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The 2024 UK General Election - news, speculation and updates

Given the deprivation of not having Sky as a kid, surely he should now be known as ‘No-dishy Rishi’?
Paupers eat crisps Rishi, tell them you snack on fried swan wings, prepared on a bed of sun ripened seraphim and ushered into a vacuum sealed bag, left to ferment in the wine cellar of a plutocrat, near the open graves
 
It's the assumption that people have to send their kids to private schools and Labour's threatening that.

Had the Tories not spent the past 14 years utterly fucking over the state school sector these parents might not feel that their local comp is such a shitpit and they should have to shell out £30k a year. But this is all Labour's fault.

Not very bright, these private school types.

I think it's simpler than that. Most people don't like losing their privilege and advantage over the masses. Course they try to make it more sympathetic in tone than that but end up offending working class people anyway, with their I only want the best for my children stuff. (i.e. Not like you plebs who haven't the gumption or are too lazy too earn 100k + PA.)
 
State schools vary enormously in quality, many return results that will match up against any private ones, others not so much.
The private school is our only choice argument doesn't stand up, Youngest Q's boyfriend went to Repton and got a good education but it cost his parents something like £10k a term. Youngest went to a state school and got into the same Uni (Where they met) which cost me nothing. (Well it did but her actual education cost me nowt)
I reckon I got the better deal there.
 
State schools vary enormously in quality, many return results that will match up against any private ones, others not so much.
The private school is our only choice argument doesn't stand up, Youngest Q's boyfriend went to Repton and got a good education but it cost his parents something like £10k a term. Youngest went to a state school and got into the same Uni (Where they met) which cost me nothing. (Well it did but her actual education cost me nowt)
I reckon I got the better deal there.
About 47% of students get a grade five or above in English (IE. a c or better) in state schools. I don't know figures for private schools but you'd want your money back if it was that low. It worked out well for your daughter, but I bet having a teacher (even a maths teacher) for a mum helped.

Unless you believe that state school students are somehow more gifted in the first place then there's a difference to account for there.
 
I would imagine that any private school teacher who lost their jobs due to the VAT on private schools will then become one of the 6500 state teachers paid for by said tax. Mrs Q retires end of this school year so there's a vacancy for a qualified maths teacher straightaway that will need filling.
Not quite that straight forward...

1) A chunk of private school teachers are unqualified.

2)A chunk couldn't/wouldn't/shouldn't work with larger classes and the increased challenges of young people living in poverty.

3) A significant chunk of state schools (those headed by insecure young white men) would be absolutely terrified of the 'better' private school teachers calling them out on their ineffective bullshit.
 
About 47% of students get a grade five or above in English (IE. a c or better) in state schools. I don't know figures for private schools but you'd want your money back if it was that low. It worked out well for your daughter, but I bet having a teacher (even a maths teacher) for a mum helped.

Unless you believe that state school students are somehow more gifted in the first place then there's a difference to account for there.
Like I said it varies enormously the pass rate at Mrs Q's school is about 85% well above national average. There are lots of schools much lower that drag the national state average down. The difference can be explained in one word which is resources. VAT on private schools will go some way to provide those resources for those state schools that lack them.
 
So are you for or against the VAT thing?
Neither really. If it raises a bit of revenue great, but all it'll do is bottom slice the private sector marginally. A few - already struggling - schools at the bottom end of the hierarchy might close. A few m/c families might switch to State, but elite reproduction will be utterly untouched.
 
Ftr I'm currently working in a "top" private school. I want them abolished and made illegal. But I think the VAT thing isn't a step towards this.
Grabbing from the wrong end. The Truly Rich will just offshore them, the Merely Rich kids will still have tutors and extracurricular activities that put them well ahead of a working class student of the same general level of intelligence. The system whereby the State schools are starved of funding is what needs to be changed. Abolishing private schools won't do that. We need to get to a place where choosing to go to a private school is because daddy went there and they have a pool, not because the educational support is superior.
 
You could make education twice as good in state schools as in private without changing the basic fact that middle class parents don’t want their kids to go to big school with working class kids.
 
Grabbing from the wrong end. The Truly Rich will just offshore them, the Merely Rich kids will still have tutors and extracurricular activities that put them well ahead of a working class student of the same general level of intelligence. The system whereby the State schools are starved of funding is what needs to be changed. Abolishing private schools won't do that. We need to get to a place where choosing to go to a private school is because daddy went there and they have a pool, not because the educational support is superior.
Assuming just minute that is not the main reason people do use private schools - how is this a good place to aspire to?

Abolish private schools, take their resources and support education for all.
 
You could make education twice as good in state schools as in private without changing the basic fact that middle class parents don’t want their kids to go to big school with working class kids.
I'd be absolutely fine by that. It's the education that matters. Deconstructing the class system is a bigger project and schools shouldn't be the front line for it.
 
What is this drivel - education is a key part of the construction of social capital, leaving it to one side when trying to "deconstruct the class system" is ludicrous
You've got my point backwards. One is something that can be fixed in the short term, the other is not. Making students suffer poor education because your big social re-engineering project is going to take decades is pretty unfair.

Edit: Probably deserving of its own thread, sorry for dragging the election thread off topic.
 
You could make education twice as good in state schools as in private without changing the basic fact that middle class parents don’t want their kids to go to big school with working class kids.
Perhaps the parents should be doing national service as school support staff for a reeducation exercise.


ETA. can't make the sentence better right now. soz.
 
I'd be absolutely fine by that. It's the education that matters. Deconstructing the class system is a bigger project and schools shouldn't be the front line for it.
Yeah, I'd say that. It's also not just for the resources that people go to private schools - my dad had a stockbroker friend (he started off with a stockbroking job out of uni but decided to go for something with less money he enjoyed more) and my mum says she remembers a conversation where they were talking abouy getting their kids into Rodean and Eton. This couple basically said 'It's OK for your kids, they're academic but ours will need the connections'.
 
What "poor education" are students suffering? If you mean state provision 93% have to "suffer" that now.

Urgh, scratch a liberal
So it's fine then. Nothing to argue over, apparently. Losing 10% of the education budget in real terms while the number of students increased was just that fat in the system the politicians like to cut and they were right to do so. You're aware that there's already a class system in public education? In more prosperous areas, state schools regularly ask for, and get, contributions from the parents towards things like stationary and tissues and whatnot. Let alone the computers bought during Covid time. You think the education system is fine and fuck the schools where parents can't afford that. That doesn't sound like you.
 
Quite an amusing Guardian piece about the vermins' shitshow campaign

1718271029241.png

Particularly drawn to this para:
Some public events have also seemed poorly attended. The official photo for the campaign launch in Winchester for Flick Drummond, formerly the MP for the now-abolished seat of Meon Valley, showed fewer than two dozen people – one of whom was another former MP, Desmond Swayne – plus a cardboard cutout of Margaret Thatcher.

and, lo, here is the said campaign launch in all its glory...

1718271295635.png
 
So it's fine then. Nothing to argue over, apparently. Losing 10% of the education budget in real terms while the number of students increased was just that fat in the system the politicians like to cut and they were right to do so. You're aware that there's already a class system in public education? In more prosperous areas, state schools regularly ask for, and get, contributions from the parents towards things like stationary and tissues and whatnot. Let alone the computers bought during Covid time. You think the education system is fine and fuck the schools where parents can't afford that. That doesn't sound like you.
This is an argument for comprehensive education, no? If a large chunk of the richest 20 percent of parents consistently opt out of the state system, their local state schools are being deprived of the parents who could be helping most.
 
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