brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
I see.
Census 2021
- Thread starter brogdale
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Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
If I say that I worship the Red Ape cos I am an Orangutanian, is it now a religion?
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Actually, come to think of it, I’m not so sure that the belief is necessary.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
The ONS are explicit that they are only asking about affiliation, not belief for the purpose of the census. It seems that the write-in inclusion policy is in response to the 2010 Equality Act.
So much of the argument above over the last few pages is redundant wrt this process. If you write in a religion it will contribute to the 'Other religion' data unless the ONS suspect that the write-ins are as a result of a concerted campaign. Hence the reason that they did disaggregate out the Jedi numbers.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
You're just proving you have no idea what you're talking about.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
“There are four kinds of people in this world: cretins, fools, morons, and lunatics…Cretins don’t even talk; they sort of slobber and stumble…Fools are in great demand, especially on social occasions. They embarrass everyone but provide material for conversation…Fools don’t claim that cats bark, but they talk about cats when everyone else is talking about dogs. They offend all the rules of conversation, and when they really offend, they’re magnificent…Morons never do the wrong thing. They get their reasoning wrong. Like the fellow who says that all dogs are pets and all dogs bark, and cats are pets, too, therefore cats bark…Morons will occasionally say something that’s right, but they say it for the wrong reason…A lunatic is easily recognized. He is a moron who doesn’t know the ropes. The moron proves his thesis; he has logic, however twisted it may be. The lunatic on the other hand, doesn’t concern himself at all with logic; he works by short circuits. For him, everything proves everything else. The lunatic is all idée fixe, and whatever he comes across confirms his lunacy. You can tell him by the liberties he takes with common sense, by his flashes of inspiration, and by the fact that sooner or later he brings up the Templars…There are lunatics who don’t bring up the Templars, but those who do are the most insidious. At first they seem normal, then all of a sudden…”
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
I can see the scope for confusion in respondents answering question 32:
There must have been a more straightforward way of constructing that question?
danny la rouge
More like *fanny* la rouge!
Come on folks. I know it’s a year in and we’re all tetchy, but this is really quite easy. I’ll give an example. I used to think that nobody really believed in a flat earth. They were joking. Trolling. Surely, right? And probably a lot are, but it turns out that we have now to accept that some are perfectly sincerely.
Similarly with Jedi. It started as a joke to troll the census. Hilarious japes. And for most it still is that: a joke. But what if for some it isn’t? What if they have rituals and worship, a philosophy to go with it. What if they know it came from a film but want to adopt it as their way of expressing spirituality? What makes it a religion. That it’s old? Nope. That it’s factual? What facts? The ceremonies are made up. So what? Aren’t they all
I know Episcopalians who call themselves Christian, who go to church, do the praying and singing, but as far as God goes they’re agnostic or even atheist. They’ll enter Christian in the census. Are their entries to be discounted?
Like I said, there’s a Church of John Coltrane. Do you get to determine it’s a joke? Do the ONS?
We don’t actually know if some Jedis are sincere or not. But what if some are?
Similarly with Jedi. It started as a joke to troll the census. Hilarious japes. And for most it still is that: a joke. But what if for some it isn’t? What if they have rituals and worship, a philosophy to go with it. What if they know it came from a film but want to adopt it as their way of expressing spirituality? What makes it a religion. That it’s old? Nope. That it’s factual? What facts? The ceremonies are made up. So what? Aren’t they all
I know Episcopalians who call themselves Christian, who go to church, do the praying and singing, but as far as God goes they’re agnostic or even atheist. They’ll enter Christian in the census. Are their entries to be discounted?
Like I said, there’s a Church of John Coltrane. Do you get to determine it’s a joke? Do the ONS?
We don’t actually know if some Jedis are sincere or not. But what if some are?
gentlegreen
I hummus, therefore I am ...
I don't remember that question
gentlegreen
I hummus, therefore I am ...
I suppose the online version means one never sees some questions ...
a_chap
When the world came apart, where were you?
Seems pretty well worded to me.
Serge Forward
Just enjoyin' my coffee.
Anti-nationalist obviously
I genuinely don't know how I would describe my national identity, and it's an interesting reflection. I wonder if this sense of ambivalence regading national identity that is undoubtedly felt by a great swathe of socially liberal and/or historically aware people in England is peculiar to the English or if it is a common phenomenon across other former colonial powers.
A380
How do I change this 'custom title' thing then?
Alderanian obvs.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
This census does, effectively, ask 2 questions about 'nationality'; one functional (Q 20 passports held, if any) and one (Q 14) about the respondent's perceived identity, and I agree that any question about 'national identity' put to those living in such a confused polity does deserve more thought than a cursory tick.
I'm pretty sure that, had the census coincided more closely with May's "...citizen of nowhere." comment, there'd have been a significant write-in for "the World" or "Nowhere".
National identity, like all identity, is contextual and I think the problem with the census question is that any context is missing. If I’m with Americans, I feel deeply English because I notice the national differences in behaviours and assumptions and they also act as if I am generally representative of English people. If I’m with a bunch of patriotic English people, however, I feel alien to them in terms of common archetype and even, due to my immigrant roots, potentially “unenglish”.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
I suppose this multi-dimensional nature of identity is one reason why the census developers have stuck with the Tick all that apply instruction?
Idaho
blah blah blah
I'll tick English. I'm certainly not Scottish or Welsh. British is much more a political identity than a cultural one, and with the decline of empire and devolution/independence, one that is increasingly anachronistic. I was born in England, I live in England, I sound English, I share (willingly or unwillingly) a bunch of cultural cues, customs and norms that are recognisably English to Scots or Welsh. I'm not an English nationalist, or any kind of nationalist, but that doesn't stop me being English.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
In the light of what you've said there, it's interesting to note that the tick-box option order has changed from the last Census (2011) with the "British" option now placed first.
Idaho
blah blah blah
Tories... Sigh...
Idaho
blah blah blah
That's not a national identity. That's an English person trying to avoid calling themselves English.
I think of myself as a southerner. The North and South of England have their own distinctiveness. It's all balls really.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
If you plan on responding to the census, you could use the write-in option for question 14 for that response.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Objectively that might be true, but the question actually invites respondents to describe their national identity. So, if that's how Kenny wants to describe it, I guess that's the correct response for him?
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
In the past, when I have responded to census requests, I have written in Kentish.
kenny g
Sheeple Awake!
If it is true objectively then that is good enough for me. "Urban" would be fitting for some.
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