Bitcoin discussion and news

[Idaho]

It would really amuse me if bitcoin became the means by which 'neo-socialist' states in the future chose to pay the citizens wage. Bitcoin, the Comrades Crypto.

I think that radical and anti establishment movements could be in great need of a permissionless currency - in a possible future where all money is electronic, and governments and other agencies can switch off your money with the click of a button.

 

[camouflage]

I think that radical and anti establishment movements could be in great need of a permissionless currency - in a possible future where all money is electronic, and governments and other agencies can switch off your money with the click of a button.

don't worry, governments only do that sort of thing to despicable rapey traitor scum that sell our secrets to enemies for free.

 

[camouflage]

There is a lot of interest and activity in blockchain in both the insurance and shipping industries.

There is also a vast amount of nonsense too. Using permissioned blockchains when they should just use databases.

something something property registration blockchain something.

 

[Idaho]

something something property registration blockchain something.

When does the ico launch? How much premine?

 

[phillm]

My miners pay for my electicity bills in the house, and they heat the house so i never have the heating on.


Will i go to hell?

No , don't worry there is no hell - what mining software do you use ?

 

[Ranbay]

No , don't worry there is no hell - what mining software do you use ?

NiceHash - Largest Crypto-Mining Marketplace

mines best coin at the time and converts to BTC, i have played about with Zcash and ETH but the fees to move to BTC always hit me.

i could do better in other pools but this is so easy to set up and use.

 

[phillm]

NiceHash - Largest Crypto-Mining Marketplace

mines best coin at the time and converts to BTC, i have played about with Zcash and ETH but the fees to move to BTC always hit me.

i could do better in other pools but this is so easy to set up and use.

cheers I'll give it a go - have just bought a mega gaming pc and Virgin Superfast broadband so I'll see how it goes.

 

[Ranbay]

cheers I'll give it a go - have just bought a mega gaming pc and Virgin Superfast broadband so I'll see how it goes.

No worries, you don't need fast internet it's all about the GPU's

I'm using 2 RX480 8Gb Radeon's and 2 x GTX 1050ti's in the other PC, you can also mine with the CPU but you don't get much from it.

 

[Idaho]

Virtual currency information wars! The future is odd. So bitmain and fellow travellers pump Bcash and dump btc while spam attacking the network. It's like the old days with coordinated ddos attacks and exchange dumps that used to happen 6 years ago - only it's not a quick buck, but potentially billions.

 

[bimble]

If you still had some ‘bitcoin cash’ sitting there since the fork happened because you hadn’t gotten around to figuring out what any of it means, what would you do - turn it into bitcoins ?

 

[Idaho]

What I might do could be very different to what you might do with the same information, and both might be totally wrong.

 

[bimble]

It's all so completely bizarre. When the fork happened this 'bitcoin cash' stuff appeared like a mirror image of the bitcoin, and now that has a value, like if i were to sell it I could get actual money for these magic beans that i never even asked for. Madness, surely.

 

[Idaho]

It is madness. Money is arbitrary, the only prerequisite is consensus - and that is a fragile thing.

 

[camouflage]

It's all so completely bizarre. When the fork happened this 'bitcoin cash' stuff appeared like a mirror image of the bitcoin, and now that has a value, like if i were to sell it I could get actual money for these magic beans that i never even asked for. Madness, surely.

Somebody somewhere values it (the cryptocrats behind it for example, or the value perceived in the plans and investments of the relevant big-blocker big-shots).

You could just play The Winchester move, and see what happens.

 

[Idaho]

The best mining hardware can only be bought with bch. And it is the currency pushed by the same company. Hopefully the Japanese will be able to sell their asics soon in 2018 and there will be a break up of the Chinese mining operation. Bitmain could do with going the same way as Mtgox.

 

[camouflage]

 

[bimble]

google is not helping. Is that a bit like mornington crescent?

 

[Idaho]

You have bitcoin gold as well as Bcash. But bitcoin gold isn't worth much.

 

[camouflage]

google is not helping. Is that a bit like mornington crescent?

edited image to be more explicit in regards to The Winchester Strategy.

 

[bimble]

That is sage advice, thanks.

 

[butchersapron]

newbie

Bitcoin Mining Now Consuming More Electricity Than 159 Countries Including Ireland & Most Countries In Africa

(Ta to fozzie for link)

 

[newbie]

newbie

Bitcoin Mining Now Consuming More Electricity Than 159 Countries Including Ireland & Most Countries In Africa

(Ta to fozzie for link)

How depressing 30% growth in Bitcoin power consumption in the last month.

This is of global significance. Can anyone suggest what mechanism can influence it? Peer pressure is obviously not going to work, as this thread shows the project is more important than any 'warning to humanity' from 15,000 scientists.

Yet it's just the beginning of mainstream adoption

 

[teqniq]

What with our innate greed - yes gross generalisation I know but still... Can't see it stopping until there's no bitcoin left to mine or some unforeseen crash/flaw in the currency causes the bottom to fall out of the market.

 

[newbie]

What with our innate greed - yes gross generalisation I know but still... Can't see it stopping until there's no bitcoin left to mine or some unforeseen crash/flaw in the currency causes the bottom to fall out of the market.

No, and it seems unlikely collective will, whether from populations, governments or the 'markets' can control it, as it's designed to prevent that.

I'm not a fan of extrapolating trends but I just did it anyway: at 30% growth per month in a couple of years all the electricity in the world will be used for Bitcoin

 

[DotCommunist]

I suppose the nature of these currencies means they are going to be inherently resistant to any regulatory measures- theres no will from the people using it themselves either. Ranbays 'I don't care' is probably common and with an extra 'keep yer fuckin nose out' from those who are particularly zealous about its crypto/'free' nature

 

[Idaho]

I think crypto could be regulated in a number of ways to make them more energy efficient. But that is under the remit of national governments. It's only really bitcoin that is super wasteful. Some other protocols are pretty efficient - but significantly they are not provably as secure.

If it doesn't all collapse in the next year, what we will see is significantly more efficient mining technology and many thousand times more transactions possible on the same infrastructure. I think it's approaching peak wastefulness - and predictions that it will use more energy than the sun in x years are dramatic.

It's not unlike the early days of Google when each search used the same amount of electricity as boiling a kettle.

 

[newbie]

I think crypto could be regulated in a number of ways to make them more energy efficient. But that is under the remit of national governments.

So let us suppose the UN debates the problem and unanimously calls on national governments to implement controls. Leaving aside the underground, unregulated by design, nature of the beast, how many decades before anything significant can be achieved? The first world climate change conference was in 1979.

It's only really bitcoin that is super wasteful. Some other protocols are pretty efficient - but significantly they are not provably as secure.

And Bitcoin is by far the best known and most popular

If it doesn't all collapse in the next year, what we will see is significantly more efficient mining technology and many thousand times more transactions possible on the same infrastructure. I think it's approaching peak wastefulness

and yet the number of transactions rises inexorably, as does the cost per transaction. And the price and the profile among the public. It's not mainstream yet but as the billboard photo and the adverts on the tube, show, it's getting there.

So how have we got to peak wastefulness? (unless you're returning to the discussion above, which turns 1 on-chain transaction into two in order to introduce lots of intermediary, but less secure, off-chain transactions of dubious utility). What mechanism will lead to the project moving into lower wastefulness? Just more efficient technology? You need 30% a month efficiency improvments just to stand still, that's way outside anything Moores law predicts.

predictions that it will use more energy than the sun in x years are dramatic.

of course. But I can write 30% increase per month until I'm blue in the face and not dent enthusiasm for the project.

It's not unlike the early days of Google when each search used the same amount of electricity as boiling a kettle.

It's hard to know how much of an urban myth that is. Google say
PUE = Power Usage Effectiveness
Google can achieve that because they're centralised and can set strategic direction. Nothing within the Bitcoin project can do so and anyway it's based on individual greed so pretty impervious to any external pressure.

 

[Idaho]

I was reading some assessment that said data processing now accounts for 7% of global power use. In total, crypto currency processing accounts for 0.2%. Efficiency is needed in so many aspects of human behaviour - and perhaps we have already screwed it.

Electricity production and use is not all equal. If we could manage peak use better, we could reduce production by huge amounts.

 

[Idaho]

My concern about bitcoin right now is that people who are desperate/hopeful might get scammed, lose money or lose too much in the inevitable crash.

When it was all just a fringe and fanciful interest, it seemed harmless because it was most likely doomed. The more likely it becomes mainstream, the more daunting I perceive it.

 

[camouflage]

anyway it's based on individual greed

And fear, never forget the fear side of the market- fear of missing out on potential gains, fear of losing money invested, fear of bear traps etc.