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US election 2020 thread

existentialist said:
I would really like to think that this gains some serious traction...but I'm no longer optimistic.
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tbf, these quotes referred to his 2016 campaign, which pretty much blindsided a disastrously complacent Clinton campaign. Thanks to BLM, and that chastening experience, I understand the Biden campaign, and lots of progressive organisations, advocacy groups, PACs etc are much better prepared to counter any rpeats of all that
 
SheilaNaGig said:
None of that will dent him. It may actually work in his favour. It will demonstrate to the faithful that the system is out to demolish him, so they’ve be more motivated to support him. Drain the swamp!

He’s their champion, and they’re rooting for him as they do for their football team. The more like a wounded warrior he seems, the more they’ll work to carry him over the finish line.
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What you say is true - but not for enough voters to get Trump over the line. It's true of the Trump cultists, and they are only a part, albeit a very substantial part, of those who voted for him last time, and whose votes he needs this time.

The rest - the bluecollar voters in the rustbelt who thought they might as well give gim a go as nothing else had delibvered for them, the anyone-but-Hillary brigade (including those Bernie bros who simply wrote in Bernie or sat the vote out), the traditional GOP voters, the evangelicals, and all the people who simply voted for him to stick two fingers up at the Status quo, people sick of the corporate stitch-up and at offshoring of jobs - are nowhere near certain to turn out this time, not in the numbers Trump needs.

Especially as he is no longer able to pose as a "people's champion" insurgent running against the Elite (yeah, I know, but plenty of people bought it). He is the incumbent, and has to stand on his record. On top of everything else, COVID-19 makes that record look dismal.
 
Sprocket. said:
View attachment 232431
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Isn’t this old? I feel like I saw it during the last campaign?

In any case, It just demonstrates the huge chasm between those who would never vote for him and those who will because they feel that they’re misunderstood and dismissed by those who’d never vote for him.

It’s self congratulatory wanky bollocks. It adds nothing to the debate and exposes nothing we don’t already know about Trump. It’s a very blunt instrument.

I’ve had several quite anguished and convoluted discussions witth Trump supporters who are adamant that they’re not racist, and who feel really angry and upset that their support for Trump automatically launches them into the racist bracket.

Setting aside the fact that they are actually racist or at least hold casual/systemic racist views and attitudes , let’s say that they’re not overtly racist, they feel that “the left” - which has in their view become a scary monolithic and destructive behemoth - is labelling them something they genuinely and sincerely claim to abhor. The media, the arts, even sports, they’re all “the left”. Trump supporters feel increasingly disenfranchised. Those that are taking a stand (...standing by....) feel like they’re under attack, and sketches like this one underlines that sense of attack.


I can’t repeat and replicate for Urban all the TransAtlantic conversations and discussions I’m having right now, only give you a sense of what I’m gleaning and how it feels. Not one person I’ve spoken to feels that Trump will lose. From Oregon to Maine, from Chicago to South Carolina, from NY to SF, from teenagers to elders, left and right, unemployed, working, blue collar white collar, every single person I’ve spoken with is either crowing that he’ll win, or lamenting that he’ll win.

It might just be resignation / hope, and obviously there are degrees of certainty. But it’s really clear what the mood is, at least amongst the people I know and have spoken with.


Streathamite said:
What you say is true - but not for enough voters to get Trump over the line. It's true of the Trump cultists, and they are only a part, albeit a very substantial part, of those who voted for him last time, and whose votes he needs this time.

The rest - the bluecollar voters in the rustbelt who thought they might as well give gim a go as nothing else had delibvered for them, the anyone-but-Hillary brigade (including those Bernie bros who simply wrote in Bernie or sat the vote out), the traditional GOP voters, the evangelicals, and all the people who simply voted for him to stick two fingers up at the Status quo, people sick of the corporate stitch-up and at offshoring of jobs - are nowhere near certain to turn out this time, not in the numbers Trump needs.

Especially as he is no longer able to pose as a "people's champion" insurgent running against the Elite (yeah, I know, but plenty of people bought it). He is the incumbent, and has to stand on his record. On top of everything else, COVID-19 makes that record look dismal.
Click to expand...


I really really hope this is true... except that if it is, it could come out worse either in the short or the longer term.

A narrow loss for Trump (a landslide for Biden is impossible) could easily cause a far more dangerous shit show to develop. Even if it goes quiet for a while, the gaping wound at the heart of American society has been laid bare and I can’t see how it can be tended without further pain and damage.


Whether it was deliberate, a malapropism or a Freudian slip, Trump’s clarion call to the far right sets out the battle lines.
 
Yossarian said:
I wouldn't advise watching the whole thing if you have more pleasant things to do - like standing under a woodchipper and seeing how many splinters you can get in your eyeballs - but this is probably the most telling couple of minutes, in which Trump is asked to condemn white supremacist groups and instead tells the Proud Boys to "stand by."

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Agreed that was the Nadir, but the whole debate represented, and added up to, one long, pitiful trainwreck, and a terrible, humiliating window display for the American political system. And about 98% of the blame for it falls on Trump.
I don't actually blame Wallace. He's a relatively sane, civilised human being (for a Fox staffer), and he assumed that Trump knew how to behave like one in a formal debate. trump either doesn't, or won't.
 
The debates comission is looking at modifying the procedures for the next one (with no negotiation offered to the condidates)
Giving the moderator control of the mics is top of the list

www.cbsnews.com

Debates commission plans changes to presidential debate format

One key change it plans to implement: Cutting off the microphones of Trump and Biden if they break the rules, according to a source familiar with the commission's deliberations.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com
 
SheilaNaGig said:
Isn’t this old? I feel like I saw it during the last campaign?

In any case, It just demonstrates the huge chasm between those who would never vote for him and those who will because they feel that they’re misunderstood and dismissed by those who’d never vote for him.

It’s self congratulatory wanky bollocks. It adds nothing to the debate and exposes nothing we don’t already know about Trump. It’s a very blunt instrument.
Click to expand...

I hadn’t seen it before.
 
Last edited:
Wilf said:
Suppose this is all about how it* plays out in 4 or 5 swing states.
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Actually, it's a bit more than those numbers.
I make it, as the states in play: Arizona, Michigan, Wisconsin, Pennsylvania, Georgia, Texas (Texas in play!), Ohio, Florida, North carolina and (possibly) Iowa
 
Crispy said:
The debates comission is looking at modifying the procedures for the next one (with no negotiation offered to the condidates)
Giving the moderator control of the mics is top of the list

www.cbsnews.com

Debates commission plans changes to presidential debate format

One key change it plans to implement: Cutting off the microphones of Trump and Biden if they break the rules, according to a source familiar with the commission's deliberations.
www.cbsnews.com www.cbsnews.com
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They'll have to do that, or more sheer bedlam. The moment he starts chucking his toys around, cut the mic. Then he'll explode.
 
apnews.com

Trump campaign threatens to sue over Philly election offices

HARRISBURG, Pa. (AP) — President Donald Trump's campaign threatened a lawsuit Wednesday if it does not gain access for its campaign employees to observe activity inside newly opened satellite election offices in Philadelphia, where people can register to vote, apply for mail-in ballots and fill...
apnews.com apnews.com

President Donald Trump’s campaign threatened a lawsuit Wednesday if it does not gain access for its campaign employees to observe activity inside newly opened satellite election offices in Philadelphia, where people can register to vote, apply for mail-in ballots and fill them out.

A letter, sent late Tuesday night by a lawyer representing the Trump campaign, insisted the campaign has a legal right to observe the voting process in the heavily Democratic city’s satellite election offices.

“If we have not satisfactorily resolved this matter by tomorrow at 5 p.m., the campaign will seek court intervention,” the lawyer, Linda Kerns, wrote.

Nevertheless, city officials were aware of no lawsuit by Wednesday night.
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Streathamite said:
They'll have to do that, or more sheer bedlam. The moment he starts chucking his toys around, cut the mic. Then he'll explode.
Click to expand...

He'll walk off and tweet about how the moderator was wrong to cut him off and "the media are conducting a witchhunt in plain view!!!111!1!". Give or take, 50% of viewers will whoop and agree with him, 50% will think he's a toddler. No-one watching will change their mind.
 
Zapp Brannigan said:
He'll walk off and tweet about how the moderator was wrong to cut him off and "the media are conducting a witchhunt in plain view!!!111!1!". Give or take, 50% of viewers will whoop and agree with him, 50% will think he's a toddler. No-one watching will change their mind.
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i Hinestly don't think 50% of viewers will agree with him. He's polarised and divided the nation, but it's more like 40% will do that. 40% will be disgusted. It's the other 20% who actually matter. I would say, Trump's display in that debate harmed his chances with them
 
As the rest of the world comments on the debate

www.bbc.com

Presidential debate: How the world's media reacted

"Childish", "gruelling" and an "unwatchable fever dream" - how the world saw Tuesday's debate.
www.bbc.com

there was a survey on how Canadians would vote

www.macleans.ca

How much do Canadians dislike Donald Trump? A lot. - Macleans.ca

A new 338Canada/Léger poll shows that from coast to coast Canadians overwhelmingly support Biden over Trump. The only exception is among Conservatives.
www.macleans.ca www.macleans.ca

To the question: “If you could vote in the U.S. presidential election, would you vote for Joe Biden or Donald Trump?”, a significant majority of Canadians (72 per cent) would support Democratic nominee Joe Biden. Only 14 per cent of respondents would vote for Donald Trump, and another 14 per cent are undecided.

Among decided voters, Biden receives the support of 84 per cent of Canadian voters.{/quote]

Broken down by province

vote.png
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Streathamite said:
absolutely no surprise. Thing is, feelings are now running so high, the people really determined to see Trump go will find that drop-off box
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It's the ones who aren't particularly involved in politics either way who'll be turned off and that's the intention. The casual voters who don't like Trump but won't/can't drive 3 hours to vote.

“Governor Abbott and Texas Republicans are scared," he said in a statement following the governor’s order. "We are creating a movement that will beat them at the ballot box on 3 November, and there’s nothing these cheaters can do about it.”
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This shit from Dems doesn't help either. The desire not to be seen as awkward, or complaining even as voter surpression is blatantly obvious. Green lights more of it and makes it harder to challenge results if/when it works. They should be on 24/7 attacking the undermining of democracy, make it impossible to ignore.
 
spring-peeper said:
As the rest of the world comments on the debate

www.bbc.com

Presidential debate: How the world's media reacted

"Childish", "gruelling" and an "unwatchable fever dream" - how the world saw Tuesday's debate.
www.bbc.com

there was a survey on how Canadians would vote

www.macleans.ca

How much do Canadians dislike Donald Trump? A lot. - Macleans.ca

A new 338Canada/Léger poll shows that from coast to coast Canadians overwhelmingly support Biden over Trump. The only exception is among Conservatives.
www.macleans.ca www.macleans.ca
Click to expand...

Canada (like every other country) has its own problems with addressing racism. Could it ever turn to far right populism as easy as the US did?

Dying Indigenous woman films video of nurses at Canadian hospital taunting her
 
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