Supine
Newt Member
perhaps that could be avoided by forming a union of nation states that collaborate together
The big Brexit thread - news, updates and discussion
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perhaps that could be avoided by forming a union of nation states that collaborate together
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
One does wonder how AstraZeneca producing the vaccine on a not for profit basis as opposed to Pfizer and Moderna who are taking a handsome profit is clouding some of the EU’s people’s judgment here, with no profit being anathema to the EU.
TopCat
Putin fanboy
I was looking at European papers too.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
The priority groups are actually decided by each members state , not by the EU, and vary. Can you imagine the outcry if they weren't?
bimble
floofy
Do you seriously wonder this? Like the reason there’s a row about the contract is cos EU people are cross that it’s a non profit vaccine because EU people like profit? I don’t think so .
teuchter
je suis teuchter
Yes, seems a bit far fetched to me.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
No profit is anathema in the EU, even rates of 1000% are seen as acceptable
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
Oh I wasn't counterposing the UK as any different
Can't see Boris Johnson coming out with Edward heath's comment about the unacceptable face of capitalism
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
Why do you think there is a row? Why are they singling out AstraZeneca when the Pfizer vaccine is suffering similar issues? I am not suggesting that they are pissed off about the not for profit nature of the AstraZeneca one, they are pissed off at the UK seemingly having a better time of things just after the divorce, in the same way as many abusive former partners get the hump in similar situations and plot all sorts of nasty shit to be heaped upon the ex-partner. I do think that the not for profit nature of it does instinctively put neo-liberal backs up in such as way that they are distrustful of it, so any issues with it riles them more than it otherwise would or should.
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
I don't think that's right at all, I think they honestly think they should come first and are blind to how this looks
Supine
Newt Member
You dont honestly believe the AZ is not for profit do you?
There are billions of pounds to play for with covid vaccines.
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
Seeing as the fucking thing is not even approved for use within the EU, you may well be right.
magneze
🎧
The vaccine isn't even approved in the EU.
Looks like the EU completely fucked it all up vaccine-wise and Britain & AstraZeneca are a convenient scapegoat. The EU don't go after Pfizer even though it's a similar situation because it's a US company - they go after the smaller. Bullies, in short.
I'm not defending our government here. Given the same situation they'd do the same.
However, I can't see the government backing down at all here. The vaccine is basically the ONLY thing that might be going ok COVID-19 wise.
Looks like the EU completely fucked it all up vaccine-wise and Britain & AstraZeneca are a convenient scapegoat. The EU don't go after Pfizer even though it's a similar situation because it's a US company - they go after the smaller. Bullies, in short.
I'm not defending our government here. Given the same situation they'd do the same.
However, I can't see the government backing down at all here. The vaccine is basically the ONLY thing that might be going ok COVID-19 wise.
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
You dont honestly believe the AZ is not for profit do you?
It is at least until July 2021. Two reasons, they took a lot of public money to develop it (a larger % was private dough though), and they want to get it out all over the world, including the poorest nations as soon as possible. This is why it was developed to be stored in a regular fridge, the Pfizer one is no good for most of the developing world due to the need to store it at -70. Moderna by compression took all its funding from the public purse and intends to return profits to shareholders. Which is nice.
andysays
Love and solidarity
it's almost like they (those in positions of power within the EU, not the general population) are in the habit of using their economic power to get their own way in negotiations and other deals, and are genuinely confused when that doesn't work (and yes, I'm sure the British government would love to be able to do the same thing too)
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
You say that like it's a bad thing
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
Earlier in the month I was trying to find out costs of the vaccine. The European Commission did a press release on January 8th re vaccine negotiations in which it said
kebabking
Not a Girly Swot, but I like them....
I think I'll probably put my money on AZ TBH - they write contracts about vaccines all the time, and had three months prior experience with the UK contract, while the Commission have none of that, and both they and the member states are taking huge political heat for the vaccine program within the EU (in the many ways that manifests itself) being an absolute gangfuck.
I think the EU have fucked it, some of the member states have fucked it - and as Bahnhof Strasse suggests - there's a lot of political bitterness within the EU about Brexit.
There's an old political maxim that I like: if you offend someone enough they'll believe anything. I think there's enough bitterness and rancour about that the EU has allowed by itself to plunge down some rabbit holes.
bimble
floofy
It’s all very interesting, vaccines in a pandemic isn’t like a trade war over idk the price of fish.
Just had a google and see that India’s started exporting their own licensed AZ vaccine with a lot of look at us how we are helping you our poor neighbours. it’s all going to grind on for years and be massively political, of course.
Just had a google and see that India’s started exporting their own licensed AZ vaccine with a lot of look at us how we are helping you our poor neighbours. it’s all going to grind on for years and be massively political, of course.
MickiQ
In My Defence I was left Unsupervised
At the end of the day no-one wants to be labelled as the 'Bad Guy' here. There will be a public pissing contest between AZ & the EU with the UK Govt sticking its oar in to muddy the water. However over the next couple of days a compromise that no-one likes but they can all accept will get worked out.
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
It gets curiouser and curiouser . I'm not sure how exactly these things work but last week the European Ombudsman started an inquiry into the European Commissions contracts with vaccine suppliers over two complaints .One relating to the Commission allegedly denying access to its COVID-19 vaccine contract with AstraZeneca, the first contract which the Commission signed last year.The second complaint is about the Commission’s reported refusal to disclose documents related to the vaccine negotiations.
Earlier this month, the Commission invited MEPs to read a redacted version of the CureVac contract ( one of six syuppliers to the EU) under strict conditions in a reading room of the European Parliament. The five other contracts remain confidential, with neither MEPs nor the general public having any access to the texts. .
Earlier this month, the Commission invited MEPs to read a redacted version of the CureVac contract ( one of six syuppliers to the EU) under strict conditions in a reading room of the European Parliament. The five other contracts remain confidential, with neither MEPs nor the general public having any access to the texts. .
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
Yep. As far as I can tell so far, the UK signed contracts months before the EU, took the risk, now the EU are saying give us some of that stuff you've paid for or else.
If it needs stating, I'm no fan of our govt or Brexit but the EU are clearly in the wrong here. Why don't they throw some money at it and sort out AZ's supply chain problem over there.
I think the UK govt and rightly so are staying out of it. Well unless AZ go back on the contract they have with the UK. This is only making the EU look bad.
Raheem
Well-Known Member
It's not a throw-money type problem. afaict, they had a batch at their plant in Belgium which went awry and yielded only a small amount of vaccine, meaning there are just fewer doses available than they projected.
Bahnhof Strasse
Met up with Hannah Courtoy a week next Tuesday
Because this isn't about getting their hands on the vaccine and more demonstrating that the EU as a block is a better proposition than countries acting unilaterally. We'll be seeing this crap happening for years to come. Invest in popcorn and deckchairs.
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