knife violence and murders among youth

[Edie]

It’s out of touch with reality that tool thefts are a given but a small protest against a business heralds a major response?

The fracking stuff?

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Exactly mate.

 

[Edie]

For the record, I don’t think business should be protected disproportionately by the police. They *should* be a community resource. That’s no doubt naive from the opposite direction.

 

[Pickman's model]

It would be nice if business was a community resource but that'd need a great change in business outlook

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Police will always protect the flow of capital over the individual. Yet we fund them through taxation.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

It would be nice if business was a community resource but that'd need a great change in business outlook

In an ideal world but we don’t inhabit that yet.

 

[Pickman's model]

In an ideal world but we don’t inhabit that yet.

I love it when you tell me what I've just said

 

[Magnus McGinty]

I love it when you tell me what I've just said

#metoo

 

[Magnus McGinty]

But you argue as if it is the present, pickmans.

 

[Pickman's model]

#metoo

Maybe you could get a parrot or parakeet as your avatar

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Maybe you could get a parrot or parakeet as your avatar

I’ll make sure it has Ba hons in several subjects.

 

[Pickman's model]

I’ll make sure it has Ba hons in several subjects.

You do that

 

[Magnus McGinty]

I’m thinking of how a modern day Punch and Judy show would pan out. You’ve got the guy and his wife with a baby. He’s stressed out by work but also having his tools nicked. The policeman doesn’t exist. The crocodile lowers his wages and the left all laugh without any answers.
Catch you in Blackpool.

 

[GarveyLives]

​

 

[andysays]

In response to the calls earlier in the thread for the police to 'do something', here's the 'something' you wanted

London's Metropolitan Police force considers armed foot patrols

The Metropolitan Police is considering deploying armed officers on foot patrols to prevent violence in areas "where gang activity is likely".

In the memo seen by the BBC, email recipients were told the idea of armed police on foot patrol was part of a "recent internal discussion" into how to reduce violent deaths in the capital. If adopted, the armed patrols would be "based on an informed and reliable intelligence picture of where gang activity is likely", only be done in "full consultation with the local policing borough" and be used as a "temporary measure for short periods of time", the memo stated.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

For the record, I don’t think business should be protected disproportionately by the police. They *should* be a community resource. That’s no doubt naive from the opposite direction.

Coming back to this and the potential role for police in society, I think there are three distinct positive roles the police are potentially asked to play.

The first is to act as 'the long arm of the law'. So the bloke who had his tools nicked can report it to the police and the police can investigate and potentially catch the thieves and retrieve the tools.

The second is to act as the 999 emergency service, so there is a fight, the police are called and have the resources and training to do something about it.

The third is 'crime prevention', and this is where I think there can be unrealistic views. The police don't, and can't, keep us safe in this direct way. For the vast majority of our lives, there is no police officer anywhere in sight. To an extent we need to look out for one another, but also we need to trust in our society - the vast majority of people are not out to get us. When there are calls for more of this third role for the police because society has broken down to the extent that people feel unsafe in their own streets, that is when my antennae start whirring. Many so-called crime prevention measures in response to this, such as stop and search, just make matters worse. Many others, including covert operations, severely impinge on our freedoms without making us any safer, and very often are carried out primarily in the interests of the fourth and very important role that the police play in our society - namely to protect the property and authority of those in power.

 

[DotCommunist]

In response to the calls earlier in the thread for the police to 'do something', here's the 'something' you wanted

London's Metropolitan Police force considers armed foot patrols

guns will deffo solve things, we can just look to americas eerily crime free cities

 

[treelover]

The IWCA FB site claims there were 69000 knife woundings of young people in the first half of 2018, that is an awful lot and if correct surely merits the title 'crisis'

doesn't provide a source.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

Probably a separate thing but thought I’d ask.

Is “County Lines” really a new thing or just a new-ish term for something that’s long happened in some form, latched onto by a media that loves such catch-phrases? Ta.

 

[Pickman's model]

Probably a separate thing but thought I’d ask.

Is “County Lines” really a new thing or just a new-ish term for something that’s long happened in some form, latched onto by a media that loves such catch-phrases? Ta.

I think it's when people go from eg London to Essex to flog drugs, crossing to a different police area

 

[Manter]

I think it's when people go from eg London to Essex to flog drugs, crossing to a different police area

Surely they’ve always done that? I vaguely remember there was some programme on TV in the ?80s where an inspector somewhere up north was talking about dealers from another city and the trouble is was causing. I’m sure dealers are bright enough to look at a map and identify that the rest of the country exists...

 

[Pickman's model]

Surely they’ve always done that? I vaguely remember there was some programme on TV in the ?80s where an inspector somewhere up north was talking about dealers from another city and the trouble is was causing. I’m sure dealers are bright enough to look at a map and identify that the rest of the country exists...

Yeh it's strange it's become such a thing recently

 

[OneStrike]

Probably a separate thing but thought I’d ask.

Is “County Lines” really a new thing or just a new-ish term for something that’s long happened in some form, latched onto by a media that loves such catch-phrases? Ta.

It has always happened but I think it is now a known thing, by that I mean it is a common strategy for dealers to generate revenue. Its odd, but dealers from Wolverhampton have been trading in Aberdeen for as long as I can remember, not necessarily adopting the cuckoo approach but its an established line none the less. The county lines thing is bogus as criminal history is littered with gangsters trying to move in on new territory (every city in the midlands has a 'repelled the Krays' story). The cuckoo thing is not new, but in the climate we have now it is a specific problem, gangs will always exploit the vulnerable but now it has a name the public can label it.

 

[Treacle Toes]

I don't think it's the cockoo-ing as if it's a new thing that is drawing attention tbh. It's the amount of it going on now and that it's generally young people/children being exploited/used to do it. The recent conviction for child trafficking speaks volumes.

 

[OneStrike]

The kids getting expelled from education fuel this problem, society gives up on them rather than applying some resources to see how we can help. Bombed out of school at 14 and labelled a wrong'un? What the hell do you do when your mum can't afford the heating bill and the rug rats won't stop screaming? Big bad Tr#v has plenty of cash and needs a labourer, you just need to relocate to Bournemouth for 4 days a week. Before you know it, things are on top.

 

[Cid]

The IWCA FB site claims there were 69000 knife woundings of young people in the first half of 2018, that is an awful lot and if correct surely merits the title 'crisis'

doesn't provide a source.

Sounds very unlikely... Parliament research briefings has total knife crime 2017/18 at around 40,000, with 5,000 hospital admissions. Maybe there's bias and under reporting creeping in there, and obviously some young people just wouldn't go to hospital. But I've no idea where you'd get accurate statistics on how much of an effect that has.

5050 hospital admissions/year is still awful mind you.

 

[love detective]

The BMJ Open data echoes [that] the most common time of day for violence is after school. In 2018 so far, our data across London, Nottingham and Birmingham shows 30% of weapon-enabled assaults occur between 4pm to 8pm.”

Jackie Sebire, the National Police Chiefs’ Council spokeswoman on violent crime, warned last week that children as young as nine and 10 were carrying out knife assaults. Levels of violence she had not seen in her 26-year career were leading to scenes reminiscent of “the Wild West,” said Sebire, the assistant chief constable of Bedfordshire police.
In all, 69,000 children aged between 10 and 15 were wounded as a result of being stabbed or injured in some other way in the year to June.

Knife crime: stagger school leaving times, say London doctors
Under 16s are at highest risk of being stabbed going home from school, UK study finds

 

[Dogsauce]

I don't think it's the cockoo-ing as if it's a new thing that is drawing attention tbh. It's the amount of it going on now and that it's generally young people/children being exploited/used to do it. The recent conviction for child trafficking speaks volumes.

I think Leeds used to get a lot of stuff coming across from Liverpool & Manchester, but this was always older scary types, not kids, and I don't think there was much aggro associated with it, just settled supply lines. I guess this was before the prevalence of mobile phones so different levels of supply would have been developed as personal relationships, you couldn't just nick a phone off someone to take over their business. Definitely think the use of kids and the territorial aspect of it is a newer development.

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

I don't think it's the cockoo-ing as if it's a new thing that is drawing attention tbh. It's the amount of it going on now and that it's generally young people/children being exploited/used to do it. The recent conviction for child trafficking speaks volumes.

Yep, strikes me there’s nothing new to geographical diversity, but the grooming problem has worsened. Austerity plays a huge role - a social Darwinist policy with the added bonus of the poor killing each other in line with the same ideology.

 

[GarveyLives]

​