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The 2017 General Election campaign

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Have the Tories got desperate enough to wheel out shit celebrities with threats of leaving the country if 'Labour get in' because tax? Unusually complacent of them. Who do they even have any more? Gary fucking Barlow? Ken Barlow?
 
DAyfDryXoAMFnbO.jpg:large
 
mikey mikey said:
DAyfDryXoAMFnbO.jpg:large
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While it's certainly true that British foreign policy over past decades has contributed to the dangers of Islamist-inspired terrorism and the atrocities in Manchester the other night, I'm not sure how Corbyn pointing this out and promising that a future Lab gov under his premiership will do things differently (welcome though that is) will actually ally people's current fears or, crucially for him, persuade people to vote for JC/Labour at the GE.

Unless it's backed up with genuine measures (and I don't include demands for more police amongst those measures, inevitable as they are) which will address the perceived threat in the here and now, it looks too much like saying that he wouldn't have got us into the mess we now find ourselves in (conveniently overlooking that his party's past policy is just as responsible as the current Tory policy).

It certainly does nothing to persuade those whose reaction to hearing that the now-IDed Manc bomber was already on a watch list was to say that anyone on such a watch list should now be deported*, which I've heard a couple of times in recent days, and in response to previous incidents.

*and TBClear, I'm not saying I agree with that reaction, but if people's genuine fears aren't addressed, such views are hardly surprising.
 
andysays said:
While it's certainly true that British foreign policy over past decades has contributed to the dangers of Islamist-inspired terrorism and the atrocities in Manchester the other night, I'm not sure how Corbyn pointing this out and promising that a future Lab gov under his premiership will do things differently (welcome though that is) will actually ally people's current fears or, crucially for him, persuade people to vote for JC/Labour at the GE.

Unless it's backed up with genuine measures (and I don't include demands for more police amongst those measures, inevitable as they are) which will address the perceived threat in the here and now, it looks too much like saying that he wouldn't have got us into the mess we now find ourselves in (conveniently overlooking that his party's past policy is just as responsible as the current Tory policy).

It certainly does nothing to persuade those whose reaction to hearing that the now-IDed Manc bomber was already on a watch list was to say that anyone on such a watch list should now be deported*, which I've heard a couple of times in recent days, and in response to previous incidents.

*and TBClear, I'm not saying I agree with that reaction, but if people's genuine fears aren't addressed, such views are hardly surprising.
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Without the Iraq War there would be no ISIS, without the NATO intervention in Libya there would be no ISIS in Libya. With that in mind, I think it is logical to say that re-electing a government composed of people who backed both wars does not bode well for the future and I think that's the message coming from Corbyn.

Also, I'm not sure that you are right about the public. After the Madrid train bombings, the Spanish public kicked out Aznar partly because the government lied about the perpetrators and also partly because they recognised that the bombing was a consequence of Aznar's full throttle support for the Iraq War.
 
J Ed said:
Without the Iraq War there would be no ISIS, without the NATO intervention in Libya there would be no ISIS in Libya. With that in mind, I think it is logical to say that re-electing a government composed of people who backed both wars does not bode well for the future and I think that's the message coming from Corbyn.

Also, I'm not sure that you are right about the public. After the Madrid train bombings, the Spanish public kicked out Aznar partly because the government lied about the perpetrators and also partly because they recognised that the bombing was a consequence of Aznar's full throttle support for the Iraq War.
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All that may or may not be true, but you're missing what was intended as the main point of my post, that whatever the causes of the terrorism (and we know pretty much what they are) unless JC's Labour provide some sort of policy in response which addresses people's fears in the here and now, they will fail to gain public confidence and therefore votes, and those fears will grow and other possible responses (eg deporting everyone on terrorism watchlists) will dominate the argument about how to respond.
 
On Mainly Macro Theresa May

On the lack of strength and stability May's demonstrated in her time in office. He has a point here May's a jumpy critter who talks tough on things like immigration but has never delivered.
 
Have been taking a look at the Conservative Home website - reading the comments they are all fuming at the state of the Tory campaign.
 
The Labour Party were out this morning campaigning on the high street of Woodley a solidly Tory* leafy town in the Reading East constituency.

They seemed happy, confident and well received. A real incursion. Seeing that, hearing kabbes tales from Dorking, it makes you start to wonder.

* 24/25 town council seats.
 
No, my link to that article was related to the comment posted directly above. The cartoon that I have just posted is directly related to the title of the thread. If you think that I am spamming, you can put me on ignore and stop trashing the thread with comments about me.
 
andysays said:
All that may or may not be true, but you're missing what was intended as the main point of my post, that whatever the causes of the terrorism (and we know pretty much what they are) unless JC's Labour provide some sort of policy in response which addresses people's fears in the here and now, they will fail to gain public confidence and therefore votes, and those fears will grow and other possible responses (eg deporting everyone on terrorism watchlists) will dominate the argument about how to respond.
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The policy being put forward as an alternative is pretty clear, isn't it? It's a less interventionist foreign policy. Also, what I wrote was not a matter of opinion, there is no concievable way that ISIS would exist in Iraq without the 2003 Iraq War, there is no way that they would control a significant amount of territory in Libya without the 2011 NATO intervention in Libya.
 
chilango said:
Woodley a solidly Tory* leafy town in the Reading East constituency
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not sure it's that solid - woodley town council was limp dem until 2013 when one LD councillor became an 'independent' and started voting with the tories (more here) - think the LD's there suffered from the national meltdown.

wokingham labour do seem to be trying a bit harder than they did when i moved to the area (about 15 years ago) when they didn't even put up candidates in all council seats, and seemed to be going through the motions when they did.
 
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