Alt-Right/Fascist support for Putin
- Thread starter Rimbaud
- Start date
seventh bullet
sovietwave
Many Russian fascists aren't Nazis though. Not all the big dreaming nationalists are even fascist, either. They draw from other sources particularly adapted to Russia and for Eurasia more widely, and the civilisational importance of the former on the governance of the latter. Russians are neither Western nor Eastern, definitvely European or Asian, but a unique blending or synthesis of the two, and they're destined to rule over one vast portion of the world. All other peoples in this land are the building blocks of Russian greatness, and the superior Russian culture is the cement that holds it all together.
cloudyday
caput mortuum
seventh bullet is Dugin the ideologue that this is drawn from? any recomendations on reading about/by him?
seventh bullet
sovietwave
Dugin is only one small part of it, and he's more connected to the western European far-right, which is part of the attraction to his 'neo-Eurasianism' from fascists/third positionists in western Europe and in both north and south America.
For a good primer, have a look at Russian Eurasianism: An Ideology of Empire by Marlene Laruelle.
For a good primer, have a look at Russian Eurasianism: An Ideology of Empire by Marlene Laruelle.
cloudyday
caput mortuum
Thanks. Just picked this up by her, currently free (kindle version). Will check out the title you mention also.
Russian Nationalism: Imaginaries, Doctrines, and Political Battlefields (BASEES/Routledge Series on Russian and East European Studies) eBook : Laruelle, Marlene: Amazon.co.uk: Kindle Store
Russian Nationalism: Imaginaries, Doctrines, and Political Battlefields (BASEES/Routledge Series on Russian and East European Studies) eBook : Laruelle, Marlene: Amazon.co.uk: Kindle Store
www.amazon.co.uk
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I've downloaded it myself, thanks for mentioning it. She's great, I've learned a lot from her writing on Russian nationalism and Eurasian politics, or as mentioned upthread, what I managed to retain from the books I soaked up ten or more years ago. Her In the Name of the Nation: Nationalism and Politics in Contemporary Russia, and Eurasianism and the European Far-Right, are worth a read too.
petee
no gods, no malarkey
"Anti-vaccine influencers claim that the United States owns a network of secret biolabs in Ukraine where dangerous infectious disease research takes place. For them, it’s just obvious that Biden is sending aid to Ukraine in order to protect those assets."
www.motherjones.com
Pro-Putin disinformation is thriving in online anti-vax groups
All the usual themes: Secret government alliances, anti-Semitic tropes, and nefarious scientists.
www.motherjones.com
rubbershoes
not the only raver in the village
"Anti-vaccine influencers claim that the United States owns a network of secret biolabs in Ukraine where dangerous infectious disease research takes place. For them, it’s just obvious that Biden is sending aid to Ukraine in order to protect those assets."
Pro-Putin disinformation is thriving in online anti-vax groups
All the usual themes: Secret government alliances, anti-Semitic tropes, and nefarious scientists.
I thought the biolabs were in Wuhan.
Or, as my autocorrect tried to say, Wigan.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
Weird reading stuff by Dugin, Mazepin etc and other Russian fash/far right figures who at the time of the Crimean annexation were too extreme for Putin who was distancing himself from them. I wonder whether that represents a change in his thinking or whether he feels more like he can say what he really thinks.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
Was Dugin really that close? He's had access but that's not the same thing. I could be wrong though. He likes to style himself as some kind of intellectual entryist to the elite, as a counsel to the king. Contemporary Eurasianism in Russia doesn't begin and end with Dugin and other far-rightists dislike his links with fascists in western Europe. There's also a Kazakh variant as well.
His inversion of Mackinder had people in the Russian military establishment take notice of his geopolitical expertise from the 1990s, but other currents feed into how to counter attempts to contain Russia and once again make it a leading world power with dominance over one part of it.
I haven't checked the Russian Internet, but I bet Russian tanks in Ukraine has moistened his cheesy gusset. He disregards Ukraine with its own independence as a country, a dangerous delusion for Russia's prospects.
His inversion of Mackinder had people in the Russian military establishment take notice of his geopolitical expertise from the 1990s, but other currents feed into how to counter attempts to contain Russia and once again make it a leading world power with dominance over one part of it.
I haven't checked the Russian Internet, but I bet Russian tanks in Ukraine has moistened his cheesy gusset. He disregards Ukraine with its own independence as a country, a dangerous delusion for Russia's prospects.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
Absolutely, dugin was seen as a total crank. He was fired from a university post for advocating killing Ukrainians a few years ago for instance
seventh bullet
sovietwave
Journalists in western Europe and the US have really overstated his importance to Putin.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
so many hacks rely too heavily on their deficient knowledge of google
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
Agreed, that's why I'm wondering whether Putin has changed his views in the last few years because he used to distance himself from these kind of ideas.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
it may be that he's closer to that portion of the russian elite who espouse those ideas.
DaveCinzano
WATCH OUT, GEORGE, HE'S GOT A SCREWDRIVER!
They do a lot of pier reviewing there
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
CPGB-ML flying the flag for invasion and killing people in the special military action against Nazification. Pretty fucking wild.
thecommunists.org
Kiev junta facing defeat as Russia roots out fascist militias from Ukraine
The present denazification operation is the result of 30 years of slow-motion war by Nato against Russia.
thecommunists.org
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
think they're fans of vanessa beeley as wellCPGB-ML flying the flag for invasion and killing people in the special military action against Nazification. Pretty fucking wild.
Kiev junta facing defeat as Russia roots out fascist militias from Ukraine
The present denazification operation is the result of 30 years of slow-motion war by Nato against Russia.
LDC
On est tous des pangolins
Yeah, proper weirdo fans. My first encounter with them round here was walking past their stall and they said something about being pro-Assad and Syria and I turned and gave them some abuse, and they were "Have you heard Vanessa Beeley talk, she knows the truth about the White Helmets." The ones here are all 20 something geeks who look like they can barely manage their lives, or a few very old ones. I mean there's only half a dozen or so of them locally, and I think most are actually related as well.
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
A Greek academic on my fb just posted this. Can anyone confirm it or would be able to say anything more regarding Greek fash support for the Donbass separatists? I know that some Greek fash fought alongside the Serbs in Yugoslavia and there's a lot of stuff about Russia being 'orthodox brothers'.
hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
Yeah, I definitely remember visiting Leeds once and being taken aback by seeing CPGB-ML "Victory to Assad" stuff flyposted around the place.
As slightly more surprising weirdo stuff from left groups goes, does anyone know what the deal with is with Socialist Appeal/IMT and Russia? I sort of thought of the various ex-Millie groups, whatever their problems, as at least tending to stay away from weirdo anti-imperialist stuff, but their statements on the war seem a bit on the dodgy side:
The Ukrainian conflict: is this the start of World War III? | Ukraine | Europe
It is often said that the first victim of war is the truth. Amidst this poisonous fog of propaganda, lies and half-truths, it is extremely difficult to give an accurate assessment of the military situation on the ground.
www.marxist.com
The Ukrainian war: an internationalist class position – RCI Statement | Ukraine | Europe
Marxist website defending the ideas of Marxism as a tool for workers and youth today - by the International Marxist Tendency.
www.marxist.com
And also just bits of classic overblown trot style in there.
hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
A few years old, but here's an article from Meduza about the fash elements involved in the "people's republics":
meduza.io
Enemy of the State or its founding element? Yan Petrovsky, Russian nationalist accused of war crimes in Ukraine, was deported from Norway — Meduza
In October of 2016, the Norwegian government stripped Russian citizen Yan Petrovsky of his permanent residence. Petrovksy, a resident in Norway since 2004, is a radical nationalist who was suspected of links with neo-Nazi Viacheslav Datsik. As vice-commander of the “Rusich” task force, Petrovsky...
CyberRose
أرفع الشفرات
I've been reading a lot about Eurasianism recently and was already aware of Dugin's fame. It appears journalists like to big him up as the brains behind Putin, while academics reject this as sensationalism.
I found an essay from Marlene Laruelle where she basically says Dugin's ideas can barely be described as Eurasianist in the traditional sense, as he seems to be a purely Western-style fascist as you say.
(PDF) The Two Faces of Contemporary Eurasianism: An Imperial Version of Russian Nationalism
PDF | The Eurasianist ideology is coming back on the Russian political and intellectual scene but also among the Turkic and Muslim elites in the Russian... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate
www.researchgate.net
Here's some other resources I've been reading about Eurasianism and Dugin:
Three Faces of Russia’s Neo-Eurasianism | Free to read
Enthusiasm for Russia’s Eurasian vocation has come at a time of uncertainty about the country’s prospects for modernisation.
www.iiss.org
The West Overestimates Aleksandr Dugin’s Influence in Russia - Providence
Proponents of the “Dugin the mastermind” argument need to substantiate their claims with evidence and ask themselves how effective, if at all, is Dugin at influencing Kremlin elites and Russian foreign policy.
providencemag.com
Four Myths about Russian Grand Strategy | The Post-Soviet Post | CSIS
After spending most of the 1990s and early 2000s rebuilding their state, regime, economy, and military after the traumatic Soviet collapse, Russia’s return to a central—and often disruptive—place in world politics has laid bare the folly of many scholars and policymakers who ignored Russia...
This link gives a summary of Dugin's Foundations of Geopolitics for those who are interested:
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I've been reading a lot about Eurasianism recently and was already aware of Dugin's fame. It appears journalists like to big him up as the brains behind Putin, while academics reject this as sensationalism.
I found an essay from Marlene Laruelle where she basically says Dugin's ideas can barely be described as Eurasianist in the traditional sense, as he seems to be a purely Western-style fascist as you say.
(PDF) The Two Faces of Contemporary Eurasianism: An Imperial Version of Russian Nationalism
PDF | The Eurasianist ideology is coming back on the Russian political and intellectual scene but also among the Turkic and Muslim elites in the Russian... | Find, read and cite all the research you need on ResearchGate
Here's some other resources I've been reading about Eurasianism and Dugin:
Three Faces of Russia’s Neo-Eurasianism | Free to read
Enthusiasm for Russia’s Eurasian vocation has come at a time of uncertainty about the country’s prospects for modernisation.
The West Overestimates Aleksandr Dugin’s Influence in Russia - Providence
Proponents of the “Dugin the mastermind” argument need to substantiate their claims with evidence and ask themselves how effective, if at all, is Dugin at influencing Kremlin elites and Russian foreign policy.
Four Myths about Russian Grand Strategy | The Post-Soviet Post | CSIS
After spending most of the 1990s and early 2000s rebuilding their state, regime, economy, and military after the traumatic Soviet collapse, Russia’s return to a central—and often disruptive—place in world politics has laid bare the folly of many scholars and policymakers who ignored Russia...www.csis.org
This link gives a summary of Dugin's Foundations of Geopolitics for those who are interested:
He's a great self promoter. His actual standing among Putin and those in his close orbit is far from the impression he gives. I haven't read it but she recently published a book called Is Russia Fascist? Unravelling Propaganda East and West, which I think examines some of the 'analysis' and reporting carried out by western journalists, and the Russian government's own projected image as an anti-fascist force in the world.
hitmouse
music obfuscation technology
Yeah, my impression was less that Dugin had Putin's ear in any particular sense and more that Putin saw the far-right as being a sometimes-useful political resource that he could deploy to achieve his own ends in some situations. Although I'm not really up enough on Russian far-right politics to know how far the likes of Barkashov, Gubarev or Petrovsky can be described as Duginist or whether they're something else?
frogwoman
No amount of cajolery...
Barkashov is more like traditional skinhead fash, celebrating Hitler's birthday etc. Don't know about the others.
CyberRose
أرفع الشفرات
I assume it's an expansion of this article she wrote:
Accusing Russia of Fascism
Memory wars around the interpretation of the Second World War/Great Patriotic War continue to rage between Central and Eastern European countries and Russia, with European…
eng.globalaffairs.ru
There's a rebuttal of sorts here (of her recent book, not necessarily the article above):
Chapman on Laruelle, 'Is Russia Fascist? Unraveling Propaganda East and West' | H-Net
Marlene Laruelle. Is Russia Fascist? Unraveling Propaganda East and West. Ithaca: Cornell University Press, 2021. 264 pp. $19.99 (e-book), ISBN 978-1-5017-5414-2; $39.95 (cloth), ISBN 978-1-5017-5413-5. Reviewed by Roger Chapman (Palm Beach Atlantic University) Published on H-Russia (June, 2021)...
I definitely agree with her about the lazy use of the word 'fascist' (she refers to Orwell's essay), there are a few things I'm not so sure about...
While I agree Putin cannot be compared to the Nazis, I'm not sure I agree that ultra-nationalism = Nazism/racism
I also wonder if this is quote hasn't aged well within the last week? (I'm not 100% what state regeneration means in this context, 'Make America Great Again', restoring national pride/place in the world, etc?)
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