or never happens, in the face of all those who have experienced it, is offensive.

 

[D'wards]

You brought the report to the thread with no evaluation of its validity, and your post seemed to present it as fact.

I would have thought that a piece of statistical analysis that flies in the face of so many people’s lived experience, and common sense, would automatically provoke you to ask questions. It apparently didn’t, which suggested to me that you were unaware of the many, well documented ways in which healthcare ignores the concerns of women and their knowledge of their own bodies. So that’s what I suggested, albeit with some frustration- because it is exhausting having to raise awareness of this stuff with men.

The only alternative is that you saw that report, knew that healthcare is structurally misogynist in many ways, but still bought the report because you think it’s actually likely that women are making this stuff up. But I didn’t assume that. And even now your fragility is shitting on the thread, ftr I still don’t think it’s that.

The fact remains that posting that report here without criticism, and saying that drug spiking rarely or never happens, in the face of all those who have experienced it, is offensive.

I read your posts in a Rik Mayall voice

 

[Magnus McGinty]

I read your posts in a Rik Mayall voice

Yeah it's all just a bit right on. lol

 

[equationgirl]

I read your posts in a Rik Mayall voice

What was it you were saying about snide comments earlier?

spanglechick has made some valid points. Maybe you don't realise how often women are dismissed - by doctors, by colleagues to name but two groups- all the time. It gets so fucking wearing and draining explaining over and over again. So yeah, I so not surprised she's got a tone of exasperation to her posts - I don't blame her.

This is not personal. But over the years the women on urban have seen countless decent debate threads been overrun by people being dismissive and on occasion downright sexist.

So yeah, a lot of women on urban are sick and tired of being ignored and dismissed.

As for spiking incidents, I have reported two known instances that happened to me, and I'm not a big going out person. So I'm probably at the 'not spiked very often scale'. Other women have probably had more issues, sadly.

 

[MickiQ]

Seems to me that spiking someone's drink with (extra) alcohol is potentially more serious than using Rohypnol or whatever the perv's drug of choice is these days. With alcohol it is going to be a lot harder for the victim to argue that their drink was spiked and that they didn't consume it willingly.

 

[equationgirl]

At this rate, drinks are going to come in predetermined sealed sizes.No optics.

 

[spanglechick]

I read your posts in a Rik Mayall voice

Yeah it's all just a bit right on. lol

Does it make you feel big, diminishing the uppity woman who dares to object to offensive shit?

Do you tell gay people and disabled people and people of colour that they’re “a bit right on” too?

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Does it make you feel big, diminishing the uppity woman who dares to object to offensive shit?

Do you tell gay people and disabled people and people of colour that they’re “a bit right on” too?

My post was tongue in cheek towards D'wards dismissal. Happy to apologise.

 

[equationgirl]

Fuck off Magnus McGinty it's not like you have a spotless track record when it comes to threads like these.

 

[D'wards]

Well, I just suggest that sometimes you need to try and find empirical evidence before you swallow the whole moral panic angle.

I'm not saying drink spiking doesn't happen as it clearly does, but sometimes you need to identify how widespread it really is in reality before you get whole swathes of people to alter their behaviour and basically have less fun in their life over a worry that, whilst being devastating if it did happen, is very very unlikely to happen.

Its what moral panic is all about - please see AIDS and Reefer madness.

I have read separate two reports stating that upon testing people that claimed to have been spiked they virtually never have been. (Yeah yeah misogynistic old Drs).

I'm just suggesting that hopefully the problem isn't as widespread as is being reported

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Fuck off Magnus McGinty it's not like you have a spotless track record when it comes to threads like these.

It's a serious issue (rape ffs) and I was making a sarcastic point about how D'wards dismissed Spanglechick's well written post by comparing her to a caricature. I know points don't always travel well in text form but it can be read in a different way that you're choosing to read it.

 

[equationgirl]

Well, I just suggest that sometimes you need to try and find empirical evidence before you swallow the whole moral panic angle.

I'm not saying drink spiking doesn't happen as it clearly does, but sometimes you need to identify how widespread it really is in reality before you get whole swathes of people to alter their behaviour and basically have less fun in their life over a worry that, whilst being devastating if it did happen, is very very unlikely to happen.

Its what moral panic is all about - please see AIDS and Reefer madness.

I have read separate two reports stating that upon testing people that claimed to have been spiked they virtually never have been. (Yeah yeah misogynistic old Drs)

Would you like me to tell you about the misogynist GP who insists the decline in my kidney function was due to my hormones? Misogyny exists in the medical profession, and there's plenty of women who will tell you their experiences of it.

Some drugs won't be detected after a few hours. Even if someone gets to a&e immediately the drugs may well have left their system. It doesn't mean they weren't spiked, just that there's no evidence of it blood tests.

Fuck off is it moral panic. If you want a moral panic go read about the 'satanic panic' of the 1990s.

 

[D'wards]

What was it you were saying about snide comments earlier?

As I stated then, i react to the tone and hers was definitely snide and vitriolic

If she responded politely explaining why I was wrong I wouldn't resort to childishness and piss taking