Grenfell Tower fire in North Kensington - news and discussion

[SpookyFrank]

She's wrong. She's itching for a scapegoat from the management company. This is a political disaster, a direct result of the tabloids and the Tories' war on health and safety and red tape. Political heads should roll. Don't be taken in by her anger, she's never been right in her life.

Agreed. She seems to be trying to point the finger at some kind of low-level corruption, when it seems pretty clear that there are systemic failures here that go all the way to the top and are in no way confined to this one building.

 

[Orang Utan]

I've got a bit of a bee in my bonnet about this, but it's pertinent. Last year the borough of Kensington & Chelsea had 1399 empty homes:
This is the London borough with the most empty homes
Yet people are having to sleep in a sports centre.
Can't help seeing parallels with New Orleans' Katrina disaster here. Different scale of course, but in both cases the poor got shafted cos of deliberate neglect and lack of foresight.

 

[JTG]

Katie fucking Hopkins is on the scene? Haven't these people suffered enough? I mean that seriously, not as a joke - someone that manipulative and sociopathic should not be allowed near suffering people.

Not that I have much time for him but the fact she mentions Sadiq Khan by name and nobody else tells you where she's manipulating this to

 

[Dogsauce]

Meanwhile, in Tory twat land

 

[SpookyFrank]

Metropolitan police famously not a firefighting organisation of course.

Fire engines already have water cannons. They just don't use them on the public.

 

[trashpony]

This is a really long thread and so someone may have already mentioned it but I was just looking for photos of the building before the fire and it appears as a case study on Construction Enquirer, WITT UK Group (who make smoke control products), Studio E architects, Harley Facades (I know they have been talked about on the thread) and of course Rydon. All of them have taken the relevant pages down except for Rydon. Bunch of fucking cowards

 

[Lucy Fur]

Meanwhile, in Tory twat land


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Fuck me theres some scum around. And hopkins can fucking do one to, shes getting no millGe out of this as far as im concerned. Hope fellow urbanz personnal involvement is minimal and thoughts go out to all affected

 

[equationgirl]

TBH lessons were learned after the Kings Cross fire, and the Underground is much safer as a result.

That's true, but wooden escalators were in place at Holborn long after it was claimed they had all been replaced. I remember using them, although not quite sure when, but the earliest would have been around 1999/2000.

 

[SpookyFrank]

This is a really long thread and so someone may have already mentioned it but I was just looking for photos of the building before the fire and it appears as a case study on Construction Enquirer, WITT UK Group (who make smoke control products), Studio E architects, Harley Facades (I know they have been talked about on the thread) and of course Rydon. All of them have taken the relevant pages down except for Rydon. Bunch of fucking cowards

Lawyer's advice no doubt. I assume they'll also have been told not to express sympathy, offer to help or do anything else which could be construed as an admission of culpability.

e2a: I got this insider knowledge from watching TV shows with lawyers in them.

 

[1927]

If we were reading about this in history books about Victorian London it would be harrowing. The fact that is happening in 21st century London is unbelievable! Haven't seen news all say, but watching it now is cultivating all sorts of emotions, and none of them desirable.

 

[Artaxerxes]

Firefighters and medics, I want to buy the fucking lot of them a massive amount of pints. Can't imagine having to charge into something like this as your job, fair play to the buggers.


Whoevers responsible for this absolute shit show of a catastrophe needs to be sued until they bleed and thrown in the deepest darkest nick we can find.

 

[1927]

New Orleans superdome maybe not the best example here. Read up on it, it's an excellent case study in how not to deal with evacuees from a disaster area.

I was thinking more of the concept!

 

[ViolentPanda]

Did you kill Grenfell towers

Nope, but the police killed Liddle Towers.

 

[Cid]

I had a quick chat with my mum earlier (recently retired architect), she was pretty damning about the regs on this sort of thing. Outdated, poorly inspected. She though it might be EPS insulation, I said surely they'd spec PIR or similar. She said they probably should, but they probably can spec EPS, and it's a fuck of a lot cheaper, so they would. With fire travelling up ventilation gaps that are kind of necessary in any system.

 

[JTG]

Realise this has probably been asked/answered already today but anyone with a link to a verified fundraiser? There's loads but you know...

 

[scifisam]

OMG, is that image on the BBC News now really live? Half the windows are still blazing!

 

[not-bono-ever]

Stay mad mate.

its cry or kick off here Wilf.so angry at this. so fucking angry

 

[MAD-T-REX]

Lawyer's advice no doubt. I assume they'll also have been told not to express sympathy, offer to help or do anything else which could be construed as an admission of culpability.

e2a: I got this insider knowledge from watching TV shows with lawyers in them.

The horse has bolted as far as any legal liability goes. I reckon it's more likely to be on the advice of the crisis comms consultants that they hired in a panic this morning - the boasts about the great job that they did, etc, wouldn't look great.

 

[Sparkle Motion]

So a Beko fridge...or a Whirlpool washer - both articles have had recalls for substandard or dangerous manufacturing...and yet, they carry on producing cheap dangerous crap, seemingly without sanction.

I heard a faulty TV on one programme. So could have been literally anything. Truth is, we are still in the speculation stage. Just cannot believe such a thing could happen. Lots of flat dwellers will be sleeping uneasily tonight.

 

[Orang Utan]

OMG, is that image on the BBC News now really live? Half the windows are still blazing!

Looks like it:

 

[binka]

I think I first read about the triangle factory fire about 15 years ago and it has stuck with me since then, thinking of the horror that the victims must have been going through as they realised no one was going to save them. A century later and what's really changed? A total disregard for the lives of poor people from those who could do something about it if they wanted to. Anger doesn't even come close.

 

[DaveCinzano]

[UPDATED]

Crowdfunders currently running:

JustGiving

• Help families of Grenfell Tower (starter: Haley Yearwood) - £332,857
• Help the residents of the burned down Grenfell Tower (Karolina Hanusova) - £247,976
• We're raising money for the families and individuals affected by the Grenfell Tower fire (Family Action) - £55,580
• Help as many people as possible in Grenfell Tower (Anass Bourdaka) - £31,315
• Weʼre raising £5,000 to help those affected by the Grenfell Tower fire (Get West London) - £8,682
• Weʼre raising £10,000 to help the victims of the Grenfell Tower fire (Will Hurst) - £5,167
• Weʼre raising £10,000 to help the families & individuals impacted by the Grenfell Tower fire in London on with urgently required supplies (AMYA UK) - £1,075

GoFundMe

• Grenfell Block Latimer Fire Appeal (Annoor Trust) - £74,902
• West London Tower Fire Victims (Shameela Islam-Zulfiqar) - £61,742
• Grenfell Tower Fire Fund (Eartha Pond) - £20,646
• GrenFell Tower Fire Fund (Charmaine Hayden) - £8,876
• Support Grenfell Tower Fire Victims (Simon Harris) - £5,118

Others

• Grenfell Tower Emergency Relief (Westway Trust) Amazon WishList

There may be - in fact, probably are - others too.

Totted up, and there's already around £854,000 donated across just those twelve crowdfunders.

 

[where to]

two absolute red lines going forward have to be a full public enquiry, and the rehousing of all survivors in the immediate vicinity for as long as they wish to live there.

 

[eoin_k]

This is a really long thread and so someone may have already mentioned it but I was just looking for photos of the building before the fire and it appears as a case study on Construction Enquirer, WITT UK Group (who make smoke control products), Studio E architects, Harley Facades (I know they have been talked about on the thread) and of course Rydon. All of them have taken the relevant pages down except for Rydon. Bunch of fucking cowards

Rydon only put it back up after taking it down initially, possibly, because someone had already uploaded it to internet archive and then called them out for it.

 

[Sparkle Motion]

Guess it won't be done until every combustible thing has gone up. I did wonder at those random hoses spraying ineffectually (note, I know literally nothing about firefighting).

 

[bi0boy]

Totted up, and there's already around £854,000 donated across just those twelve crowdfunders.

How does that work? How to be sure the ones started by individuals will end up being spent on the right stuff? I guess they have complete control of perhaps hundreds of thousands.

 

[1927]

I think I first read about the triangle factory fire about 15 years ago and it has stuck with me since then, thinking of the horror that the victims must have been going through as they realised no one was going to save them. A century later and what's really changed? A total disregard for the lives of poor people from those who could do something about it if they wanted to. Anger doesn't even come close.

I thought of the triangle fire for exactly the same reasons.

 

[Artaxerxes]

two absolute red lines going forward have to be a full public enquiry, and the rehousing of all survivors in the immediate vicinity for as long as they wish to live there.

Literally not enough housing stock to do so, social housing already creaking at the seams

 

[Orang Utan]

How does that work? How to be sure the ones started by individuals will end up being spent on the right stuff? I guess they have complete control of perhaps hundreds of thousands.

Not necessarily. If you have a Just Giving page, you don't get access to the money, it goes directly to a charity you nominate. I don't know what charity would administer such funds though, maybe local ones?

 

[Ax^]

two absolute red lines going forward have to be a full public enquiry, and the rehousing of all survivors in the immediate vicinity for as long as they wish to live there.

a 3rd no fucking ghoulish property enterprise will to repair and refit the block whilst offering apparent social fucking housing which is only affordable to people earning over 50 grand a fucking year

*shakes fist at sky*