Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
No, you call us up and we make an appointment to help you over the phone
Census 2021
- Thread starter brogdale
- Start date
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
They can do it on the phone. Getting a bit fed of repeating myself here. Go have a read up on it
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
tbh, just saying things like 'they can do it' doesn't really fit with my experience of the life of isolated, confused older/vulnerable people.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
It's not me; it's my confused, isolated 90 YO parents.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
as just said, they wont be asking about personal information on the doorstep. And, yes, the census requires personal information, so do a fuck of a lot of things, because sometimes it is useful and necessary.
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
It will be explained, I’m sure
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
Are they typing your words?
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
OK, hmmm
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
You’re asking these dumb questions not them
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
I don't think they're dumb questions.
As a helper, do you really think they are?
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
Yes, from you. But not from people who struggle with tech or cannot access the information themselves
They will be asking about personal information. They will be asking a confused older person to fill out a form with their personal information and send it off to an address. This comprises an action in the set of actions “asking about personal information”
Now, I don’t have a problem with the census. I’ll certainly be filling it out myself. It definitely facilitates the exercise of power in order to control the populace but its position on the list of things that do this, I doubt manages to get into the six figures.
This isn’t about doing the census, though, it’s about how you engage with the public. The messages you give to people are important. They need to be clear and consistent. The clear and consistent message that benefits those more confused by the modern world is: don’t give your data to people. This is the issue you need to work around to deal with the problem of how to record the details of confused older people. And you don’t solve any problem by simply pretending it’s not a problem!
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
I'd give yourself a little while to think about what you've just said there, tbh.
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
You are able to find these things out by Googling. Not everyone is IT literate. Some may not even be aware of the census. You are and have had plenty of time to find out the answers to the questions you’ve been asking.
If you called up the helpline and I answer I would help you.
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
Fuck off, I’m good at my job. You are finally going on ignoreThus spake Orang Utan, legendary non-empath. The perfect man to have on a helpline
Ah. Irony from the man that delights in throwing totally unprovoked personal insults at me out of context on innocent, non-confrontational threads. It’s okay apparently to say all sorts to me, but calling you a non-empath sends you over the edge.
I’m delighted for you to not engage with anything I say. I can’t remember anything positive ever once having come of it.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
this is all very confused, Are you saying that elderly people should never confirm their name? As that clearly falls within your set of actions “asking about personal information.” That would be a tad foolish, to say the least.
Such people will be dealt with sympathetically, attempts can be made to help them find someone they would be comfortable with supporting them to fill it in (when that is legal). Any workers, and the form itself, will be clearly identified as 'important government information' or somesuch and there will be a wide variety of methods available to check it is official. With any such exercise there is a small risk of someone trying to scam it, pretend to be a worker to gain access so it is probably wise to make sure they know all about it in advance, as far as practicable, and that officers are not meant to be entering houses.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
OK.
The questions I've asked you are the ones that I've not been able to find out from google, like how will the state necessarily know that my old Mum & Dad are confused, knackered and not bothered.
The stuff i have been able to find out from Google is this; if they don't get to engage with the census return as the state wants, this will happen:
An Adecco recruited fieldworker will call at their door to offer "assisted digital" entry
- I encourage them not to answer the door unless they know who it is
- but, supposing they do answer, the fieldworker proposes to enter their data at 2m distance from their doorstep
- they're both deaf (to some degree) so this would involve a conversation, at some considerable volume, about their personal details with their front door open for half an hour (?) in March
- this will all occur on the public pavement outside their terraced house, possibly in front of passers by and/or neighbours
I don’t think that the census workers themselves are the issue here. And I don’t think it’s an insoluble problem either. I was objecting to the blanket insistence that there was nothing to be solved in the first place.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
Why ae you asking a question which has already been answered? When you first asked it. I refer you back to that.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
you were the only person who thought there were any such blanket insistence.
Oh come on. Both you and OU were saying (and OU still is saying) that brogdale’s parents don’t present a difficulty because somebody will just knock on their door and couldn’t apparently see any issue with this solution at all. Plus they can just Google and/or phone a helpline.
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
or perhaps we are just a bit sick of brogdale's dubious doubts. Beyond that, such issues aren't new. Usually there is a neighbour or family member who is happy to help them, which is obviously trickier at the moment, but quite possible if they have care needs and are thus allowed visitors.
Right. But we aren’t in that state right now and that presents a unique problem. To me, it seems that the whole process should have been delayed a year until that was not the case.
Orang Utan
Psychick Worrier Ov Geyoor
I agree that it shouldn’t be happening this year and that Addeco should have their contract withdrawn. But it’s too late for that now
belboid
Exasperated, not angry.
as I said at the beginning, this is part of why i think there is a tory plot to make it a bit rubbish as an excuse to do away with it. Which is why it is depressing to see some going along with them.
brogdale
Coming to terms with late onset Anarchism
No, that question hasn't been answered at all.
You said that "they can ask for a form" which makes many assumptions about how they might perceive what they're being asked to do, their ability to analyse what they're told and act on that.
Ultimately, if they fail to comply in the way that the Adecco recruit wants, they will be asked to divulge personal details on their doorstep on the public footpath outside their house.
That seems like a pretty shabby position to be put in when you're 90 and confused about most things.
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