Israel in coordinated missile attacks on Gaza

[Gmart]

Good. Kill as many Hamas as possible. I never thought I would say that but I don't see any alternative.

I think that maybe you should think more, rather than counsel genocide. Maybe the Palestinians have more reason to be listened to than you previously thought. Maybe Israel as an experiment was unrealistic. Moving wholescale to a land with a native population which didn't really fit in with the plan? Even with dubious history behind you, common sense dictates that those who are born of the land are native and that they should be allowed to live with freedom on their lands.

Israel's days may be be limited, and a 1-state solution in a numerical minority with the Palestinians would be preferable to genocide. You claim to be reasonable, and so please be so! The time has come to recognise the truth that Israel seems unable or unwilling to give them a state of their own. The only alternative is the 1-state solution and giving the Palestinians a life worth living, which Israel has refused to do so up til now.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

I think that maybe you should think more, rather than counsel genocide.

Maybe we can convince Hamas to stop counselling genocide.

 

[Gmart]

Maybe we can convince Hamas to stop counselling genocide.

Two wrongs don't make a right - both sides need to compromise but organising a ceasefire and then not lifting the barricade was incendiary, and inevitably Hamas was going to react with their people slowly dying of starvation.

 

[Gmart]

Palestinians need to be able to make a life for themselves - taking their land away from them and using violence etc is just going to elongate the conflict.

 

[Spion]

Maybe we can convince Hamas to stop counselling genocide.

Israel is the only one carrying out genocide. And you stand with them

Fuck off Johnny

 

[Zachor]

The BNP support Israel

Must be nice to align yourself with fascists who deny the holocaust to score political points ... oh, wait. only people who support the palestinians can do that.

I hate White Fash of the BNP and the Brown Fash of Islamism with an equal passion. So what if some BNP wankstain makes a pro Israel comment - there are a considerably greater number of anti Israel/anti Jew comments from the brown fash if you care to explore that particular cesspit. The main worrying issue for me here is that here we have a significant portion of the UK left who rather than call for a lasting peace for both sides chooses to ignore the negative effect on Palestinians of being run by a fascist organisation in the form of Hamas. Whats worse is its not just a case of ignoring them we now have a situation where the UK Left is actually backing Hamas.

If you ignore the growth of Islamofascism because of Liberal Guilt and only concentrate on the white fash then that is not a morally honest position to be in for any antifascist. Fascism doesn't just come with snazzy uniforms and jackboots you know, sometimes it comes in clerical garb.

Hamas are fascists, in thought and word and deed. Many sensible people see that and the fact that there will never be a better deal for the Palestinians unless Hamas are no more.

As regards civilian deaths in Gaza they are go be regretted and Gazan society needs to be rebuilt after this conflict to avoid another Islamofash group exploiting grievances as a prelude to a proper settlement.

Also regarding civvy deaths it would help to remember that 10,000 French civilians died during the preparations for and during Operation Overlord. Without the willingness of free nations being able to accept the fact that sometimes civilians get killed in war, the Nazis would never have been beaten which seems to me a price worth paying.

The civvys in Gaza are sadly in a similar position to the civvys in France in WWII. They will be hit unintentionally by munitions aimed at military targets. I'm disgusted that Hamas fascists are gathering civilians around target areas in order to create more 'martyrs'. Its heartbreaking that innocent people are being killed but sometimes this is going to happen in battles against fascism.

 

[Zachor]

Maybe we can convince Hamas to stop counselling genocide.

An end to some of the 'childrens programmes' that encourage hatred of others that come from Hamas TV would be a fucking good thing as well.

 

[Dimitris]

1414 posts have been written on this topic... the vast majority of them is posts arguying over the hamas – israeli state views and positions, but I think we have failed to address the problem correctly, because for me the problem is the PEOPLE and how they live, and not their rulers.... As an anti authoritarian I am NEVER going to support a regime, especially because it is always them, the state, that create all the problems, not the people. I do not believe that a israeli worker or farmer, really has a problem with a palestinian one, or the opposite... This can be proven by the thousands of israeli people that demonstrate in Telaviv and elsewhere against this war as well as the big number of israeli soldiers that have refused to fight and are now in prison. The palestinian people, not Hamas, are in deep humanitarian crisis. They live in very bad conditions in poverty anyway, and these attacks and the blockade are creating an ever bigger problem to their suffering.

Personally I do not believe that Hamas are such a big threat for Israel. They are a number of fighters, with limited resources and guns, with no modern technology, and I believe that if Israel really wanted they could eliminate Hamas, by finding their members with all the surveylance equipment they have and by hitting main strategic targets like training camps and other Hamas buildings.This is clearly not happening though... During the last 60 years, always with the excuse of fighting against terrorism, Israel attacks Palestine, killing thousands civilians. It is clear that their motives are different, and this circle of violence will not stop, if this specific point exactly will not be tackled.

It has allready been explained, that ideologies as zionism and islamic fantamentalism, are promoted to people as "religions", in order them to accept the policies of their rulers, either Hamas or the israeli state, without questioning....

We shoud demand with even bigger pressure the immediate cease fire in the area... This war will definately not solve anything, but only add more suffering to the local populations. This is only a step though to a big road ahead.... The real goal must always be to improve people relations to make israeli and palestinian people to be able to live together, and then themselves will demand from their rulers and the state the end of this war.

This may sound idealistic or utopic but this is the only proper solution to the problem... Just a creation of 2 states will not really solve anything, palestinians and israeli may have then their own state but problems between them will still exist, especially as Israel controlls a lot of the resources.

 

[Zachor]

The real goal must always be to improve people relations to make israeli and palestinian people to be able to live together, and then themselves will demand from their rulers and the state the end of this war.
.

That is something I can most wholeheartedly agree with.

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Israel is the only one carrying out genocide. And you stand with them

Fuck off Johnny

Calling what's happening in Gaza 'genocide', is to spit on those who died in real genocides, in places like Rwanda.

 

[agricola]

Calling what's happening in Gaza 'genocide', is to spit on those who died in real genocides, in places like Rwanda.

Yes Spion, give it a week before you make that comment.

 

[Spion]

Calling what's happening in Gaza 'genocide', is to spit on those who died in real genocides, in places like Rwanda.

Whatever, you're spitting on 660 dead people and smiling about it so far

 

[belboid]

That is something I can most wholeheartedly agree with.

yeah - start by improving relations here then, and fucking off and dying you worthless racist piece of shite

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

Whatever, you're spitting on 660 dead people and smiling about it so far

Why not go all the way, and call it a 'holocaust'.

 

[belboid]

Calling what's happening in Gaza 'genocide', is to spit on those who died in real genocides, in places like Rwanda.

you just goggle where Rwanda is by any chance Johnny? Good boy, now you fuck off too.

 

[agricola]

Why not go all the way, and call it a 'holocaust'.

They actually have their own word for it, you know.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Article 2 of the Convention defines genocide as

...any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

– Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, Article 2

Article 3 defines the crimes that can be punished under the convention:

: (a) Genocide;

(b) Conspiracy to commit genocide;
(c) Direct and public incitement to commit genocide;
(d) Attempt to commit genocide;
(e) Complicity in genocide.

– Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, Article 3

http://www.unhchr.ch/html/menu3/b/p_genoci.htm

Now, while there are undoubtedly people on both sides of this conflict guilty of incitement, there is only one party that's really in a position to do anything serious about it.

I certainly think the case is arguable that the Israeli government is actively doing a), b) and c).

 

[Zachor]

yeah - start by improving relations here then, and fucking off and dying you worthless racist piece of shite

Weak. Can't engage with the arguments if the come from outside your dogma so you are reduced to insults. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone IRL who would call me racist. Or in the topsy turvy world of the new UK Left does standing up against the fascism of Hamas and similar organisations now count as racism?

 

[agricola]

Weak. Can't engage with the arguments if the come from outside your dogma so you are reduced to insults. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone IRL who would call me racist. Or in the topsy turvy world of the new UK Left does standing up against the fascism of Hamas and similar organisations now count as racism?

Those IRL people might not have read this:

Good. Kill as many Hamas as possible. I never thought I would say that but I don't see any alternative.

Killing as many Hamas members and their supporters as the IDF can is the way to go now. Kill kiddies bomb schools bomb hospitals bomb everything they all support hamas, even the one year olds, they all must die

Anti Zionists -- Fuck you.

 

[Spion]

Why not go all the way, and call it a 'holocaust'.

I don't need to. The people you align yourself with already threatened it

"Israel's deputy defence minister has said Israel will have "no choice" but to invade Gaza if Palestinian militants step up rocket attacks.

Matan Vilnai said Palestinians risked a "shoah", the Hebrew word for a big disaster - and for the Nazi Holocaust."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/7270650.stm

 

[belboid]

Weak. Can't engage with the arguments if the come from outside your dogma so you are reduced to insults. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone IRL who would call me racist. Or in the topsy turvy world of the new UK Left does standing up against the fascism of Hamas and similar organisations now count as racism?

Anyone who read the post you made last night would call you precisely that you vile little scumbag.

You're a racist tory scab cunt, who wouldnt recognise fascism if it was pummelling you n the face.

 

[Spion]

Anyone who read the post you made last night would call you precisely that you vile little scumbag.

You're a racist tory scab cunt, who wouldnt recognise fascism if it was pummelling you n the face.

I'm sorry. I recant

 

[belboid]

good lad, nice to know someone here has a sense of decency

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

From Bernie's post.

Article 2 of the Convention defines genocide as

...any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

– Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, Article 2

Article 3 defines the crimes that can be punished under the convention:

: (a) Genocide;

(b) Conspiracy to commit genocide;
(c) Direct and public incitement to commit genocide;
(d) Attempt to commit genocide;
(e) Complicity in genocide.

– Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide, Article 3

"The Day of Judgment will not come about until Moslems fight the
Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees.
The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew
behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, would not do that
because it is one of the trees of the Jews."

 

[Johnny Canuck3]

I don't need to. The people you align yourself with already threatened it

Given that the israelis have nukes and superior arms, one has to wonder why they haven't done it already, given how evil they are to your way of thinking.

 

[Spion]

From Bernie's post.



"The Day of Judgment will not come about until Moslems fight the
Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees.
The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew
behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, would not do that
because it is one of the trees of the Jews."

And Johnny makes his contribution to the Protocols of the Elders of Mecca.

Good work, Goebbels!

 

[agricola]

From Bernie's post.

"The Day of Judgment will not come about until Moslems fight the
Jews (killing the Jews), when the Jew will hide behind stones and trees.
The stones and trees will say O Moslems, O Abdulla, there is a Jew
behind me, come and kill him. Only the Gharkad tree, would not do that
because it is one of the trees of the Jews."

One would question whether a plan for genocide that relies on talking shrubbery and rocks can really be described as a realistic plan.

 

[Spion]

Given that the israelis have nukes and superior arms, one has to wonder why they haven't done it already, given how evil they are to your way of thinking.

You're projecting. I don't think they're evil. Unlike your view of muslims, as you're clearly demonstrating here

 

[Zachor]

Calling what's happening in Gaza 'genocide', is to spit on those who died in real genocides, in places like Rwanda.

Very true. You can bet your bottom dollar that the Interamhamwe didn't send messages telling their victims which buildings to avoid.

The deaths of civilians in Gaza are not the primary motive for the military action there. These deaths are unfortunate byproducts of the action and Hamas must bear some of the responsibility for these deaths as they have not only taken no action to protect their civilians but have in some cases actively put civilians in harms way. Hamas should be languishing in cells in The Hauge not running Gaza.

 

[Bernie Gunther]

Yes, as I say, there's a reasonable case to be made for incitement on both sides, but there's only one party in a position to actually practice genocide and it's straightforwardly arguable that they are.