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Italian politics and elections - news and discussion

Long shot but appreciate any answers. I'm wondering if The League / Northern League have any traceable lineage to the pro Mussolini fascists who continued to fight the socialists in Italy after the 2nd World War.

Thanks
 
DotCommunist said:
the goans opinion piece on the result recons the rise of populism threatens to kill liberal democracy (good) and its because the youngs don't remember hitler or the cold war.
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The death of liberal democracy aint much good if it's replaced with the far right shit that has been offered for years, here and elsewhere, as a fake alternative.

In fact, the establishment offering fascism as an alternative when it is in crisis goes back a long way. Hitler, as one example, took power in coalition with conservatives (Bavarians).

The hoaxing of significant sections of the working class into fascism (on top of a degree of bourgeois support) under the ruse of it being "anti establishment" and "populist" (one of the most lazily manipulated words of the current political lexicon) is not a tragedy to be celebrated.
 
There are/were direct descendants of them openly organised as fascists groupings. They didn't need to spend 60 years hiding in some regionalist bloc. I think they were even represented in the 48 parliament. I fully expect to see pieces re-cycling them as the direct inheritors though.
 
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taffboy gwyrdd said:
The death of liberal democracy aint much good if it's replaced with the far right shit that has been offered for years, here and elsewhere, as a fake alternative.

In fact, the establishment offering fascism as an alternative when it is in crisis goes back a long way. Hitler, as one example, took power in coalition with conservatives (Bavarians).

The hoaxing of significant sections of the working class into fascism (on top of a degree of bourgeois support) under the ruse of it being "anti establishment" and "populist" (one of the most lazily manipulated words of the current political lexicon) is not a tragedy to be celebrated.
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Can you point to a few contemporary examples of 'the establishment offering fascism' please?
 
taffboy gwyrdd said:
Cheers Chilango.
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I mean we could go into the origins of the Lega and separatism in Northern Italy - the differences and similarities between Lombard/Venetian Nationalism and that of the Aosta valley and the South Tyrol.

I'm not sure thats useful to you though?
 
The promotion of UKIP by the BBC accelerated after the 2008/9 crash.

UKIP rhetoric has often crossed over with fascism, Young Independence have a fascist speaker lined up.

Trump was initially adored by the mainstream press, including liberal press, less perhaps for his rancid politics than his PT Barnum vibe but nonetheless, they were promoting a man with the likes of Miller, Bannon, Sessions on his team.

Socialism scares the establishment more than fascism, so they know which side to prefer in a crisis even if it's reluctant.

Groups like AFD instinctively play on this, far right politics is the officially sanctioned "alternative".

It's a standard enough dynamic Butchers.

The establishment eventually went with Hitler, and he was notably admired by many in the English establishment as a counter-weight to socialism. Same dynamic.

Even social democrats brought in Friekorps to put down socialist uprisings, perhaps a different case but inordinately stupid in the light of what followed.

The CIA have promoted fascists as an alternative to the left in various places, Chile as just one example.

The Conservative Party has links to Hitler apologists via Traditional Britain, who Mogg has consorted with (as well as Bannon of course). It is an extremely right wing party in many cases (which is partly how it managed to eventually scupper the NF)

The elite billionaire propagandists who own British newspapers often push fascist themes and rhetoric (obsessive hatred of minorities, "enemies of the people" type stuff)

This is all off the top of the head from various world locations over the last 80 or so years.

If the pattern has escaped you I am extremely surprised.
 
butchersapron said:
Can you point to a few contemporary examples of 'the establishment offering fascism' please?
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Some of those examples are contemporary. I don't think for a minute you are as stupid as you are pretending to be, just pointlessly obtuse as usual.

You ask a question I give a range of answers. You basically act like they don't exist. It's lame and I am sure you can do better, though I remain as mystified as ever regarding what you're seeking to achieve. Hope you're in good form and have a good day.
 
The whole anti "liberal elite" meme is classic hoax alternative bilge promoted by operatives and dupes of an authoritarian elite. Perhaps some people were too busy nit picking on here to notice what has been going on in British political discourse this decade.
 
Gift from an Italian friend...

28685796_10156030949049774_7257395346202350465_n.jpg
 
Funnily enough, speaking of descendants of Mussolini fascism, the M5S leader Luigi Di maio's dad was an active member of MSI, inheritors of the "Republic of Salò" legacy in no uncertain terms and openly fash
 
Good piece from Wu Ming. Ought to be obvious but still...

And worth reading worth the likes of Trump and UKIP and Brexit in mind too. It's not the same, but...
 
Italy's new PM nominee Giuseppe Conte begins forming cabinet
AFP 24 May 2018
Italy's prime ministerial nominee Giuseppe Conte was locked in consultations to form a cabinet on Thursday after being endorsed to lead a populist coalition government.

Conte's appointment could herald an end to more than two months of political uncertainty in the eurozone's third-biggest economy, but the coalition's eurosceptic and anti-immigrant stance has alarmed senior European officials.

President Sergio Mattarella on Wednesday approved Conte's nomination to be prime minister of a government formed by the anti-establishment Five Star Movement and the far-right League. Little-known lawyer Conte survived a battering in the press over claims he exaggerated his CV.

On Thursday he held meetings with delegations from political parties in order to put together the country's new government.

According to the media, he could present his cabinet to the president on Friday. The list of ministerial candidates must be endorsed by Mattarella before it can seek parliamentary approval.

Italian media reported that League chief Matteo Salvini would become interior minister while Five Star leader Luigi Di Maio would be in charge of the economic development ministry.
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Apparently part of the agreement between M5S and The League is "that unregistered Roma camps should be shut down."

Old thread from 2010. Expulsions of Roma in Europe (France, Italy etc)
 
Mattarella defended his decision by saying that naming Savona as finance minister – which he already said he opposed – posed a risk for Italian families and citizens, because it created uncertainty in the Italian economy.

“I asked for that ministry an authoritative political figure from the coalition parties who was not seen as the supporter of a line that could provoke Italy’s exit from the euro,” Mattarella said.
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Mattarella said he would evaluate a call by the leaders of the M5S and the Lega for snap elections. He summoned a former official at the International Monetary Fund, Carlo Cottarelli, to the presidential palace on Monday, which was interpreted as a sign that Cottarelli would be asked to form a government of unelected technocrats.
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Even if there's a short term move back to "centrist" parties as many Italians go back to the devil they know, the long-term the beneficiaries of this are going to be groups like the League, or those with politics that are even nastier.

This is the real attack on democracy, the Cambridge Analytica stuff is chaff compared to this.
 
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Disastrous move by Mattarella. This will backfire. There will be open protest to a technocrat government this time, unlike when Monti was brought in, and it will only strengthen Lega at the next elections, as this just confirms all of the eurosceptic stuff that M5S and Lega are pushing. They know this, of course.
 
New elections to be held.
Italy is to hold fresh elections in the autumn after President Sergio Mattarella appointed an economist as interim prime minister following the collapse of a bid for power by populist parties.

Mattarella asked Carlo Cottarelli, a former International Monetary Fund official, to try to form a government before the elections, which are likely to be seen as a referendum on Italy’s continued inclusion in the eurozone.
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EDIT: Actually that might be bad reporting by the Guardian, BBC has
After meeting the president, Mr Cottarelli said he would present a programme to parliament, including a budget, to take Italy into new elections "at the beginning of 2019".

If he was unable to pass a programme, which appears likely at this stage, "the government would resign immediately... until elections are held after the month of August", he added.
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Latest polling (and yes, I know, polls etc) shows a complete electoral eclipse of left - compromised centrists of PD at 19 percent, social democratic split at less than 3, rest of left and Communists not even visible. EUphile establishment mishandling continuing. Whole system in crisis and far right Lega eroding lead of populist 5 Star. Open fascists polling ahead of social democratic split from PD.
Depressing and dangerous.

New poll by SWG for La7

5 Stars 29.5%
Lega 27.5%
PD 19.4%
Forza Italia 8.0%
Brothers of Italy 3.8%
Free and Equals 2.7%

Read more: Italian general election 2018 | Vote UK Forum
 
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