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Fascists, Fascism and the Invasion.

Decent article that adds a little more about the networks beyond Azovs regiment itself. For the avoidance of doubt and to avoid any allegations of feeding Russian propaganda I will repeat what I have l already posted ( from the comfort of my living room) that the existence of Azov is not evidence of Ukraine being a fascist state . It is however a worrying issue and one that cant be swept under the carpet. It doesn't alter my position that Russia should withdraw and that Ukraine has a right to defend its borders.

 
It looks to me like Azov (and the other 'volunteer' battalions, i.e. paramilitaries) forms a ready made military wing of the People's Front. Arsen Avakov seems to have been at the centre of its creation and its integration into the National Guard (thereby making these paramilitaries legal after the Parliament had effectively banned them in April 2014). Avakov was the Minister of Internal Affairs (and therefore in charge of the National Guard) from 2014 until last year when he resigned (apparently there'd been tensions between him and Zelenskyy over the possible involvement of Donbas volunteers' role in the assassination of a journalist, and the president may have requested his resignation). I need to do some more research, but the danger I see with Azov (and the other paramilitary groups) is that they seem to be integrated into a political party, and all political parties exist to control a country...
 
Ros Atkins has been talking about Nazis in Ukraine and Russian propaganda for the BBC. He's either talking very quickly or it's been speeded up, but anyway, he's basically saying that while there is a problem, the far right in Ukraine have less support than eg Le Pen does in France, and that Putin and his cronies are making it out to have authoritative power it doesn't have. Interesting about the (brief) history of Azov batallion if true.

Ros Atkins on... Putin’s false Nazi claims about Ukraine
 
Ros Atkins has been talking about Nazis in Ukraine and Russian propaganda for the BBC. He's either talking very quickly or it's been speeded up, but anyway, he's basically saying that while there is a problem, the far right in Ukraine have less support than eg Le Pen does in France, and that Putin and his cronies are making it out to have authoritative power it doesn't have. Interesting about the (brief) history of Azov batallion if true.

Ros Atkins on... Putin’s false Nazi claims about Ukraine
Yes I saw this yesterday. While it's true (and important to point out) that Ukraine's far right don't have influence over the government, I didn't think it was very responsible of him to downplay Azov so much (and not even mentioning the Right Sector which, imo, was the main far-right threat since 2014).

He seemed to suggest that Biletsky's 'leaving' Azov had somehow led to it's moderation. Biletsky didn't leave; he stopped being its commander when he was elected as a politician (politicians cannot serve in military or police forces). He's still the leader of National Corps (formerly known as Patriot of Ukraine and then Social-National Assembly) of which Azov is its paramilitary force. Other far-right political parties also established paramilitary forces in 2014 (e.g. Svoboda set up the Sich (C14) battalion and Right Sector set up the Ukrainian Volunteer Corps/Army). Also, I'm not sure this mere "10-20%" Nazi membership of Azov can actually be verified - how many EDL types say "we're not racist", for example?

In 2014 there were dozens of paramilitary forces established that played a huge role in preventing pro-Russian forces from taking over a wider area of the country (violent pro-Russian protests took part all across 'Novorossiya', and at that time, the Ukrainian military could only count on a few thousand soldiers). This included those far-right militias mentioned above, but also many other that were purely volunteer forces. Ukrainian oligarch Ihor Kolomoisky funded/armed these groups, presumably as he was terrified of what would happen to his business interests should the Russians get hold of them.

Eventually, with the exception of one of the Right Sector's paramilitary forces, these militias were mainly incorporated into the National Guard or the Special Tasks Police Patrol under the Ministry of Internal Affairs, headed by then minister Arsen Avakov (another oligarch). Avakov was also one of the founding members of the People's Front that formed a coalition with Petro Poroshenko's party to govern the country after the 2014 elections. The People's Front contains a 'military council' which includes the commanders (or former commanders) of various paramilitaries, including Andriy Biletsky of Azov. Azov has even been described as Avakov's personal army (altho they all deny this).

Kolomoisky (who funded Zelenskyy's presidential campaign) also founded a political party (or alliances of politicians between parties), UKROP (now know as For the Future). UKROP included Andriy Biletsky of Azov and Dmytro Yarosh from Right Sector. Kolomoisky's personal army is supposedly the Dnipro 1 battalion (again, denied by all). Members of this militia were suspected of occupying the building of Ukrnafta (an oil company) after the government passed legislation reducing Kolomoisky's influence in the company. Kolomoisky and Avakov supposedly have a working relationship with each other.

I think the occupation of the Ukrnafta building shows how these militias might be used by the oligarchs at some point in the future. Even tho they now only represent a tiny fraction of the forces fighting against Russia, I don't think the future threat they pose to the Ukrainian state should be underestimated.

I live in Colombia. I know what happens when the military, politicians and businessmen ally themselves with paramilitary groups they hope to control for their own purposes. They can justify it all they want, but it always ends the same.

At some point in the future, there will need to be a peace process which investigates the wars crimes not just of the politically motivated far-right militias, but all militias (including the pro-Russian ones) and these groups should be disbanded or made illegal. Otherwise, certain powerful people might use them to really create what Putin falsely accuses Ukraine of being today...
 
Ros Atkins has been talking about Nazis in Ukraine and Russian propaganda for the BBC. He's either talking very quickly or it's been speeded up, but anyway, he's basically saying that while there is a problem, the far right in Ukraine have less support than eg Le Pen does in France, and that Putin and his cronies are making it out to have authoritative power it doesn't have. Interesting about the (brief) history of Azov batallion if true.

Ros Atkins on... Putin’s false Nazi claims about Ukraine
Last time I checked Le Pen supporters weren't co-opted into a heavily armed battalion in the French Armed Forces.
 
Yes I saw this yesterday. While it's true (and important to point out) that Ukraine's far right don't have influence over the government, I didn't think it was very responsible of him to downplay Azov so much (and not even mentioning the Right Sector which, imo, was the main far-right threat since 2014).

He seemed to suggest that Biletsky's 'leaving' Azov had somehow led to it's moderation. Biletsky didn't leave; he stopped being its commander when he was elected as a politician (politicians cannot serve in military or police forces). He's still the leader of National Corps (formerly known as Patriot of Ukraine and then Social-National Assembly) of which Azov is its paramilitary force. Other far-right political parties also established paramilitary forces in 2014 (e.g. Svoboda set up the Sich (C14) battalion and Right Sector set up the Ukrainian Volunteer Corps/Army). Also, I'm not sure this mere "10-20%" Nazi membership of Azov can actually be verified - how many EDL types say "we're not racist", for example?

In 2014 there were dozens of paramilitary forces established that played a huge role in preventing pro-Russian forces from taking over a wider area of the country (violent pro-Russian protests took part all across 'Novorossiya', and at that time, the Ukrainian military could only count on a few thousand soldiers). This included those far-right militias mentioned above, but also many other that were purely volunteer forces. Ukrainian oligarch Ihor Kolomoisky funded/armed these groups, presumably as he was terrified of what would happen to his business interests should the Russians get hold of them.

Eventually, with the exception of one of the Right Sector's paramilitary forces, these militias were mainly incorporated into the National Guard or the Special Tasks Police Patrol under the Ministry of Internal Affairs, headed by then minister Arsen Avakov (another oligarch). Avakov was also one of the founding members of the People's Front that formed a coalition with Petro Poroshenko's party to govern the country after the 2014 elections. The People's Front contains a 'military council' which includes the commanders (or former commanders) of various paramilitaries, including Andriy Biletsky of Azov. Azov has even been described as Avakov's personal army (altho they all deny this).

Kolomoisky (who funded Zelenskyy's presidential campaign) also founded a political party (or alliances of politicians between parties), UKROP (now know as For the Future). UKROP included Andriy Biletsky of Azov and Dmytro Yarosh from Right Sector. Kolomoisky's personal army is supposedly the Dnipro 1 battalion (again, denied by all). Members of this militia were suspected of occupying the building of Ukrnafta (an oil company) after the government passed legislation reducing Kolomoisky's influence in the company. Kolomoisky and Avakov supposedly have a working relationship with each other.

I think the occupation of the Ukrnafta building shows how these militias might be used by the oligarchs at some point in the future. Even tho they now only represent a tiny fraction of the forces fighting against Russia, I don't think the future threat they pose to the Ukrainian state should be underestimated.

I live in Colombia. I know what happens when the military, politicians and businessmen ally themselves with paramilitary groups they hope to control for their own purposes. They can justify it all they want, but it always ends the same.

At some point in the future, there will need to be a peace process which investigates the wars crimes not just of the politically motivated far-right militias, but all militias (including the pro-Russian ones) and these groups should be disbanded or made illegal. Otherwise, certain powerful people might use them to really create what Putin falsely accuses Ukraine of being today...
Thanks for posting that.
Why did Kolomoisky fund Zelenskyy's presidential campaign?
 
Thanks for posting that.
Why did Kolomoisky fund Zelenskyy's presidential campaign?
Because he wanted him to win! :D

But seriously, much of Zelenskyy's TV career was at Channel 1 + 1 (of which Kolomoisky is the major shareholder). I think the two are (were) very close. I don't know exactly why Kolomoisky backed Zelenskyy or what he hoped to get out of it, but Zelenskyy had distanced himself from Kolomoisky last year when he gave his 'oligarch speech' (KYIV BLOG: Ukrainian President Zelenskiy’s oligarch speech)

He also sacked Avakov from his position of minister of internal affairs (a position he had until last year through successive governments showing his influence). I say sacked, asked politely to leave might be more accurate.
 
I suspect these guys rather than a reaction to extreme times are behind the lampost floggings

In January 2018, Azov rolled out its National Druzhina street patrol unit whose members swore personal fealty to Biletsky and pledged to “restore Ukrainian order” to the streets. The Druzhina quickly distinguished itself by carrying out pogroms against the Roma and LGBT organizations and storming a municipal council building
 
Misanthropic Division? Actual name, translation oddity or dysphemism? I've not heard of the term.
E.g:

 
This article attempts to summarise the degree of power of the far right in Ukraine...id be very interested in urbans opinion on the piece
 
Because he wanted him to win! :D

But seriously, much of Zelenskyy's TV career was at Channel 1 + 1 (of which Kolomoisky is the major shareholder). I think the two are (were) very close. I don't know exactly why Kolomoisky backed Zelenskyy or what he hoped to get out of it, but Zelenskyy had distanced himself from Kolomoisky last year when he gave his 'oligarch speech' (KYIV BLOG: Ukrainian President Zelenskiy’s oligarch speech)

He also sacked Avakov from his position of minister of internal affairs (a position he had until last year through successive governments showing his influence). I say sacked, asked politely to leave might be more accurate.
Different patrons as circumstances change...
 
This article attempts to summarise the degree of power of the far right in Ukraine...id be very interested in urbans opinion on the piece
It's really quite simple. Various Marxist/Trot/Commie elitist sects see Nazis everywhere when nobody else does. In the face of multiple revelations of war crimes and atrocities by the Russian forces just exaggerate, lie and blame Nato. No need to engage the brain. No need to question whether it all started to go wrong as early as 1917. All the western media are lying. Totally controlled by Washington.
 
It's really quite simple. Various Marxist/Trot/Commie elitist sects see Nazis everywhere when nobody else does. In the face of multiple revelations of war crimes and atrocities by the Russian forces just exaggerate, lie and blame Nato. No need to engage the brain. No need to question whether it all started to go wrong as early as 1917. All the western media are lying. Totally controlled by Washington.
Doesn't make sense. For a start, no left critic of the war is saying anything so simplistic. Not even the opportunist Galloway.

What does 'it all started to go wrong as early as 1917' actually mean in concrete terms? What has been done by left critics of the Bolsheviks (of whom I have long considered myself one, for what it matters, which is not at all) to rectify these wrongs, and by whom? As if it was possible.

And when did NATO beome something that shouldn't be blamed by lefties for its self-interested, job-creating, arms billionaire-enriching projects? Particularly in a context where we may not be seeing the atrocities we are gradually going to become immune to (just as we are immune to atrocities in ie African wars) had NATO not sought to expand with seemingly complete disregard to the, almost inevitable given the development of post Communist-rule Russia, reaction?
 
It's really quite simple. Various Marxist/Trot/Commie elitist sects see Nazis everywhere when nobody else does. In the face of multiple revelations of war crimes and atrocities by the Russian forces just exaggerate, lie and blame Nato. No need to engage the brain. No need to question whether it all started to go wrong as early as 1917. All the western media are lying. Totally controlled by Washington.
Weekly worker are universally against Putin in all their articles that I've read... Though they are Imperial Realists. So now that's out the way what about the substance of the article?
 
Weekly worker are universally against Putin in all their articles that I've read... Though they are Imperial Realists. So now that's out the way what about the substance of the article?
'It's really quite simple...'

What is simple is that the anti the 'anti-imperalist left' have completely lost their shit and, even if not totally consciously, thrown in their lot with their supposed enemies in the class struggle.

Atrocities in war? Totally unthinkable... A dictator (accuracy of the term vague and up for argument) has actually come to gain control of a major nation state. Unprecedented horror.

These people swallowed the myth of Fukuyama's post-1989 order wholesale, whether they recognise it or not.
 
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This article attempts to summarise the degree of power of the far right in Ukraine...id be very interested in urbans opinion on the piece
I don't think anyone doubts that neo-Nazis and other far-right groups exist in Ukraine and that they've played a role in both the Maidan protests and fighting against the Russians. The question is, how much influence do they have? I'm not sure that article answered the question.

Here's a journal article from 2015, assessing the influence these groups had in the Maidan protests (Putin claims they were almost 100% responsible for what took place): The “Right Sector” and others on JSTOR (you can read the article if you sign up with a Google account). The article concludes:
During the protests, the radical right was an insignificant minority among the participants of the protests. Their role was greatly overstated by the media. The Right Sector declared itself responsible for the violent standoff with the police, and thus became associated (largely wrongly) by the media with the active part of the protest movement. Tyahnybom and Yarosh had received a laughable support in the presidential elections. This indicates that the ultra-nationalists have no serious electoral potential and that the evaluations according to which neo-Nazis had seized power in Ukraine after the revolution are simply incorrect.

The assorted far-right groups, including Svoboda (formerly known as the Social-National Party), National Corps (the political wing of Azov) and Right Sector, got 2.15% of the votes in the 2019 legislative elections. They clearly have no electoral support in the public, and I've seen no evidence they have the ability to influence politicians or ministers. The other way round tho...

I think the danger of these far-right groups is not the influence they have, but the influence others have over them (and I repeat, this has been Avakov and Kolomoisky). Avakov appointed their members (and many others who he wants loyalty/favours from) to high level positions in the departments of the Ministry of Internal Affairs (responsible for policing and public order). Kolomoisky funded these groups (and other battalions). Being incorporated into the National Guard/Special Police Task Forces, they can be used to subdue anti-government protests, hence why Avakov has been necessary for both Poroshenko and Zelensky (the National Guard was created as the Berkut that had fought against the Maidan protesters had pretty much all fled to Russia). But these groups (not just far-right ones) have also been used to protect Kolomoisky's and Avakov's (or his mates') business interests. Many murders of activists and journalists are also suspected to have been at the hands of members of law enforcement, and it looks like Zelensky forced Avakov out of his position as these murders remain unsolved (he'd constantly ensured these investigations don't happen or went nowhere).

Here's a two-part article giving the history of Avakov and how he's maintained and used his power and influence:

Avakov and Kolomoisky appear to have quite a good working relationship, and both are involved in similar political movements. I expect with Avakov's departure from the Ministry of Internal Affairs, he'll probably find a home in Kolomoisky's movement, and from there, they'll find use for the far-right groups (and other volunteer battalions) when it comes to election time (threatening voters, ensuring voter fraud is found or not when necessary, etc). If they win, they'll have a ready and loyal police force to ensure they stay in power.

Edit: If anything good comes out of this war, it's that Zelensky will be all but guaranteed to win the next election, without the need for alliances or favours from powerful people. If he genuinely wants to implement anti-corruption measures against people like Avakov and Kolomoisky, as well as ensuring the prosecution is staffed by anti-corruption people, he'll hopefully get his chance whenever this conflict finishes to show he means business...
 
It's really quite simple. Various Marxist/Trot/Commie elitist sects see Nazis everywhere when nobody else does. In the face of multiple revelations of war crimes and atrocities by the Russian forces just exaggerate, lie and blame Nato. No need to engage the brain. No need to question whether it all started to go wrong as early as 1917. All the western media are lying. Totally controlled by Washington.
I've got very little time for the cobweb left however the biggest and most widespread use of terms like Nazis and fascists over the past five years or more have come from left liberals in attempting to describe people as diverse as Trump, Farage and Johnson as fascists and nazis
 
This article attempts to summarise the degree of power of the far right in Ukraine...id be very interested in urbans opinion on the piece

The more the US pours advanced weaponry into the hands of groups like the Azov Battalion, the more it will wind up fanning the flames of fascism - and the more the corporate media will look away. As angry as the western left may be at Putin for launching this disastrous war, they should keep one thing in mind: the real enemy is at home.
Why do I suspect that the writer of this article started off with their closing sentence first and then worked backwards from there?
 
Also, this is fucking weak:
A particularly extreme version occurred last week when The New York Times ran a front-page story asserting that Russian complaints about Nazism are “puzzling” because Ukrainian president Volodymyr Zelensky is Jewish:


Ukraine’s government is “openly neo-Nazi” and “pro-Nazi”, controlled by “little Nazis” [my emphasis there], president Vladimir V Putin of Russia says. The “Nazi” slur’s sudden emergence shows how Mr Putin is trying to use stereotypes, distorted reality and his country’s lingering World War II trauma to justify his invasion of Ukraine.

But, the Times went on, Nazis “in reality occupy a marginal place in Ukrainian society”. Bottom line: the Kremlin is making a mountain out of a molehill in order to justify its illegal invasion.

But then the Times began to backtrack. After a dozen paragraphs of anti-Russian vitriol, it finally conceded that maybe the claims were not so baseless after all: “Like many lies, Mr Putin’s claim about a Nazi-controlled Ukraine has a hall-of-mirrors connection to reality,” it said...

The Times continued:

Eduard Dolinsky, director general of the Ukrainian Jewish Committee, a group representing Ukrainian Jews, said that some in the country do derisively refer to those far-right groups as ‘Naziki’ - ‘little Nazis’ - as Mr Putin does...

Putin is wrong, in other words, except when he’s right. He is sounding false alarms that nonetheless turn out to be distinctly alarming.
The fact that there are some groups in the country who can accurately be described as little Nazis is not the same thing as those groups controlling the country. Spiked Magazine/IOI freaks occupy some positions of power in the UK and have a disproportionate influence compared to their numbers, but someone who said the UK was controlled by Frank Furedi would still be chatting shit.
 
The fact that there are some groups in the country who can accurately be described as little Nazis is not the same thing as those groups controlling the country. Spiked Magazine/IOI freaks occupy some positions of power in the UK and have a disproportionate influence compared to their numbers, but someone who said the UK was controlled by Frank Furedi would still be chatting shit.
Let alone that Russia should 'defuredify' the country and set up bodies for this purpose for 25 years
 
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