And now a French General election too (2024)

[zedr]

I couldn't use it easily on my phone, but the le monde map of seats/votes it looked like the centrist alliance had split the left vote in some places in the South, letting the fascists in.

 

[The39thStep]

I couldn't use it easily on my phone, but the le monde map of seats/votes it looked like the centrist alliance had split the left vote in some places in the South, letting the fascists in.

Be interesting to see some detail on this as the decision to not to split the NFP vote and Ensemble vote by candidates who finished third was described by NFP as absolute but by Ensembel as one that was 'relative '. I have been struggling to find the final decision by Ensemble on this however Attal announced before the voting that “If the opposing candidate has republican values, then we will withdraw,” whilst Macron said voters should rally behind candidates who are “clearly republican and democratic” and Le Maire, Macron's ally and finance minister, announced “For me, France Unbowed is a danger for the nation, just as the National Rally is a danger for the Republic,” .

The price the NFP paid, Melechons group in particular, is that they stood down candidates to allow some particularly appalling members of Ensemble to have a clear run against RN. For example, LFI ( Melechons lot) stood down to let Elisabeth Borne one of the backers of the pension reforms and attacks on benefits win her seat. Darmanin. the Minister for the Interior was the backed candidate instead of a member of the LFI . A former member of a right wing group, Darmanin has repeatedly backed the Police over accusations of racism and brutality and shut down anti racist groups.

Smokeandsteam has already cautioned about the need for NFP not to compromise particularly over their economic programme. Its a fragile tactical grouping with some members of the Socialist Party and other centre left groups only too keen to ditch policies for support and to spend their energy on 'managing' the LFI rather than steering for clear water between the NFP and Ensemble.

 

[Dogsauce]

We had a referendum on AV 11 years ago which would have meant you could do that, you don't need two rounds, you just need to go 1,2,3, etc., yet everybody voted against it.: o/

People mostly voted against it so as not to give the Lib Dems any kind of victory, following their decision to get in bed with the Tories. I doubt many looked at what it was about in detail, it was just a free hit on Clegg and to make sure he got nothing for his treachery (though I think they later had the great success of getting the carrier bag tax through, in exchange for backing welfare cuts).

 

[ska invita]

I wonder what the lastest ...?

no news here but this was interesting/bleak:

Serge Halimi, Victory Deferred — Sidecar

France’s new Assembly.

newleftreview.org

"As for the ‘New Popular Front’, it is ‘new’ in the sense that isn’t as populaire as its predecessor of 1936. Among those who did not abstain, 57% of manual labourers and 44% of service-sector employees voted for the RN. It was in the big cities, where the population is disproportionately bourgeois and highly educated, that the NFP won the majority of its seats.

This was especially true of the Socialist Party (PS) and the Greens. Mélenchon’s attempt to appeal to the popular sectors succeeded on one level: the mobilization of the banlieues, where large numbers of immigrants allowed La France insoumise (LFI) to achieve impressive results, often without going to ballotage. All the same, even a casual observer of French politics must have smiled on reading the headline in Libération, the daily newspaper of the progressive urban petty bourgeoisie, the day after the first round of the legislative elections: ‘Paris, capitale du Nouveau Front populaire’.

Paris, the most expensive city in France, where apartments frequently go for over €10,000 per square metre, indeed elected twelve NFP MPs out of a total of eighteen, eight of them in the first round. By contrast, in working-class constituencies that for almost a century were citadels of the left, often of the Communist Party (PCF), the results were disastrous. Picardy returned thirteen far-right MPs out of seventeen; in the Pas-de-Calais, longtime fiefdom of Maurice Thorez – head of the PCF for more than thirty years – the RN claimed ten out of twelve seats, six in the first round. In the Gard, the party won every constituency.|"

 

[ska invita]

as to an update i found this on a french newspaper, basically the NPF are horse-trading over who to put forward as Prime Minister:

"The PS does not give in. While the communists and rebels want the New Popular Front to choose Huguette Bello for the role of Prime Minister of a potential left-wing government , the socialists still refuse to get behind this idea. Meeting in the national council this Saturday, July 13, the roses have not decided to abandon the Olivier Faure track for Matignon and are pleading to continue discussions to find an embodiment of the consensus. “We continue to work to find a name, nothing has been decided ,” said a participant in the meeting. There is no drama to discuss, we will have someone by July 18.”

...five days time then supposedly

 

[pbsmooth]

Gard was the only place to vote for Le Pen in the first round in 2012, so they’ve got form.

 

[ska invita]

translated news:

"After almost three days of discussions, the union finally decided. Socialists, rebellious people , communists and ecologists finally agreed on Wednesday on the candidacy of communist André Chassaigne for the presidency of the National Assembly. But still no name of Prime Minister to propose to Emmanuel Macron, after the failure of the Huguette Bello and Laurence Toubiana leads."


I think (?) the Prime Minister will be decided today...

 

[ska invita]

new video from Alice Cappelle, one of the best youtube essayist types, and she's french. not watched yet put parking it here

 

[phildwyer]

Paris, the most expensive city in France, where apartments frequently go for over €10,000 per square metre, indeed elected twelve NFP MPs out of a total of eighteen, eight of them in the first round. By contrast, in working-class constituencies that for almost a century were citadels of the left, often of the Communist Party (PCF), the results were disastrous. Picardy returned thirteen far-right MPs out of seventeen; in the Pas-de-Calais, longtime fiefdom of Maurice Thorez – head of the PCF for more than thirty years – the RN claimed ten out of twelve seats, six in the first round. In the Gard, the party won every constituency.|"

Yep. The same thing is happening in the USA. The bourgeoisie votes "left;' the proletariat votes "right." Don't know about you, but afaic that's reason enough to dispense with the obsolete spatial metaphor. Politics is not a spectrum.

 

[ska invita]

Yep. The same thing is happening in the USA. The bourgeoisie votes "left;' the proletariat votes "right." Don't know about you, but afaic that's reason enough to dispense with the obsolete spatial metaphor. Politics is not a spectrum.

no i think it is still broadly a spectrum...I see no reason that voting patterns stop that from being the case
if anything i think the ""bourgeoisie votes "left;' the proletariat votes "right.""" is the error...it may be true in majority but its far from a true absolute statement, and there are identifiable reasons as to why it happens as much as it does

 

[PR1Berske]

 

[skyscraper101]

I love this. I love the whole parade of people just point blank refusing to shake hands.

 

[Sue]

A load of French people I used to work with are going on on LinkedIn that LFI deputies who're refusing to shake hands with RN deputies are 'rude' and 'childish' and don't know how to behave.

 

[ska invita]

The guy posting this thread is a campist and CCP apologist, but he does post some interesting stuff
In this thread he suggests that Macron is refusing to honour the election result and is carying out a slow motion coup.... That Unbowed are obviously not allowed to be in power despite the election result ...

Have a look for yourself and see what you make of it... Includes links to French media

Thread by @RnaudBertrand on Thread Reader App

@RnaudBertrand: Quite an incredible move in French politics today that might reveal that we're in fact witnessing nothing less than a coup by Macron. Let me explain 🧵 You'll remember that on the 7th of July...…

threadreaderapp.com

 

[pbsmooth]

The guy posting this thread is a campist and CCP apologist, but he does post some interesting stuff
In this thread he suggests that Macron is refusing to honour the election result and is carying out a slow motion coup.... That Unbowed are obviously not allowed to be in power despite the election result ...

Have a look for yourself and see what you make of it... Includes links to French media

http://l

seems to be built on an inaccurate assumption - Macron is entirely within his rights to choose/veto the PM. ultimately his party’s result wasn’t as bad as feared and of course nobody got a majority so that has given him some time to stall. probably needs to make some sort of decision before long though or reveal his strategy.

 

[ska invita]

Guardian covering this now

Chaos in France after Macron refuses to name prime minister from leftwing coalition

More talks to take place on Tuesday as president attempts to find a PM who can command cross-party support

www.theguardian.com

 

[Elpenor]

Perhaps the next French election should have some independent Russian observers to ensure a proper result is reached

 

[Rob Ray]

The far-right will be spitting feathers over this, Macron just gifted the left the "anti-status quo" title on a plate.

 

[ska invita]

I can't read french but sounds like a call for Everyone Out

 

[Sue]

I can't read french but sounds like a call for Everyone Out

Just the young. (Various youth/student orgs/unions are having a big demo. LFI are giving its support to them and the demo.)

 

[pbsmooth]

OK, he has really ignored the fact the left coalition won...

Michel Barnier named by Macron as new French PM

The French president names the EU's former Brexit negotiator almost two months after snap elections.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Elpenor]

Democracy a sham innit

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Wow. A Gaullist PM from those election results? How the fuck does that work.

So to avoid a vote of no-confidence, he needs the support of either the NPF or National Rally. NPF needs to hold firm here and stick together. Macron really wants to create an alliance between whatever-his-shower-are-called-now, the Gaullists and Le Pen?

Wow.

 

[ska invita]

Wow. A Gaullist PM from those election results? How the fuck does that work.

So to avoid a vote of no-confidence, he needs the support of either the NPF or National Rally. NPF needs to hold firm here and stick together. Macron really wants to create an alliance between whatever-his-shower-are-called-now, the Gaullists and Le Pen?

Wow.

Not a given that coalition will materialise

 

[littlebabyjesus]

Not a given that coalition will materialise

Looking at the numbers, he can't get a majority without either at least some of NPF or RN. So either Macron thinks the NPF will give in or he is considering an alliance with RN. The maths doesn't allow anything else - NPF + RN > 50% of the seats in parliament.

But it shows yet again that, when push comes to shove, so-called 'centrists' will side with fascism over anything with a whiff of socialism. I don't see how else you can spin that.

 

[ska invita]

Copied from elsewhere.... Useful clarification I think

I know many people are utterly confused as to how Macron could have nominated a Prime Minister whose party came 4th in the election with 5% of the vote, so let me explain it in the simplest possible way.

Basically after the elections the president - Macron in this instance - is free to choose who he wishes as PM if he doesn't like the results and if he gets assurances that Parliament won't censure his choice. I'm serious, that's how it works. And in this instance Macron seems to have made some sort of agreement with Le Pen to ensure there'd be no censure in parliament.

And technically a French president doesn't actually even need to get assurances that Parliament won't censure his choice of PM, he can just appoint anyone he likes. But that'd be fairly pointless because then his chosen PM would get censured.

But what's the point of voting then if the president can just dismiss the results and appoint whoever he wants?

Exactly the question many French people are asking themselves right now...

Because even though all past presidents had this power to just dismiss the election results, this is actually the first time in the history of the French 5th Republic that a president chooses someone as PM who isn't from the winning party.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

He's not just not from the winning party! He's from a party that used to be big but got annihilated at the election and is a very very long way away politically from the largest block, which won one third of the seats.

I can't see this government lasting more than a few weeks. Can Macron call another election? If so, I could see that happening. And I can see that being a really fucking bad idea - it is surely exactly what Le Pen wants.

The budget still has to be approved by the National Assembly. So either the government falls sharpish or it survives because the RN supported it and is suddenly a de facto part of the governing coalition.

 

[Chz]

The French President is easily the mosy powerful elected representative in the world. The American Presidents just wish they had that level of authority. Thank DeGaulle.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

To clarify that, wikipedia states that the president can only dissolve parliament after 12 months minimum from the last time it was dissolved. If that's true then we're in for a constitutional crisis for sure.

ETA:

Wikipedia is right:

The dissolution of the French National Assembly is a power granted to the President of the French Republic under Article 12 of the Constitution of the Fifth Republic. It allows the President to end the mandate of the deputies before its normal term and to call for new legislative elections. This decision is usually motivated by political reasons, such as a government crisis or institutional deadlock. The President may only exercise this power once a year, and in the event of dissolution, the re-elected deputies retain their mandate until the end of the following legislature.

The dissolution of the French National Assembly

 

[TopCat]

The NR have said they will support Barnier in exchange for more racism. He is good with that. Macron is happy.