Hamas/Israel conflict: news and discussion

[PR1Berske]

They can hack a battery to get it to explode? Would there not be safety features in the device to stop it doing this? Or is it a similar story to batteries in vapes etc that often just need to be overheated?

Can pagers be 'instructed' to carry out tasks that could feasibly cause it to overheat?

 

[TopCat]

They had explosives in each and every one and set them off.

 

[_Russ_]

There is a hardware aspect to this, you can't just instruct a standard pager to blow up.

 

[maomao]

That's what this security guy said, he said as crazy as it sounds, it's much more likely than thousands of phones with a few grams of explosive inserted into each.

Obviously, if that's true, it could mean every lithium battery phone is potentially a remotely controllable explosive. In our pockets.

If you could make people's pagers or phones explode on demand, someone would have done it with one phone before Mossad did it with several thousand.

 

[gentlegreen]

All the videos of exploding lithium cells involve a dead short using a nail or something.
Simple short circuits are less dramatic - steam and swelling but no explosions.
This smacks to me of quite dramatic re-engineering using a detonator hooked up to a spare microcontroller port and firmware tweaked to allow that port to be remotely activated ... perhaps via a firmware update.

 

[Aladdin]

Could they have forced the batteries to overheat leading them to explode? Bit of cyclical code that puts strain on the battery?.

Eta I know nothing about code etc but I've seen lithium battery fires online. They're extremely difficult to put out.

 

[Wookey]

If you could make people's pagers or phones explode on demand, someone would have done it with one phone before Mossad did it with several thousand.

Except, they didn't.

That's why we're all guessing how on earth this has been done, and just which part or parts of the Geneva Convention does it actually break?

 

[maomao]

Except, they didn't.

That's why we're all guessing how on earth this has been done, and just which part or parts of the Geneva Convention does it actually break?

We're only guessing for now. I'm sure there will have been enough duds that the details will be out soon. And Israel and the US have made it quite clear the Geneva convention doesn't apply to Israel.

 

[Rob Ray]

The US continues to believe that there needs to be a diplomatic solution to the ongoing conflict between Israel and Hezbollah, White House spokesperson Karine Jean-Pierre said on Tuesday.

"If only we could do something to stop the killing" says country as it continues to send weaponry.

 

[2hats]

I just don’t see though how you could simultaneously get them to detonate instantly like they, the available footage certainly looks like regular explosions.

The available videos don't look like failure modes of Li batteries. A small HE charge seems more likely. You couldn't guarantee the charge state of the battery (which might, in many cases, be AAA anyway).

 

[Pickman's model]

Perhaps we need a new thread to focus on this action and its consequences rather than tacking it on to one about the zionist genocide

 

[AverageJoe]

It's like a film, or an episode of 24.

Im super conflicted. It's incredible but also horrible at the same time. The methodology and brains of this idea vs the actual devastation.

 

[kebabking]

It's like a film, or an episode of 24.

Im super conflicted. It's incredible but also horrible at the same time. The methodology and brains of this idea vs the actual devastation.

The Israelis' have done it - ish - in the 90's a Palestinian bombmaker ordered a new mobile phone.

They intercepted it, filled it with plastic, and sent it on its way. they rang him, he answered, and the bomb blew his head off.

 

[marshall]

It's like a film, or an episode of 24.

Im super conflicted. It's incredible but also horrible at the same time. The methodology and brains of this idea vs the actual devastation.

I know right, fiendishly clever

 

[_Russ_]

Killing in the name of.....

 

[Kevbad the Bad]

If Hezbollah or Hamas had done this to Israeli troops' pagers it would have been called 'terrorism'. What do we call it when Israel is the perpetrator?

 

[Gramsci]

I think they'd have much more of a defence to this than to anything in the current South Africa-led case. I mean, these are (according to reports) pagers issued by Hezbollah to persons they've authorised to have them; just that almost certainly makes this a discriminate attack against Hezbollah, irrespective that they couldn't guarantee who was actually holding the device or near the device.

"Indiscriminate" in this hasn't ever really been defined, but it would probably only cover knowingly using indiscriminate / disproportionate means to attack when other means were available; eg: using a 2000lb bomb that flattens a block rather than a precision guided munition to kill one person, or firing artillery shells into a crowded residential area when PGMs are also available and could be used instead. TBF I don't even think "indiscriminate" would cover an attack when unguided weapons (like Hamas / PIJ rockets) are the only weapons at hand.

Now if they'd blown up every pager in Lebanon, that would be indiscriminate.

What would there defence be? Just asking.

This is an action taking place in another state which Israel is not at war with.

It's extra judicial killing on another states land.

I do not think this could be regarded as legitimate self defence.

Israel state is well armed to defend itself without actions like this,

As Israel state believes its a democracy and part of the west etc I don't see how they can justify this action. If they did it. So far they aren't saying it was them.

It looks like a lot of bystanders are casualties as well.

 

[Pickman's model]

Thread here Israel and hezbollah after the exploding pagers

 

[Gramsci]

Id rather discuss it here.

 

[Pickman's model]

Id rather discuss it here.

Because? Maybe we should just retitle this thread 'middle east after 7.10.23' and have done with it

 

[Ax^]

Only if thread title font is changed to Comic Sans

 

[Petcha]

There is a hardware aspect to this, you can't just instruct a standard pager to blow up.

Well yeh, of course the Israelis got involved in the supply chain there at some point. From a purely objective view, its fucking genius.

 

[Pickman's model]

Well yeh, of course the Israelis got involved in the supply chain there at some point. From a purely objective view, its fucking genius.

No it isn't. Because does this lower or raise the probability of an escalation? It makes it far more likely that shit will hit the fan, even if it (imo) makes it less likely that things will go batshit in the next few days

 

[PR1Berske]

Because? Maybe we should just retitle this thread 'middle east after 7.10.23' and have done with it

I get the point but this is clearly linked and better one thread than splitting conversations between threads.

 

[Petcha]

No it isn't. Because does this lower or raise the probability of an escalation? It makes it far more likely that shit will hit the fan, even if it (imo) makes it less likely that things will go batshit in the next few days

I just mean the logistics. It's proper Bourne. Of course it's a fucking stupid move but quite impressive in its creativity. Definitely more out there than the usual approach of bombing schools with drone.

 

[Pickman's model]

I get the point but this is clearly linked and better one thread than splitting conversations between threads.

No it isn't. One topic at least will suffer, whether it is our discussion of gaza or our discussion of the escalation and its repercussions. Maybe both

 

[Pickman's model]

I just mean the logistics. It's proper Bourne. Of course it's a fucking stupid move but quite impressive in its creativity. Definitely more out there than the usual approach of bombing schools with drone.

So it's an objectively fucking stupid move then

 

[Bingoman]

A mass remote control activation of lithium batteries, in the very pockets of thousands of people, triggered remotely by an attacking agent.

It's not running out of ideas. It's a brand new idea. And it is fucking terrifying.

And it would also give terrorists around the world ideas too

 

[Petcha]

Most of those guys would have had their pagers very close to their balls you would think. Going for their manhood. And it's thousands of them. Sorry, but from an evil genius POV this is up there.

 

[Gramsci]

Because? Maybe we should just retitle this thread 'middle east after 7.10.23' and have done with it

Fair point.

You might be right to start separate thread.. People can go on about proxy wars and weapons on that. Might be better thinking on it to have separate thread. Rather than fill this one. When Palestinians are still be killed in Gaza. Funny how there is sudden interest in this thread when Israel assassinates ( allegedly) members of Hezbollah

It just that Israel state thinks it can act with impunity whether that is in Gaza , West Bank or outside Israel. In that way they are linked. I don't expect much of a reaction from our government or US. Maybe a few words of criticism and then back to normal.

I think what can be lost in this is the plight of the Palestinians. As some of previous posts show discussion gets onto Iran.

Or discussion of weapons and so called proxy wars.

At bottom of this conflict is the injustice done to Palestinians for decades now. For them there is no proxy war. They are being killed and losing their homes. Which started in 48 and still continues.