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US election 2020 thread

Now there's a dead cop its about as bad as it could be for Trump and his enablers within the republican party - especially those who took part. And teh ludicrous claims of "it was antifa!" .... (which even trump hasn't bought into)
You'd think this would pretty much isolate the rabid trump loons from the anyone in the political maisnstream - but the republican party are chained to them. They nurtured them and fed them and trump unleashed them.
 
A lot of people involved in the riot are now shitting themselves and deleting the social media accounts they shared their antics on - I think there's still an outside chance Trump will pardon them all in a final fuck-you, though he's so unpredictable he might swing the other way and declare that taking part in a crime in which a federal law enforcement officer was killed has made them all eligible for the federal death penalty.
 
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Yossarian said:
A lot of people involved in the riot are now shitting themselves and deleting the social media accounts they shared their antics on - I think there's still an outside chance Trump will pardon them all in a final fuck-you, though he's so unpredictable he might swing the other way and declare that taking part in a crime in which a federal law enforcement officers was killed has made them all eligible for the federal death penalty.
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Because I'm a dork, I'm curious about the logistics of just how you'd go about pardoning that many people, especially given it's not like anyone was taking names. Would it just be a "no-one can be prosecuted for this" blanket action, rather than pardoning each individual for each crime?
 
Lord Camomile said:
Because I'm a dork, I'm curious about the logistics of just how you'd go about pardoning that many people, especially given it's not like anyone was taking names. Would it just be a "no-one can be prosecuted for this" blanket action, rather than pardoning each individual for each crime?
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This is how Jimmy Carter's blanket pardon for draft dodgers in 1977 was worded.

I, Jimmy Carter, President of the United States, do hereby grant a full, complete and unconditional pardon to: (1) all persons who may have committed any offense between August 4, 1964 and March 28, 1973 in violation of the Military Selective Service Act or any rule or regulation promulgated thereunder; and (2) all persons heretofore convicted, irrespective of the date of conviction, of any offense committed between August 4, 1964 and March 28, 1973 in violation of the Military Selective Service Act, or any rule or regulation promulgated thereunder, restoring to them full political, civil and other rights..
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littlebabyjesus said:
Yes and no. In the short term, doing things such as raising taxes on the rich to provide universal health care or affordable tuition fees might conceivably increase the risks of domestic terrorism, especially if it's seen to benefit particular sections of society. You do it because it's the right thing to do, not to appease those who oppose you, and you do it even if it increases the risk of a violent response in the short term.
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The short term we're all talking about ATM is the next 12 days
 
Wall Street Journal, big backer of Trump, has called for him to resign to avoid impeachment.

“This was an assault on the constitutional process of transferring power after an election,” the paper’s editorial board wrote of Trump’s actions on Wednesday. “It was also an assault on the legislature from an executive sworn to uphold the laws of the United States. This goes beyond merely refusing to concede defeat. In our view it crosses a constitutional line that Mr Trump hasn’t previously crossed. It is impeachable.”
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Its amazing to me that there appears to be clear political interference to allow the building to be overrun, whilst Trump and his entourage watch excitedly in a tent for the latest - but no plan at all on what to do once in there apart from take selfies and generally piss about. I can only speculate they were leaving the details to the autonomy of the mob, or at best maybe they had some of their own people, covert or overt, in there whose job might be to lead the way - but if so no sign that anything came to much.

But even in a best case scenario, what were Trumps circle hoping would happen? It doesn't match up with any real historical attempt of a coup, in that there's no serious attempt to seize power - above all its a performance, or maybe even a re-enactment. Is this just naivety?

This episode looks like a political backfiring failure to me, though sometimes what appears on the surface doesn't match longer term plans. Perhaps as an escalation in what's possible it's a success. Was that the ultimate goal?

Perhaps these people were set up to fail - perhaps go down in flames as martyrs? None of us here can know for certain the answer to this, but I'm struggling to even come up with a hypothesis of what Trump and co dreamed might happen. Maybe they didn't get further than "wouldn't it be cool if we got our supporters to storm Capitol Hill?
 
Dark Knight said:
It's awful when people have different views and opinions to your own, isn't it? My apologies for all the distress my right to have my own views and opinions is causing you. Take some deep breaths. Then, if you can face it, here's another video:
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You didn’t give any opinions. You posted videos without context.

It’s considered good manners on here to give a brief overview of what is in a video and why it’s relevant. This need only be a few words. It’s also appreciated if you say how long the video is, and if appropriate at approximately what time mark the relevant action occurs.

It’s worth remembering that many people are reading these boards in workplace setting where audio and even headphones might not be appropriate. Not everyone has the same work environment you do.

Furthermore, people may have disabilities or technical considerations you haven’t thought of.

So a quick comment, an idea of your feelings on the matter, a brief précis would be appreciated.

A context-free, no comment link is going to be ignored.

This isn’t just for your benefit. Have a search: I’ve said it many times.
 
Dom Traynor said:
How could you pardon someone who hasnt been convicted of anything? And a conviction seems unlikely in the few days remaining...
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He's already going for preemptive pardons on his family and a few others. Not sure how that works. I guess you have to acknowledge their wrongdoing first. . . . Which would be a bit awkward.
 
ska invita said:
Its amazing to me that there appears to be clear political interference to allow the building to be overrun, whilst Trump and his entourage watch excitedly in a tent for the latest - but no plan at all on what to do once in there apart from take selfies and generally piss about. I can only speculate they were leaving the details to the autonomy of the mob, or at best maybe they had some of their own people, covert or overt, in there whose job might be to lead the way - but if so no sign that anything came to much.

But even in a best case scenario, what were Trumps circle hoping would happen? It doesn't match up with any real historical attempt of a coup, in that there's no serious attempt to seize power - above all its a performance, or maybe even a re-enactment. Is this just naivety?

This episode looks like a political backfiring failure to me, though sometimes what appears on the surface doesn't match longer term plans. Perhaps as an escalation in what's possible it's a success. Was that the ultimate goal?

Perhaps these people were set up to fail - perhaps go down in flames as martyrs? None of us here can know for certain the answer to this, but I'm struggling to even come up with a hypothesis of what Trump and co dreamed might happen. Maybe they didn't get further than "wouldn't it be cool if we got our supporters to storm Capitol Hill?
Click to expand...

It does seem, from the fact the security was so lax and the National Guard were initially blocked from coming in, that Trump had placed a few loyalists in strategic positions of government, so it was a serious coup attempt, although a poorly thought out one. I think he believed that he could intimidate Republican congressmen to support his coup attempt. Look at the pressure he was putting on Pence to declare the election fraudulent, this was an attempt to show the Republican Party that loyalty to him was above loyalty to them so they should get with the programme - however it failed due to Trump's ego not matching up with reality. If the crowd was bigger - say a million strong - who knows how many people in the federal government and the Republican Party would have taken the side of the coup?
 
What if they got hold of the electoral boxes sent in from the states..¿..even though the results are known....I'll bet it would have been used as a delaying tactic by Cruzes cronies

And if trump is impeached..with only 12 days to go ,that would be the end of his last raft of pardons (his closest)...worth it if just for that
 
Rimbaud said:
It does seem, from the fact the security was so lax and the National Guard were initially blocked from coming in, that Trump had placed a few loyalists in strategic positions of government, so it was a serious coup attempt, although a poorly thought out one. I think he believed that he could intimidate Republican congressmen to support his coup attempt. Look at the pressure he was putting on Pence to declare the election fraudulent, this was an attempt to show the Republican Party that loyalty to him was above loyalty to them so they should get with the programme - however it failed due to Trump's ego not matching up with reality. If the crowd was bigger - say a million strong - who knows how many people in the federal government and the Republican Party would have taken the side of the coup?
Click to expand...
Yeh but we knew from his inauguration that trump would never pull a crowd of that size
 
Tankus said:
What if they got hold of the electoral boxes sent in from the states..¿..even though the results are known....I'll bet it would have been used as a delaying tactic by Cruzes cronies
Click to expand...
They keep various copies - six sets in total iirc. And Cruz ended up backing down from supporting the later objections when they reconvened. If the boxes had been taken or destroyed, Cruz would have been even more sheepish, not less so.
 
danny la rouge said:
You didn’t give any opinions. You posted videos without context.

It’s considered good manners on here to give a brief overview of what is in a video and why it’s relevant. This need only be a few words. It’s also appreciated if you say how long the video is, and if appropriate at approximately what time mark the relevant action occurs.

It’s worth remembering that many people are reading these boards in workplace setting where audio and even headphones might not be appropriate. Not everyone has the same work environment you do.

Furthermore, people may have disabilities or technical considerations you haven’t thought of.

So a quick comment, an idea of your feelings on the matter, a brief précis would be appreciated.

A context-free, no comment link is going to be ignored.

This isn’t just for your benefit. Have a search: I’ve said it many times.
Click to expand...

Wall of text. I've hurt your feelings.

Would you understand if I don't accept lectures about manners from people who, as a matter of course, use foul language, and swear at me and insult me just for having a different view?
 
Moderately hysterical thread on the guy with the zip ties and his possible intentions and accomplices.

Hope people don't mind the Twitter "news" links but i'll leave the serious political chat to those who are better versed in the ins and outs of political analysis.

""
 
Rimbaud said:
It does seem, from the fact the security was so lax and the National Guard were initially blocked from coming in, that Trump had placed a few loyalists in strategic positions of government, so it was a serious coup attempt, although a poorly thought out one. I think he believed that he could intimidate Republican congressmen to support his coup attempt. Look at the pressure he was putting on Pence to declare the election fraudulent, this was an attempt to show the Republican Party that loyalty to him was above loyalty to them so they should get with the programme - however it failed due to Trump's ego not matching up with reality. If the crowd was bigger - say a million strong - who knows how many people in the federal government and the Republican Party would have taken the side of the coup?
Click to expand...


so its designed to pressure the electoral college?
 
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