Ukraine and the Russian invasion, 2022-24

[friedaweed]

Ukrainian commander in Mariupol says forces ‘facing last days, if not hours’

Marine commander appeals for help as another Russian ultimatum calling for remaining troops in city to surrender expires

www.theguardian.com

“The enemy is outnumbering us 10 to one,” Serhiy Volyna, a commander from the 36th separate marine brigade, said in a video message posted on Facebook. “We appeal and plead to all world leaders to help us. We ask them to use the procedure of extraction and take us to the territory of a third-party state.”

Grim as fuck.

ETA sorry for DP was on the fone to me Ma and hadn't seen weltweit had already posted.

 

[frogwoman]

If they're anti war some of them might be relieved to have the pressure taken off

 

[cupid_stunt]

As I think the LTA pointed out it's not a particularly good situation for the athletes to be in in any case. Speak out and risk family in Russia... Don't speak out get hammered by the press. Maybe get protests at matches... Or of course there may be some in favour of invasion, in which case essentially allowing propaganda.

Dunno, but I will say it's the conflict-related thing least likely to cause me to lose any sleep over it.

And, it shouldn't be under discussion on/clogging up this thread, it should be on this one -

Ukraine and the Russian invasion, Feb 2022 - tangentially related crap

Is that poster a cunt? Should people post Twitter posts? Is the microphone pixels? What about Brexit? Fill your boots on this thread instead of the other one.

www.urban75.net

 

[xenon]

I really really dont get this post.

One is a bunch of people largely brought up in Florida being stopped from pursuing their career. The pursuit of hitting a little green ball over a net, the other is asking the richest countries in the world with the largest armies ever formed to intervene in an illegal war which is killing tens of thousands of innocent people. I don't know if Putin is a tennis buff of course.

One could involve an escalation to nuclear war and the consequent death of millions, Where as the other means some relatively priveleged people don't get paid to play tennis for a bit.

Yep, it's a puzzler...

 

[maomao]

One could involve an escalation to nuclear war and the consequent death of millions

Hundreds of millions. Maybe billions. Just for clarity.

 

[xenon]

Hundreds of millions. Maybe billions. Just for clarity.

Some of them could even be professional tennis players.

 

[friedaweed]

I really really dont get this post.

One is a bunch of people largely brought up in Florida being stopped from pursuing their career. The pursuit of hitting a little green ball over a net, the other is asking the richest countries in the world with the largest armies ever formed to intervene in an illegal war which is killing tens of thousands of innocent people. I don't know if Putin is a tennis buff of course.

To be fair if they end up missing a few games at Wimbledon this year it'll hardly end their careers.

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www.essentiallysports.com

Daniil Medvedev: Net worth 2021​

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I totally get what you're saying but these are 'minted' elite athletes that can suck it up and take it on the chin as political pawns on this issue.

Unfortunately sport is always wrapped up in politics just like our professional footballers were during covid. It's all part of the 'Gladiatorial concept of Capitalist professional sport and why they conciquently end up living such privileged lives at the height of their game.

This in turn makes them a target for this sort of political game play. Most of them rise above it though and accept the position they're in, as in the case of Jordan Henderson et al when they ended up as political pawns during the pandemic.

I suspect that these athletes will do something similar as a result of this because they have PR teams who will still want to milk everything they can from their clients. Every cloud as so to speak...

I can't cry any tears over two millionaires currently not making the wombles lawn tennis bash though when the commander in Mariupol is pleading for his and hundreds of injured soldiers and civilians lives on international media.

There will be some top-spin on this story soon. Their agents will already be working on it.

ETA and if my Lecky bill can go up 45% this month they can take a hit too in the name of their Nation States.

 

[Dystopiary]

No graphic footage or anything, but very sad so I spoilered it.

Spoiler

At ten years old, Vanda Semyonovna Obiedkova survived the Germans by hiding in a basement in Mariupol.
80 years later, she died in a basement, again in Mariupol, hiding from the Russian invaders.

https://www.chabad.org/news/article...st-Survivor-Perishes-in-Mariupol-Basement.htm

 

[Leighsw2]

I have wondered if we're likely to see a return of people 'defecting to the west' like many did during the cold war.

....

Or all those South African sportsmen/women in the 70s and 80s who discovered they were British citizens?

 

[friedaweed]

Or all those South African sportsmen/women in the 70s and 80s who discovered they were British citizens?

Aye, Zola Budd didn't get an easy ride in the British tabloid press IIRC. Nor the American press when she nutmegged Mary Decker.

 

[Wilf]

As much as I abhor what's going on, this is just fucking wrong IMO

Wimbledon on collision course with tennis world after player ban

Russian and Belarusian players have been banned from Wimbledon and all other grass-court events in Britain this summer in response to Russia’s illegal invasion of Ukraine

www.theguardian.com

Not helpful. Most if not all of these people have spent most of their lives living outside Russia. Bonkers.

I'm not really fussed either way, though I'd certainly prefer boris johnson to stop taking money off oligarchs before getting to the tennis players.

 

[Smangus]

Millionaires prevented from playing a bullshit middle class wankery game. Boo. Fucking. Hoo.

 

[Zapp Brannigan]

I reckon sporting expulsions are a good idea. It's harsh on the players, but the bigger picture is that millions of Russians are being told that black is white, up is down, Ukraine are Nazis and Russia is fighting a moral special military operation; and they are believing it.

If even half a dozen ordinary Russian tennis fans go to look for Medvedev's matches and think "hang on a sec..." then it's worth more than a handful of millionaire sportspeople missing out on a tournament or 2.

 

[Aladdin]

As much as I abhor what's going on, this is just fucking wrong IMO

Wimbledon on collision course with tennis world after player ban

Russian and Belarusian players have been banned from Wimbledon and all other grass-court events in Britain this summer in response to Russia’s illegal invasion of Ukraine

www.theguardian.com

Not helpful. Most if not all of these people have spent most of their lives living outside Russia. Bonkers.

They could defect...

I dont have a problem with highlighting high profile sporty Russians and banning them from playing their sport anywhere outside of Russia.

I think the more pressure put on Russians the better.
The message has to reach ordinary Russians .. they need to start seeing and thinking about what is actually going on in Ukraine. They need to see beyond their governments propoganda and lies.

So yes....ban the Russian tennis players from Wimbledon.

 

[YouSir]

They could defect...

I dont have a problem with highlighting high profile sporty Russians and banning them from playing their sport anywhere outside of Russia.

I think the more pressure put on Russians the better.
The message has to reach ordinary Russians .. they need to start seeing and thinking about what is actually going on in Ukraine. They need to see beyond their governments propoganda and lies.

So yes....ban the Russian tennis players from Wimbledon.

Defection is a risk for any family left back in Russia.

Anyway, make them play under a neutral flag, differentiate the state from the people.

 

[Aladdin]

Ukrainian commander in Mariupol says forces ‘facing last days, if not hours’

Marine commander appeals for help as another Russian ultimatum calling for remaining troops in city to surrender expires

www.theguardian.com

Grim as fuck.

ETA sorry for DP was on the fone to me Ma and hadn't seen weltweit had already posted.

That's grim..


The call for extraction..is it something that could be done?

 

[SpookyFrank]

That's grim..


The call for extraction..is it something that could be done?

Maybe it can be done but it won't be.

 

[_Russ_]

Media has regularly reported on the reluctance of NATO and member countries to supply fighter aircraft to Ukraine, apparently a US DoD press conference has let slip that their has been some deliveries

Ukrainian air force increases fighter fleet as international aid pours in

A senior US defence official says Ukraine is receiving military aircraft and parts, but declined to reveal from whom.

www.flightglobal.com

 

[strung out]

Media has regularly reported on the reluctance of NATO and member countries to supply fighter aircraft to Ukraine, apparently a US DoD press conference has let slip that their has been some deliveries

Ukrainian air force increases fighter fleet as international aid pours in

A senior US defence official says Ukraine is receiving military aircraft and parts, but declined to reveal from whom.

www.flightglobal.com

That claim has been retracted by the Pentagon. Apparently Ukraine have only had spare parts delivered for their existing fleet.

Ukraine given parts, not whole aircraft, by allies: Pentagon

The US Defense Department on Wednesday retracted its claim Ukraine had been supplied with more aircraft, saying only parts had been delivered to enable Kyiv to put more jets into the fight against Russia.

www.france24.com

 

[Dogsauce]

Putin now called for a halt to attacks on the steelworks and has instead said it should be ‘sealed up so that not even a fly could escape’. I guess he needs it relatively intact for whichever oligarch he gives it away to post-invasion, never mind the bad smell from the cellars. Grim.

 

[Pickman's model]

grim has been so heavily used in this thread it's in danger of wearing out completely. so here are some other options you can use when you'd normally reach for grim

 

[frogwoman]

Russia bombs Syria's Idlib province twice despite ceasefire putin still bombing Syria.

 

[Artaxerxes]

Putin now called for a halt to attacks on the steelworks and has instead said it should be ‘sealed up so that not even a fly could escape’. I guess he needs it relatively intact for whichever oligarch he gives it away to post-invasion, never mind the bad smell from the cellars. Grim.

Needs the forces elsewhere and there’s not enough forces left in the plant to matter

 

[keybored]

grim has been so heavily used in this thread it's in danger of wearing out completely. so here are some other options you can use when you'd normally reach for grim
View attachment 319446

"ghastly" best suits Guardian links.

 

[_Russ_]

That claim has been retracted by the Pentagon. Apparently Ukraine have only had spare parts delivered for their existing fleet.

Ukraine given parts, not whole aircraft, by allies: Pentagon

The US Defense Department on Wednesday retracted its claim Ukraine had been supplied with more aircraft, saying only parts had been delivered to enable Kyiv to put more jets into the fight against Russia.

www.france24.com

They would certainly have to retract it, Im hoping the initial statement was true.

 

[Kaka Tim]

the tenacity of the defence of Mariupol is extraordinary - they must know they have no hope of being relived and a very high chance of dying - but understand that the longer they hold on the more time it buys the rest of Ukraine. This willingness to fight to the last seems to be endemic and may inspire other Ukrainians to do the same. As long as they have the weapons and ammo - they will keep fighting. By contrast, the Russian troops are far more likely to do anything they can to avoid putting themselves at risk. That's why anything resembling a Russian military victory looks increasingly unlikely.

 

[Pickman's model]

the tenacity of the defence of Mariupol is extraordinary - they must know they have no hope of being relived and a very high chance of dying - but understand that the longer they hold on the more time it buys the rest of Ukraine. This willingness to fight to the last seems to be endemic and may inspire other Ukrainians to do the same. As long as they have the weapons and ammo - they will keep fighting. By contrast, the Russian troops are far more likely to do anything they can to avoid putting themselves at risk. That's why anything resembling a Russian military victory looks increasingly unlikely.

yeh the russians are all cowards and all the ukrainians as plucky as can be

i don't think it really works like that

 

[Bahnhof Strasse]

Aye, Zola Budd didn't get an easy ride in the British tabloid press IIRC. Nor the American press when she nutmegged Mary Decker.

Yeah, had to go all the way over in Los Angeles to do it. Was a long way to trip a Mary.

 

[Yossarian]

yeh the russians are all cowards and all the ukrainians as plucky as can be

i don't think it really works like that

Though it's probably no exaggeration to say the Ukrainians fighting to defend their country and avoid being captured by the Russians are going to be a little more motivated than Russian troops/mercenaries who are fighting for control of the llich Iron & Steel Works Metallurgical Plant.

 

[rekil]

Though it's probably no exaggeration to say the Ukrainians fighting to defend their country and avoid being captured by the Russians are going to be a little more motivated than Russian troops/mercenaries who are fighting for control of the llich Iron & Steel Works Metallurgical Plant.

Not a lot of loot to be had. Sending an electric arc furnace home will probably be more trouble than it's worth.