Beating the Fascists: The authorised history of Anti-Fascist Action

[Casually Red]

 

[bignose1]

in off the red (action)

Are we going for a snooker/anti-fascist pun fest:-

Or should we give it a rest...

 

[Joe Reilly]

"I remember Red Action used to go around attacking, erm, fascist supporters. When if in fact you saw one side attacking the other you couldn't tell the difference. I'm not in favour of one group going around attacking another, as it reduces yourself to their level.

Red Action, I mean, I could see their value in terms of stewarding meetings and defensive action. But I think there were some people in Red Action who got quiet a bit over excited and enjoyed a bit of action. They didn't seem that concerned or strong about any of the issues.

I remember once chairing a meeting on Kurdistan or Iran and the fascists came to try and break up the meeting. At various points Red Action came in the meeting, well, I couldn't tell the difference.

'We're Red Action' <said in a tough, working class sounding/goblin voice>.
'Yep, okay. They went that way <points>'. Just please don't come in hear, stay out. They were all like this <hits fist into palm>.'

It was quiet funny really. 'They went that way'."

You rather get the impression it wasn't the first time this anecdote was recalled. It would no doubt have gone down a treat a dinner parties particularly in reassuring the type of anti-fascist who never would or could throw a punch, that not unlike Jeremy, should the situation arise, it is they rather than the 'over excitable' lower orders who would prove cooler under fire. The officer class you see.

The 'couldn't tell the difference between them' which he repeats more than once brings to mind an accusation from Linda Bellos directed at a RA member that he dressed 'like a fascist'.

What did she mean?

What she actually meant is that he dressed a like any other youthful member of the working class. That like her he was of mixed race didn't matter a whit - for her as for Jeremy, the RA member in question really couldn't expect to be trusted unless he was dressed properly which is to say - in a way that would allow him to pass muster as a lefty (student in all probability).

Finally a message of solidarity from Jeremy to the immigrants or left-wingers having their heads stove in by the Golden Dawn on a daily basis.

"Even if you lose and eye - you always have another one". No matter the provocation it is better to be blinded than 'sink [organise] to their level'."

Throaty cheers from Golden Dawn.

 

[Fedayn]

What she actually meant is that he dressed a like any other youthful member of the working class.

That attitude still exists in all it's idiocy today and was fully in evidence whenever the SDL have tried to do something 'notable' in Glasgow.

 

[Casually Red]

Having read the above there really is ..admittedly in my often emotional opinion..a serious argument for physical force antifacism to stand back for a bit and let the fascists do a year zero on the wooly jumper brigade . Out ofthe ashes of their physical elimination a phoenix of sorts would hopefully arise . Failing that they deserve a good kicking anyway .

I reckon .

 

[LiamO]

Ho Ho Ho. Yes, tempting isn't it?

This was always the dilemna for Red Action.
Whether to back off and let the fash at the lefties, who forcefully told us - in the absence of any actual fascist presence of course - that they did not need and certainly did not want us around.

The problem being that a) at every event organised by woolly liberal-lefties there would always be a number of genuine working class people perhaps attending their first political event... how could you justify abandoning them to the fash just cos you thought the organisers were cunts

and b) we could not afford to give the fash any glimpse of their (huge) potential to intimidate, to terrorise and to win.

 

[Casually Red]

[quote="LiamO, post: 11827763, member:

The problem being that a) at every event organised by woolly liberal-lefties there would always be a number of genuine working class people perhaps attending their first political event... how could you justify abandoning them to the fash just cos you thought the organisers were cunts

by envisaging the " Itold you sos and "I'll listen to you from now on" when your visiting them in casualty . Whats wrong with being proven right ?

and b) we could not afford to give the fash any glimpse of their (huge) potential to intimidate, to terrorise and to win.

as the wooly jumpers reckoned AFA were all indistinguishable from the fash anyway theres a few birds i reckon could have been killed with one stone. But thats just my twisted mind whirring away. Lets just carry on and pretend i havent suggested anything so machiavellian[/quote]

 

[krink]

That attitude still exists in all it's idiocy today and was fully in evidence whenever the SDL have tried to do something 'notable' in Glasgow.

A few times I've had this conversation even with decent working class antifash. some bloke in his 40s, (shaved head, looks like he had a hard paper round) walks by and they've marked him as a fash. "he looks like one" to which I reply "then so do I".

Thing is if you actually look at photos of the local fash none of them fit the thugy stereotype. They're mostly nondescript. Look more like a bunch of saddo losers than working class fighters...

What people imagine they look like:



what they look like:

 

[The39thStep]

The latter two used to be though didn't they?

 

[krink]

biggsy i could imagine it but he was in london then so i don't know for certain. watmough was in bradford/leeds so dunno either.

 

[Red Storm]

The video used in the beating the fascists trailer is a good example of this.

When the huge bald guy is boxing with all the fash. You can't really tell who's on who's side in that clip unless you hear the story.

 

[Casually Red]

I was in Berlin about 5 years ago when accross the street from us theres a huge bonehead starts kicking seven bells out of this poor little guy with a beard . Kicking him so hard your almost getting that bass drum sound and shouting shit at him, like some crazed obergruppen fuhrer . Dudes I was with instead of running at him....thank fuck... start giving him the thumbs up, cheering him on . Turned out the completely shaven headed stormtrooper was on our side and the little bearded shite was a fash spy from some " national anarchist kommune" . I was quite relieved because the bonehead was fucking huge and very agile . Did not fancy that one .
But it goes to show you cant really tell . Half the german fash are running about dressed like anarchists these days and all .

 

[The39thStep]

I was in Berlin about 5 years ago when accross the street from us theres a huge bonehead starts kicking seven bells out of this poor little guy with a beard . Kicking him so hard your almost getting that bass drum sound and shouting shit at him, like some crazed obergruppen fuhrer . Dudes I was with instead of running at him....thank fuck... start giving him the thumbs up, cheering him on . Turned out the completely shaven headed stormtrooper was on our side and the little bearded shite was a fash spy from some " national anarchist kommune" . I was quite relieved because the bonehead was fucking huge and very agile . Did not fancy that one .
But it goes to show you cant really tell . Half the german fash are running about dressed like anarchists these days and all .

That must be really embarrasing

 

[Fedayn]

The latter two used to be though didn't they?

biggsy i could imagine it but he was in london then so i don't know for certain. watmough was in bradford/leeds so dunno either.

Biggs was fairly handy certainly.

 

[TopCat]

That must be really embarrasing

Some anarchists are very well dressed. As was ever thus.

 

[Casually Red]

That must be really embarrasing

if you google image National anarchists youll see them even adopting the Guy Fawkes masks and anarchist anti capitalist slogans . Dont want to link any pics to here because most of them are from fash sites . But attire wise many on the new right are indistinguishable from the Black Bloc. Even many of the symbols look leftist until you scrutinise a bit closer. Its bad enough their politics are disgusting but then they have to go and find a way of making themselves even more cuntish by introducing even more confusion to my life. All this political stuff is confusing enough as it is.

 

[past caring]

biggsy i could imagine it but he was in london then so i don't know for certain. watmough was in bradford/leeds so dunno either.

There was a reason that he moved up North.

Biggs was fairly handy certainly.

But not that handy.

 

[bignose1]

I was in Berlin about 5 years ago when accross the street from us theres a huge bonehead starts kicking seven bells out of this poor little guy with a beard . Kicking him so hard your almost getting that bass drum sound and shouting shit at him, like some crazed obergruppen fuhrer . Dudes I was with instead of running at him....thank fuck... start giving him the thumbs up, cheering him on . Turned out the completely shaven headed stormtrooper was on our side and the little bearded shite was a fash spy from some " national anarchist kommune" . I was quite relieved because the bonehead was fucking huge and very agile . Did not fancy that one .
But it goes to show you cant really tell . Half the german fash are running about dressed like anarchists these days and all .

Biggs was fairly handy certainly.

Sorry handy as in a big lump who if one caught you you'd probably go down or got you in a bear hug you might regret it. But a complete wanker...and a bully...not hard. I hate that.

 

[Fedayn]

But not that handy.

Indeed, but unlike alot of his erstwhile companions he at least stood. Seen him with a few jumped on him still swinging and giving it out.

Sorry handy as in a big lump who if one caught you you'd probably go down or got you in a bear hug you might regret it. But a complete wanker...and a bully...not hard. I hate that.

I've seen him do well a few times. He was no slouch..... He certainly wasn't like a lot of his pals who if it wasn't for their own sense of racial pride would come a close second to usain Bolt when it came to sprinting....

 

[q_w_e_r_t_y]

if you google image National anarchists youll see them even adopting the Guy Fawkes masks and anarchist anti capitalist slogans . Dont want to link any pics to here because most of them are from fash sites . But attire wise many on the new right are indistinguishable from the Black Bloc. Even many of the symbols look leftist until you scrutinise a bit closer. Its bad enough their politics are disgusting but then they have to go and find a way of making themselves even more cuntish by introducing even more confusion to my life. All this political stuff is confusing enough as it is.

Here in Greece there is the same issue. The antifa movement is disproportionately made up of big scary white men, who are lovely with good politics, but they are still big scary white men. The violent imagery that is used in a lot of posters and even some of the slogans seem ambiguous to someone who doesn't speak Greek.

I was talking to someone about Villa Amalias (the squat that got evicted last week) and pointing it out as we went past. He's a migrant, and the skeleton murals on the outside had led him to believe that this was a fascist place (they control the nearby square), so he had been careful to avoid going near it. We cant do anything to avoid the fash appropriating our symbols but we need to be careful about what symbolism we use and how we appear to people, firstly to ordinary people around, and secondly to those who are targetted by fash.

 

[malatesta32]

There was a reason that he moved up North.



But not that handy.

in the spirit of festivus, spill the beans sir! and what is biggs doing with that bullhorn in the pic?

 

[malatesta32]

b) we could not afford to give the fash any glimpse of their (huge) potential to intimidate, to terrorise and to win.

absolutely! they were crowing enough about that poor old guy who got attacked in south london.

 

[krink]

what is biggs doing with that bullhorn in the pic?

wondering if he can eat it?

 

[malatesta32]

just been reading nick ryan on wilf browning and also lowles in white riot. it is all on a par with 'the lair of the beast' etc. yet there are no other accounts qualifying this. also,
[Wells]

was no friend of Sargent he actually happened to be Browning's right hand man (what does that tell you?)​

of course, they knew he was really a grass all along but oddly didn't do anything about it!

 

[malatesta32]

and

'Wells went on national tv and accused Sergant of being a state op and portrayed himself as a leading light in C18. We now know the exact opposite is true! ... Wells was a searchlight agent and Sergant obviously was not and as I stated before only those of a dubious nature or those who were lacking in intelligence fell for these outrageous lies.'​

the branch and gerry running their own wee operations then?

 

[Cornetto]

The latter two used to be though didn't they?

Watty in his hey day, more poppa smurf now.

 

[malatesta32]

I've seen him do well a few times. He was no slouch..... He certainly wasn't like a lot of his pals who if it wasn't for their own sense of racial pride would come a close second to usain Bolt when it came to sprinting....

too fat to run?

 

[malatesta32]

watmough is a nasty little scrote who makes money from selling nazi tat. as far as i know he has never been done for anything, redwatch etc. some on the far right reckon he has kept out of trouble by grassing. he is currently hangin off the arse of the NE infidels. his BPP venture was an utter failure.

 

[malatesta32]

if you google image National anarchists youll see them even adopting the Guy Fawkes masks and anarchist anti capitalist slogans . Dont want to link any pics to here because most of them are from fash sites . But attire wise many on the new right are indistinguishable from the Black Bloc. Even many of the symbols look leftist until you scrutinise a bit closer. Its bad enough their politics are disgusting but then they have to go and find a way of making themselves even more cuntish by introducing even more confusion to my life. All this political stuff is confusing enough as it is.

on the BNP thread at British Democracy forum, there is an appreciating thread on guy debord/spectacle. recuperation or what?

 

[butchersapron]

I wouldn't really say that it's appreciative given that they reduced his radical critique down to look at all the thick people watching x-factor and going shopping- if anything that just highlights the crossover of the contemptuous views of the working class between liberals and the far-right and thr gap between them and how people like Debord viewed the class' capabilities.