'Needle spiking' in UK nightclubs wtf?

[LDC]

Has anyone been "successful" with it though? Could be men trying it out without fully understanding the technicalities?

Yeah, I think that's one of the outside possibilities, someone trying it who hasn't got much of a clue, and hence why it's not resulting in more than it has (that we know of) so far.

 

[MrCurry]

Sounds like the organ theft scare stories which circulated a decade ago, which everyone forwarded on because they were so alarming, but which lacked any confirmed victims.

 

[Spymaster]

As the article points out, there are few drugs that could be administered by a passing pinprick. If this is an actual thing ...

I doubt it is. I think the idea that enough of a toxin to quickly incapacitate someone could be delivered by a casual scratch or pinprick is probably movie stuff. If it does exist it's more likely to be in the hands of the FSB or Porton Down, than some scrotes in Nottingham nightclubs.

 

[8ball]

Has anyone been "successful" with it though? Could be men trying it out without fully understanding the technicalities? Also, surely some drugs are active at very small doses?

i) One report looks like it, if it was as interpreted.
ii) Sounds likely if so.
iii) Yes, but no one seems able to think of any plausible agents that would work at very small injected volumes. Is possible someone has found something that interacts strongly with alcohol.

 

[8ball]

I doubt it is. I think the idea that enough of a toxin to quickly incapacitate someone could be delivered by a casual scratch or pinprick is probably movie stuff. If it does exist it's more likely to be in the hands of the FSB than some scrotes in Nottingham nightclubs.

It doesn't sound right, but I don't feel right about not believing these reports, which have come from a few locations spaced quite far apart.

 

[fishfinger]

It's a Bulgarian with an umbrella.

 

[Pickman's model]

It's a Bulgarian with a cocktail umbrella.

c4u

 

[bimble]

What’s definitely true is the reports of some women choosing their clothes with a view to how good a barrier they might be to protect you from being injected by a rapist because this feels like a totally real threat to them when going out. That in itself is just massively depressing & I think wouldn’t be happening if things in general were less ducked in this area.

 

[8ball]

What’s definitely true is the reports of some women choosing their clothes with a view to how good a barrier they might be to protect you from being injected by a rapist because this feels like a totally real threat to them when going out. That in itself is just massively depressing & I think wouldn’t be happening if things in general were less ducked in this area.

Aside from some really heavy denim (or Kevlar), I can't think what that might be.
The idea is too dystopian to contemplate.

 

[bimble]

Aside from some really heavy denim (or Kevlar), I can't think what that might be.
The idea is too dystopian to contemplate.

Yeah denim jackets is what I read

 

[DaveCinzano]

Havin'-a-column Syndrome: Squid Gaming school kids, 'needle spiking' and why British journalism loves a moral panic...

Who needs proof when you've got terror?

brokenbottleboy.substack.com

 

[ouirdeaux]

It doesn't sound right, but I don't feel right about not believing these reports, which have come from a few locations spaced quite far apart.

Which particular reports? The ones I've heard have been people saying that they reacted very badly after a night out, and have a vague idea that something pricked their skin at some point. Somehow, someone must have done something to them, because their alcohol consumption was less than normal and they hadn't taken anything else, honest they hadn't, they wouldn't do anything like that ever.

Well, maybe. If they were given anything they didn't notice, it was most likely slipped into the one drink they will admit to. But I am frankly sceptical about most of these stories, possibly because I hear so many. People who get completely off their face in nightclubs, whether it's a one-off or a habit, aren't the most reliable witnesses, and neither are their mates.

 

[Spymaster]

It's a Bulgarian with an umbrella.

Markov's assassin was actually more than likely Italian. Not a lot of people know that.

 

[existentialist]

I can see how with someone who had had some booze, a very small diameter needle might not even be noticed, but it sounds utterly psychopathic, as well as being utterly undeniable if caught in the place and liable to lead to a massive immediate sentence (though spiking of any kind should be treated as GBH with intent imo).

edit: I looked at the Nottingham article - that club in Nottingham, under it's old name, was the most depressing club I ever went into exactly due to an apparent culture of spiking. I'd never even noticed women covering their drinks before so that nothing could be slipped into it, but here it was all of them. I was often guarding the drinks for the women in the group I was with when they went to the loo. Tbh, if this was to happen anywhere, it would be there.

Once you get into administering substances, isn't there an offence of "poisoning"? Which I would imagine would be regarded even more seriously than GBH or other forms of assault.

ETA: Offences Against The Person Act 1861. "Maliciously administering poison..."

Offences against the Person Act 1861

An Act to consolidate and amend the Statute Law of England and Ireland relating to Offences against the Person.

www.legislation.gov.uk

 

[8ball]

Which particular reports? The ones I've heard have been people saying that they reacted very badly after a night out, and have a vague idea that something pricked their skin at some point. Somehow, someone must have done something to them, because their alcohol consumption was less than normal and they hadn't taken anything else, honest.

And one who took a picture of a puncture would and could barely move her leg the day after. A man has been arrested (and bailed pending toxicology reports) in that case.
I'm quite aware of how social contagion can happen, but I'd sooner take women's reports seriously and be wrong rather than the other way round.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

Here is a surprisingly good piece from Vice that suggests that spiking someone with a needle is actually pretty difficult

Here's What We Know About Reports of Women Being 'Spiked With Needles' in UK Clubs

As police forces investigate reports of women being victims of "spiking injections" and the Home Secretary requests an urgent update, what is actually going on?

www.vice.com

oops sorry LDC posted that in the OP.

 

[LDC]

People who get completely off their face in nightclubs, whether it's a one-off or a habit, aren't the most reliable witnesses, and neither are their mates.

Yeah, I've been to a few claimed spikings (drinks with drugs not needles) and sometimes it's been hard not to ask which one of the 12 pints they've had they think was spiked (was men mostly saying they'd be spiked ime).

 

[8ball]

Once you get into administering substances, isn't there an offence of "poisoning"? Which I would imagine would be regarded even more seriously than GBH or other forms of assault.

ETA: Offences Against The Person Act 1861. "Maliciously administering poison..."

Offences against the Person Act 1861

An Act to consolidate and amend the Statute Law of England and Ireland relating to Offences against the Person.

www.legislation.gov.uk

Actually, not - max sentence of 10 years as opposed to a max full life tariff.
I was a little surprised too.

 

[Fozzie Bear]

Drink spiking does seem to happen - there is also a bit of whatsapp hysterua about it, but the daughter has told me about a couple of incidents at her Uni which seem pretty credible.

 

[LDC]

What’s definitely true is the reports of some women choosing their clothes with a view to how good a barrier they might be to protect you from being injected by a rapist because this feels like a totally real threat to them when going out. That in itself is just massively depressing & I think wouldn’t be happening if things in general were less ducked in this area.

Yeah likewise, whatever the truth about it it shows a horrible level of fear that's very near the surface etc. for some women when they go out for a 'normal' night out.

 

[LDC]

Havin'-a-column Syndrome: Squid Gaming school kids, 'needle spiking' and why British journalism loves a moral panic...

Who needs proof when you've got terror?

brokenbottleboy.substack.com

I'd forgotten the Teenage Ninja Turtles panic of 1990....

The Daily Mail published a story of a four-year-old who ‘nearly bled to death after karate-kicking a glass door as he mimicked his television heroes in the Ninja Turtle cartoon cult’. Over at The Daily Telegraph, Victoria Mather claimed that ‘youngsters have been rescued from the sewers where they have been either seeking their scaly heroes or the necessary rat and user-friendly patch of radiation to turn themselves into pizza-powered warriors’.
The Daily Express reported that ‘a nationwide warning to children about the dangers of imitating the Teenage Mutant Hero Turtles’ was issued the government’s Health and Safety Executive, concerning children playing in the sewers. An appeal was to be made on Going Live by Philip Schofield and Sarah Greene. The same newspaper also ran a story warning children not to binge on pizza like the Turtles, quoting a doctor who said ‘Eating junk food is going to turn the kids into aggressive echoes of the turtles’.

"Is this the real life? Is this just Chris Morris fantasy..."

 

[rubbershoes]

Havin'-a-column Syndrome: Squid Gaming school kids, 'needle spiking' and why British journalism loves a moral panic...

Who needs proof when you've got terror?

brokenbottleboy.substack.com

Good article

 

[Spymaster]

Drink spiking does seem to happen - there is also a bit of whatsapp hysterua about it, but the daughter has told me about a couple of incidents at her Uni which seem pretty credible.

There's no doubt at all that drink spiking happens.

 

[LDC]

Stop that! It’s not Tourette’s but a new type of mass sociogenic illness

Müller-Vahl et al. report the first outbreak of a new type of mass sociogenic illness that is spread solely via social media. The condition, which typically aff

academic.oup.com

TikTok induced 'Tourette's like' behaviour.

Humans wtf.

 

[LDC]

I doubt it is. I think the idea that enough of a toxin to quickly incapacitate someone could be delivered by a casual scratch or pinprick is probably movie stuff. If it does exist it's more likely to be in the hands of the FSB or Porton Down, than some scrotes in Nottingham nightclubs.

"I am here to see the famous nightclubs of Salisbury."

 

[8ball]

Stop that! It’s not Tourette’s but a new type of mass sociogenic illness

Müller-Vahl et al. report the first outbreak of a new type of mass sociogenic illness that is spread solely via social media. The condition, which typically aff

academic.oup.com

TikTok induced 'Tourette's like' behaviour.

Humans wtf.

"Nervous tics" in "invented by TikTok in 2021" shocker!

I blame Billy Eilish.

 

[MickiQ]

Well having just shipped my 19 yo daughter off to Uni a month ago this isn't doing me any good on the sleepless nights front either, There was a girl on the BBC news this am who claimed that it had happened to her and she came across as believable.
Mrs Q called Middle last night to ask about this story and she told her Mum that they certainly get women (and the odd bloke) in A&E claiming their drinks have been spiked and some of them have been right but she's not encountered this.
Middle Q did her nursing degree in Nottingham and she agrees that Przym as it's now called has always been the shittiest of the shitty, she also assured her Mum that it's not the one she met Paddy in.
Deffo agree that whilst trying to inject women on the dance floor probably won't work in the way that the shitbag intended but the aforementioned shitbag might think it does and genuinely think the movies are right that you can just come up behind someone, inject them and they instantly collapse, these people probably don't have the greatest grasp on reality.

 

[Plumdaff]

There has been an issue with drink spiking for many years (long enough for it to have been an issue when I was a student and I'm old) and I can absolutely believe there's the odd fucker out there enjoying pricking women with needles because he gets off on their fear, and that could cause infection, injury etc. What I think is nigh on impossible is a large amount of spiking by injection because as others have said, it's very difficult to quickly sedate someone by IM injection even in a medical setting.

 

[8ball]

Middle Q did her nursing degree in Nottingham and she agrees that Przym as it's now called has always been the shittiest of the shitty, she also assured her Mum that it's not the one she met Paddy in.

Am getting a vibe that Mum maybe doesn't like Paddy that much.
You can meet nice people in shitty clubs tbf.

That place is something else, though - never seen anything like it.

 

[kropotkin]

Medically it’s verging on impossible surely. Firstly, what drug? Would have to be some kind of anaesthetic agent? but IM not IV? How long would it take to deliver it, multiple seconds not instantly. Without being felt? It doesn’t seem likely to have happened once let alone multiple times.

Like killer b says it’s a panic. Shame it’s distracting from the real issue which is male power, sexual harassment and assault.

No, its possible but I don't believe it. Subcutaneous midazolam would be very fast to administer and comes in 5mg/1ml so a reasonably small volume to inject into the fat. Quicker and easier to just put it in a drink though, as others have said.