Russia mobilises - consequences and reactions

[xenon]

The reasonable heads have been killed or have fled.

 

[nogojones]

As far as what does motivate Putin, we can also only speculate. John Gray, for one, seems to think he is sincere in his true-believer Orthodox Russian civilisation stuff. But even he doesn't know.

Just because he thinks men are from Mars and women from Venus, doesn't necessarally mean he knows where Putin is coming from.

 

[xenon]

I have no doubt there are those with grave at misgivings about what is happening within the Russian regime. But they are too powerless or afraid to act. again the bloody tragedy. Russians are not the problem here.

 

[Ax^]

well aside from Putin, his inner circle and the loyal generals

 

[xenon]

well aside from Putin, his inner circle and the loyal generals

Of course. but ordinary Russians not. I know banally obvious I suppose, but worth saying now and again. Given some of the animosity against Russians as frog woman alludes to.

 

[RD2003]

from the guy who would have a personal ICBM aimed at they

and would be outside the house

shaking a fist at NATO

try harder you fucking goon

 

[RD2003]

The reasonable heads have been removed. You haven’t really understood what’s happened in Russia have you.

I didn't say reasonable, but realistic.

Do people come to you for advice on all this, as somebody who really 'does' understand (ie has read the articles that happen to coincide with/clarify his vague thoughts on matter?)

 

[RD2003]

Just because he thinks men are from Mars and women from Venus, doesn't necessarally mean he knows where Putin is coming from.

I've always admired his ability to switch roles between political philosopher and pop psychologist.

 

[RD2003]

Oh like in Chechnya?

What, something happened somewhere else, so that means it's bound to happen everywhere?

Apart from the carnage, the two conflicts are in no way the same.

 

[Ax^]

if you have had a drink, i'll forgive some of your bullshite

 

[Kaka Tim]

What, something happened somewhere else, so that means it's bound to happen everywhere?

Apart from the carnage, the two conflicts are in no way the same.

Well the cunt responsible for the bloodbath is the same in both cases.

 

[RD2003]

Well the cunt responsible for the bloodbath is the same in both cases.

The first Chechen war took place under Yeltsin. The most directly western-friendly president Russia had seen for centuries, if not ever. Who was lauded in the west (when he wasn't derided for his alcoholism). And who helped choose Putin as his successor, after reviewing and even temporarily trying out some less 'adequate' characters. He did it in return for a guarantee of immunity from prosecution for corruption of the Yeltsin 'family.'

And as if terrible events can be explained by 'cunts' having the levers of power.

 

[Ax^]

.

 

[xenon]

i’m just some guy on the Internet. But I don’t think and you may call me cynical, talking to Putin about how much of Ukraine he would like, would’ve stopped him. Ukrainians might have objected in any case.

I didn't say reasonable, but realistic.

Do people come to you for advice on all this, as somebody who really 'does' understand (ie has read the articles that happen to coincide with/clarify his vague thoughts on matter?)

 

[Kaka Tim]

The first Chechen war took place under Yeltsin. The most directly western-friendly president Russia had seen for centuries, if not ever. Who was lauded in the west (when he wasn't derided for his alcoholism). And who helped choose Putin as his successor, after reviewing and even temporarily trying out some less 'adequate' characters. He did it in return for a guarantee of immunity from prosecution for corruption of the Yeltsin 'family.'

And as if terrible events can be explained by 'cunts' having the levers of power.

I think theres a fair few examples of that being a pretty major factor. Or were they all provoked by nato?

 

[xenon]

NATO, terrible what they done with those Moscow apartment blocks and the theatre, and the school in Beslam.

 

[Dystopiary]

Spoiler: another tragic victim of this bloody regime

Hanna Liubakova

 

[RD2003]

i’m just some guy on the Internet. But I don’t think and you may call me cynical, talking to Putin about how much of Ukraine he would like, would’ve stopped him. Ukrainians might have objected in any case.

That many Ukrainians would have objected is beyond argument. But we object to all sorts of things here, and are eternally disappointed.

 

[RD2003]

I think theres a fair few examples of that being a pretty major factor. Or were they all provoked by nato?

I thought you we probably older than 17.

 

[Kaka Tim]

That many Ukrainians would have objected is beyond argument. But we object to all sorts of things here, and are eternally disappointed.

yeah - fuck em. should give vlad what he wants cos "peace"

 

[Kaka Tim]

I thought you we probably older than 17.

Most 5 year olds understand the situation better than you do .

 

[RD2003]

yeah - fuck em. should give vlad what he wants cos "peace"

What has this got to do with all problems being reduced to 'cunts' being in charge? Not that it could happen, but if me or you were elevated to a position of world (or even relatively local) power, we'd become widely viewed as cunts very quickly. And by all sides, including our own.

 

[cesare]

What has this got to do with all problems being reduced to 'cunts' being in charge? Not that it could happen, but if me or you were elevated to a position of world (or even relatively local) power, we'd become widely viewed as cunts very quickly.

Many of us get viewed as cunts even without power tbf.

 

[Kaka Tim]

What has this got to do with all problems being reduced to 'cunts' being in charge? Not that it could happen, but if me or you were elevated to a position of world (or even relatively local) power, we'd become widely viewed as cunts very quickly.

Well I cant speak for you - but i dont think id launch an invasion of another country and threaten the nuclear annihilation of anyone who tried to intervene.

 

[RD2003]

Many of us get viewed as cunts even without power tbf.

Yeah. I get called one even by family, and quite often.

 

[RD2003]

Well I cant speak for you - but i dont think id launch an invasion of another country and threaten the nuclear annihilation of anyone who tried to intervene.

You probably wouldn't even have a decisive say.

And in any case, in that situation your concept of 'you' would be right down the shitter.

 

[Kaka Tim]

You probably wouldn't even have a decisive say.

And in any case, in that situation your concept of 'you' would be right down the shitter.

but putin did have a final say. thats the point. hes not a prisoner of the tides of history and geopolitics. He did what he did because of his own self delusion, arrogance and twisted world view (see also - Liz fucking truss). And that makes him a massive cunt.

 

[RD2003]

but putin did have a final say. thats the point. hes not a prisoner of the tides of history and geopolitics. He did what he did because of his own self delusion, arrogance and twisted world view (see also - Liz fucking truss). And that makes him a massive cunt.

He might be, and he might have had the final say. But the point is that this was always coming anyway. Amother leader would quite possibly have reasoned differently before doing something similar.

No conceivable Russian government will regard Ukraine in any other way. It's possible that one that might could arise, but such a government doesn't usually last long in Russia. Even the western de-facto stooge Yeltsin got pissed off in the end, whether all by himself or under pressure from the Russian elites.

 

[Kaka Tim]

He might be, and he might have had the final say. But the point is that this was always coming anyway. Amother leader would quite possibly have reasoned differently before doing something similar.

No conceivable Russian government will regard Ukraine in any other way. It's possible that one that might could arise, but such a government doesn't usually last long in Russia. Even the western de-facto stooge Yeltsin got pissed off in the end, whether all by himself or under pressure from the Russian elites.

It was not "always coming" that is utter bollocks. It took a particular combination of megalomania, power and self delusion to embark on such a disastrous course of action.

 

[RD2003]

It was not "always coming" that is utter bollocks. It took a particular combination of megalomania, power and self delusion to embark on such a disastrous course of action.

The invasion when it came, perhaps. But read the article from the ex-British ambassador to Russia in the war sceptics thread.