^ Lo Siento fair enough,just might be useful if the union movement isn't too fucked in Spain for Podemos to have some sort of relevance to workplace organising
Spanish Political News
- Thread starter dessiato
- Start date
DotCommunist
So many particulars. So many questions.
http://www.economist.com/news/europ...upends-political-establishment-lot-bad-apples
six sitting mayors
no wonder people have got the hump with the unions involved
six sitting mayors
no wonder people have got the hump with the unions involved
J Ed
Follow Back Pro Expropriation
From reading recent discussions the Podemos trade union strategy seems to be to create their own trade union (sorry can't find anything in English) but at the same time organising within existing unions while criticising their leadership.
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Lo Siento.
Second As Farce
Cheesy Catalan anarchist video opposing participation in today's Consulta. I don't speak Catalan, but understand enough - they're showing pictures of corrupt Catalan nationalist politicians and explainations of all their bullshit and saying they won't vote.
Lo Siento.
Second As Farce
Depends in what sense you mean. In one sense PCE activists made the CC.OO and PSOE ones the UGT...
It's worth bearing in mind that Spanish workers are much more likely to participate in union actions without being union members than workers in Britain. In many workplaces only the activists are actually in the union, and they often pick one based on their political preferences.
Not sure why Somos needs to exist though, other than Podemos' apparent obsession with conjugating verbs... "sindicatos asemblearios y sin liberados" exist in abundance in Spain, with The CGT, CNT, Solidaridad Obrera, CUT and various industry specific ones all operating on that model.
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Anudder Oik
heinous pointless bellend/fucking gobshite muppet
I voted in the catalan (non binding) referendum for Independence today. It was declared illegal by the spanish supreme court which has 2 judges directly related to the spanish governing party. The electoral college was full all day and I had to push my way thru crowds to the voting table once inside. The atmosphere was one of civilized civil disobedience mixed with a sense of histrorical justice. I voted yes. Catalonia is the Ireland of Spain.
Lo Siento.
Second As Farce
weltweit
Well-Known Member
I was just checking with my Ex's Spanish / Catalan family what they were doing today. Predictably a couple of them who have strong feelings are voting for independence but a surprising number just don't care either way and will probably be non voters. Will be interesting to see what the result is.
weltweit
Well-Known Member
Nothing like Scotland then.
J Ed
Follow Back Pro Expropriation
Given that the situations are entirely different, not really much like Scotland at all!
Anudder Oik
heinous pointless bellend/fucking gobshite muppet
2 million voters so far. There are 15 more days to register votes. My partner worked all day and couldn't go so it will be at least 2 million and 1. When this referendum was offered as an alternative to the banned one there was some disunity between the political parties and it dampened the atmosphere a bit. It will be interesting to see how many people add their vote after today.
2 million is a lot of people but not enough to win Independence in a binding referendum.
Anudder Oik
heinous pointless bellend/fucking gobshite muppet
Denied Independence by an aggressive central State. Oppressed, not as severely as Ireland but oppressed all the same for 300 years.
Favelado
J'adore South Shore
The Ireland of Spain? I'm pro-referendum, and pro-independence if they want it but that's a pretty wacky statement.
JHE
.
Looks like a boycott by opponents of independence.
Two years ago Mas tried to plonk himself at the head of the movement for independence, but has been a bit half-hearted and reluctant to defy Madrid. My guess is that supporters of independence will draw the obvious conclusion: that if they are serious they have to elect people who are serious about establishing an independent country. I predict ERC will do well next year.
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Lo Siento.
Second As Farce
Terrible comparison.
It's the wealthiest region of the country and most of it's population (certainly in the major towns and cities) is comprised of the descendants of poor migrants from the rest of Spain.
Unlike Ireland, which was colonised by a wealthier nation, which kept it in a state of perennial underdevelopment and gave a large proportion of its good land to its own aristocrats and aggressive settlers.
Anudder Oik
heinous pointless bellend/fucking gobshite muppet
In 1714 all autonomy was forcibly removed, all political power and institutions were stripped from the Catalans and forcibly replaced by castillian administration. The language has been banned on several occasions throughout history. I know an old man who was force fed caster oil by 2 Guardia Civil for speaking Catalan when he was 9.
There are historical grievances from a people who have been denied their right to choose how they govern their own country. The same as Ireland.
Favelado
J'adore South Shore
Why is Catalonia the Ireland of Spain and not the Basque Country? Or are there more Irelands in Spain than there are Irelands?
Anudder Oik
heinous pointless bellend/fucking gobshite muppet
The basque country is also the Ireland of Spain (If you like the 2 Irelands of Spain) and both regions recognize the plight of the other and are united in their rejection of Castille as their master.
JHE
.
Why only two Irelands? If anyone's going to be the Ireland of Spain, Galicia's got as much right as anyone. No, more right, much more right than anyone else: lots and lots of rain, bagpipes, afflicted with right-wing Catholicism, famous for its history of desperate emigration to the New World, left-wing nationalists whose support has increased during the crisis...
JHE
.
You mean the little general, Pac O'Franco?
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Lo Siento.
Second As Farce
You know that lots of Spanish people were also abused by Franco for similar sorts of reasons, right?
Anudder Oik
heinous pointless bellend/fucking gobshite muppet
Yes, but it doesn't detract from the fact that for 300 years Catalonia has been denied its Independence. I really fail to see your point.
Anudder Oik
heinous pointless bellend/fucking gobshite muppet
The right wing opposition to the right to vote in a referendum has been absolutely disgraceful up till now, not hesitating to stoop to the lowest twisted arguments or insults against what is a massive popular movement with a democratic spirit. Albert Rivera of the Ciutadans party has compared todays voting with practices reminiscent of fascism and nazism. As though voting were something evil.
Perhaps the worst speech has been that of Camacho from the PP. It looks like the evil catalans forced her to broadcast from the zoo.
Perhaps the worst speech has been that of Camacho from the PP. It looks like the evil catalans forced her to broadcast from the zoo.
Favelado
J'adore South Shore
This is the same party who has an MP who shouted out "They can go and fuck themselves" in parliament, when the subject of the unmeployed and dole came up (Andrea Fabra if I recall correctly). What do you expect? They're cunts about EVERYTHING.
ska invita
back on the other side
in Catalan vote supposedly turn out of 5.4mill in a region/country of 7.5mill (i make that 72%) , with an 80% yes/yes
Favelado
J'adore South Shore
Turnout of 2.2 million I thought.
ska invita
back on the other side
shit you're right - were did i get that number
what happens if you post before 1st tea
ignore my post
*5.4 mill of the the 7.5 are eligible to vote, from which 2.2 mill did - thats a 40% turnout i make it
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