Mountbatten's role in '68 plot against Harold Wilson.

[SpookyFrank]

Sas has put me on "permanent ignore" after sending me abuse and pics of blown up squaddies.

He's put me on 'permanent ignore' half a dozen times. Which doesn't make a lot of sense to me but hey, we can't all be smart enough to join the army.

 

[LiamO]

Seeing as you seem to have abused the PM system here by spamming the same FAQ-busting image multiple times, take another warning.

I got them too.
Tell me, tory-boy, did British bombs and bullets kill all the millions of innocents slaughtered by your beloved empire in some miraculously humane way?



Does he get another warning now editor ?

Why do you even have such images in your possession, Sasaferrato, you sad tory lapdog? Or are they from your porn stash?

 

[rekil]

He pmd me this pic a while ago during one of his genocidal furies.

Spoiler

Sir Thomas Norreys getting piked through the neck in an ambush by the Irish during the nine years war. One of Norreys's brothers was responsible for the Rathlin Island massacre and one of the 'game of thrones' style unarmed feast attendee bloodbaths.

 

[The39thStep]

Can’t see the purpose of looking back tbh and trying to justify things that occurred then, that were unique to those days but really couldn’t be justified now. What was then was then and there is no future in going back. Is the future for any one of us on the left really republicanism versus loyalism ? In my view probably not tbh. It has to be about the present and where we go from there .

 

[Artaxerxes]

Actually ... the majority of the people living on the island of Ireland want a united Ireland.

A lot want it but at the same don't particularly want it.

At the moment Norn has a bloated administrative budget and a subsidised economy that a united Ireland couldn't afford.

Along with the DUP and and all the associated shit going along with them and the RA.

 

[Baronage-Phase]

A lot want it but at the same don't particularly want it.

At the moment Norn has a bloated administrative budget and a subsidised economy that a united Ireland couldn't afford.

Along with the DUP and and all the associated shit going along with them and the RA.

True ... but you're assuming the subsidies will end. A united Ireland would be within the EU and I would imagine the EU will do its best to help ensure that NI as part of a united island of Ireland staying within the EU would be well equipped to get over any bumpy patches.
The majority in NI voted to remain in the EU. Those people are now being forced out of the EU by a British governemt that in reality does not give a toss about NI.

 

[Baronage-Phase]

Can’t see the purpose of looking back tbh and trying to justify things that occurred then, that were unique to those days but really couldn’t be justified now. What was then was then and there is no future in going back. Is the future for any one of us on the left really republicanism versus loyalism ? In my view probably not tbh. It has to be about the present and where we go from there .

'Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.'

 

[The39thStep]

'Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.'

Fair comment . However I'm not arguing that the slate can or should be fully washed but that to remember the past means we understand how we got here. Surely the whole point of getting here was to have a future?

 

[Baronage-Phase]

Fair comment . However I'm not arguing that the slate can or should be fully washed but that to remember the past means we understand how we got here. Surely the whole point of getting here was to have a future?

Unionists and nationalist leaders in NI who agreed to the good Friday agreement were aware that there had to be change. Current leadership in the unionist camp is feeding into hardline unionist groups who cannot and will not look forward and some of whom blatantly resent the gfa. That, in conjunction with a massively ignorant Tory leadership means that NI has already been plunged backwards into sectarianism. Ordinary people can see what is happening. Young people who were born in peacetime are seeing that peace eroded and the fact that sectarianism never truly went away on the ground and that true integration has not actually happened to the degree it should have, despite supposed power sharing, will mean that the likelihood of a return to violence is much stronger than it was 10 years ago.
Combine this with the fact there is a hard line unionist like Arlene Foster in power who refuses to work with other elected represenatives and you've a recipe for disaster. David Trimble at least saw the need to work together.

History is repeating itself and those in "power" are blind to that. Some dont care (Boris Johnson) that violent sectarianism is on the increase. Some are so entrenched in their own sectarianism and need to hold on to power that they will sacrifice someone else's peace. And some (terrorists on both sides) are ready to fight all over again. All this because people once again have abandoned reason and thought, in favour of believing their own lies. Leadership and government have fed extremism in the UK and NI. The tories and unionists are courting division and encouraging abandonment, once again of one population group in NI in favour of another population group. Deliberately blinkered about "the future", the Tories are ready to support a system in NI in the full knowledge that it will turn back the clock on progress and peace.

Every person living on the island of Ireland can see the way this is going to pan out. Some will inevitably find ways to fight this that are not political because politics is failing them.

 

[Pickman's model]

Unionists and nationalist leaders in NI who agreed to the good Friday agreement were aware that there had to be change. Current leadership in the unionist camp is feeding into hardline unionist groups who cannot and will not look forward and some of whom blatantly resent the gfa. That, in conjunction with a massively ignorant Tory leadership means that NI has already been plunged backwards into sectarianism. Ordinary people can see what is happening. Young people who were born in peacetime are seeing that peace eroded and the fact that sectarianism never truly went away on the ground and that true integration has not actually happened to the degree it should have, despite supposed power sharing, will mean that the likelihood of a return to violence is much stronger than it was 10 years ago.
Combine this with the fact there is a hard line unionist like Arlene Foster in power who refuses to work with other elected represenatives and you've a recipe for disaster. David Trimble at least saw the need to work together.

[...]

Every person living on the island of Ireland can see the way this is going to pan out. Some will inevitably find ways to fight this that are not political because politics is failing them.

everything is political, the decision to fight - who to fight, whether to fight, the decision on which tactics to adopt, etc etc

 

[Baronage-Phase]

everything is political, the decision to fight - who to fight, whether to fight, the decision on which tactics to adopt, etc etc

Fair point.
Maybe I should have written.."elected politicians".

 

[likesfish]

The new ira or whatever they are calling themselves appear to be equally up for a fight and sod everyone else
Although they don't appear to have much ability at the mo.

 

[N_igma]

In the past few days alone a Dissident Republican bomb exploded near the border with the aim of killing police officers, a drug dealing loyalist has been murdered and Catholic and Protestant youths (born after the GFA) have been petrol bombing and attacking each other at a Belfast interface. Not to mention the tumultuous summer surrounding bonfires and contentious marches.

My dad thinks I’m crazy for moving home, he thinks it’s all going to kick off again. I hope he is wrong.

 

[Baronage-Phase]

Well...what do people expect?
Boris is about to ditch the GFA.
Break a peace agreement and guess what happens?
Not peace.

 

[friedaweed]

In the past few days alone a Dissident Republican bomb exploded near the border with the aim of killing police officers, a drug dealing loyalist has been murdered and Catholic and Protestant youths (born after the GFA) have been petrol bombing and attacking each other at a Belfast interface. Not to mention the tumultuous summer surrounding bonfires and contentious marches.

My dad thinks I’m crazy for moving home, he thinks it’s all going to kick off again. I hope he is wrong.

It's a fucking shame. Most young people I would imagine want to see that sort of history become exactly that. I was picking my daughter up in Liverpool during the marching season and was saddened to see that shit continuing over here

How you stand a chance of eradicating it over there whilst it still finds a place to flourish elsewhere is beyond me.




Let's drag up a really shite part of the country's history every year so I can get me drum out

I don't get it myself. It's backwards not progress.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

My understanding of NI politics isn’t great but isn’t it true that Catholics are no longer treated as second class citizens? Lots of other ground to gain but that’s a major advance from how things were.

 

[tim]

It's a fucking shame. Most young people I would imagine want to see that sort of history become exactly that. I was picking my daughter up in Liverpool during the marching season and was saddened to see that shit continuing over here

How you stand a chance of eradicating it over there whilst it still finds a place to flourish elsewhere is beyond me.




Let's drag up a really shite part of the country's history every year so I can get me drum out

I don't get it myself. It's backwards not progress.

The middle class never approves of working class people having traditions, let alone having fun celebrating them. Unless they're working people in suitably distant foreign places.


This the sort of stuff middle class Brits love seeing when in holiday in Southern Europe. Orange marches are a paradoxically remnant of all those popular Catholic religious processions the reformation was meant to get rid of.

 

[friedaweed]

The middle class never approves of working class people having traditions, let alone having fun celebrating them. Unless they're working people in suitably distant foreign places.


This the sort of stuff middle class Brits love seeing when in holiday in Southern Europe. Orange marches are a paradoxically remnant of all those popular Catholic religious processions the reformation was meant to get rid of.

Really. That's a nice backwards view you've got there mate.

Enjoy it and stick it somewhere nice with your class aspersions along with your religious paradoxical dilemmas I'm sure they'll fit quite well alongside each other in your 'full of shit' colon.

From a former hod carrier and son of an Irish bricklayer. x

 

[tim]

Really. That's a nice backwards view you've got there mate.

Enjoy it and stick it somewhere nice with your class aspersions along with your religious paradoxical dilemmas I'm sure they'll fit quite well alongside each other in your 'full of shit' colon.

From a former hod carrier and son of an Irish bricklayer. x

I'm not the one muttering about trying to "eradicate" the assertion cultural identity either "over here" or "over there".

 

[littlebabyjesus]

The middle class never approves of working class people having traditions, let alone having fun celebrating them. Unless they're working people in suitably distant foreign places.


This the sort of stuff middle class Brits love seeing when in holiday in Southern Europe. Orange marches are a paradoxically remnant of all those popular Catholic religious processions the reformation was meant to get rid of.

Quasi-military marches with flags and banners celebrating religious and cultural division? They can shove it up their fucking arses. I don't care how long the tradition has been going. Some traditions are shit.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

I'm not the one muttering about trying to "eradicate" the assertion cultural identity either "over here" or "over there".

Oh god, this is the crap the DUP come out with. It's their 'culture' and should be protected.

 

[Magnus McGinty]

Yeah, culture has context.

 

[Poi E]

Pretty fucking odd having these wannabe Brit state paramilitaries marching all over the place. Britain and its blood soaked martial history eh. Sick stuff. Turn it inwards next I guess.

 

[tim]

Oh god, this is the crap the DUP come out with. It's their 'culture' and should be protected.

It won't go away because you don't like it or disapprove of it.

 

[littlebabyjesus]

It won't go away because you don't like it or disapprove of it.

Here was me thinking my post had put an end to Orange marches.

 

[tim]

Here was me thinking my post had put an end to Orange marches.

I'm sorry to have rained on your parade!

 

[Magnus McGinty]

It won't go away because you don't like it or disapprove of it.

How can an orange march be described as working class? It exists to deny that ffs.
If we’re arguing on those terms then Royal Weddings are working class.

 

[Baronage-Phase]

orange marches are a paradoxically remnant of all those popular Catholic religious processions the reformation was meant to get rid of.

No they are not
Look up origin of the orange order

 

[littlebabyjesus]

How can an orange march be described as working class? It exists to deny that ffs.
If we’re arguing on those terms then Royal Weddings are working class.

Yep. It's corporatist if anything. A vertical view of society rather than a horizontal one, hence its sectarian nature.

 

[Baronage-Phase]

] The Orange Order was founded in County Armagh in 1795, during a period of Protestant–Catholic sectarian conflict, as a Masonic-style fraternity sworn to maintain the Protestant Ascendancy.