Grenfell Tower fire in North Kensington - news and discussion

[Badgers]

I wish I was surprised by the Conservatives inhumanity but I'm not any more.

Post of the year candidate

 

[Rosemary Jest]

They can't help themselves

Blame the Fire Brigade so they can make more cuts, that's their plan.

 

[Pickman's model]

Post of the year candidate

Yes, it's on the shortlist

 

[Chilli.s]

Andrew Bridgen said he would have "given a better decision than the authority figures who gave that advice" does he have any experience in tackling a blaze in a multi story building that has been built without following building regulations or fire safety?

 

[tommers]

Just unbelievable. Both that these are their real thoughts and that they're professional politicians and have said them out loud.

Maybe it helps some people see through them. Maybe.

 

[brogdale]

Last night's 'Newsnight' (from approx 22.30 mins) saw Gavin Barwell put up to field the Rees Moog/Grenfell stuff; very revealing response when Croydon Central Labour MP Sarah Jones asked him about the reported 21 letters that he had received (& ignored) about the Lakanal House fire.

His response appeared to reveal the lame, technical defence that he's already prepared for when the Grenfell II report exposes his responsibility. He'll claim that no-one explicitly informed him that non-compliant materials classified as compliant had been used on high rise buildings.

What an odious little man.

 

[Badgers]

 

[not-bono-ever]

Just unbelievable. Both that these are their real thoughts and that they're professional politicians and have said them out loud.

Maybe it helps some people see through them. Maybe.

It’s dog whistle. These fuckers know exactly why Grenfell victims are fair game for them to point the finger

 

[krtek a houby]

I don't advocate violence but I would be in favor of an effigy of JRM being lit on Bonfire Night. The cunt.

 

[marty21]

It is unsurprising. Absolutely unsurprising. However, the reason that this twat has sunk to a new low is because everyone who has ever lived in a tower block, particularly near the top, can understand how the stairwell/firedoor configuration would make it EASY to believe that the advice of 'don't go into the stairwell, stay put' would make perfect sense. This twat, however, has probably never even set foot inside a tower block and STILL BELIEVES THAT HE KNOWS BETTER. *head explodes*

Yep, there was a fire in a Camden Block (with cladding) in 2012 , the fire was limited to the flat, the Fire Brigade was correct in their advice - it wasn't to know that K&C and the TM0 that managed Grenfell had fucked the building with their cladding.

The Camden block is Taplow and was one of the blocks evacuated by Camden in the wake of the Grenfell fire.

 

[Badgers]

Disgraced Lord President of the Council and Leader of the House of Commons Jacob Rees Mogg has made the Washington Post

https://www.washingtonpost.com/worl...wmaker-just-implied-they-lacked-common-sense/

LONDON — Conservative British lawmaker Jacob Rees-Mogg apologized on Tuesday after making comments many deemed insensitive about the Grenfell Tower blaze that killed 72 people in June 2017.

Talking to radio show LBC on Monday about the newly published report into the fire, the deadliest in modern British history, Rees-Mogg appeared to suggest the victims should have used “common sense” and ignored the instructions of the London Fire Brigade to stay in their homes as the 24-story building went up in flames.

 

[polly]

It’s dog whistle. These fuckers know exactly why Grenfell victims are fair game for them to point the finger

Yeah, sadly I have to agree. I've seen some shockingly nasty, racist shit on social media today and yesterday about Grenfell victims. That's what these cunts' dog whistles deliver and they know it.

 

[teuchter]

He'll claim that no-one explicitly informed him that non-compliant materials classified as compliant had been used on high rise buildings.

It's not quite as simple as that, because the argument is about whether or not they were "classified as compliant" (it comes down to an interpretation of what the Approved Documents require).

What he says in the interview is "at no point did anybody in british politics think there were things on buildings that didn't comply with the existing regulations".

Even if that were true, it sidesteps the fact that problems with interpretation of the Approved Documents absolutely had been raised, especially since the Lakanal fire and they had not been addressed. His statement is very dishonest.

There is quite a good explanation of the complicated situation with building regs here:

The Paper Trail: the Failure of Building Regulations

 

[Wilf]

Can you imagine the furore if Corbyn said Lee Rigby should have made 'better decisions' the kind of decisions that a public school education would have equipped with?

Mind it doesn't always work. For example Lord Mountbatten studied Latin, Greek and Checking Your Boat for Semtex...

 

[mauvais]

Yep, there was a fire in a Camden Block (with cladding) in 2012 , the fire was limited to the flat, the Fire Brigade was correct in their advice - it wasn't to know that K&C and the TM0 that managed Grenfell had fucked the building with their cladding.

The Camden block is Taplow and was one of the blocks evacuated by Camden in the wake of the Grenfell fire.

Similarly there was one in Shirley Towers, Southampton in 2010 - it's very well documented not least because two firefighters died. That had a stay put policy that worked well. The stairwells and corridors filled with smoke and would not have been passable once the incident was underway.

 

[ElizabethofYork]

 

[maomao]

The worst thing is that while they might have had a better chance running, people did die on the stairs doing just that. I would have run because what happened at Larkanal scared me shitless but it's a policy that's saved lives in the past.

 

[Artaxerxes]

The worst thing is that while they might have had a better chance running, people did die on the stairs doing just that. I would have run because what happened at Larkanal scared me shitless but it's a policy that's saved lives in the past.

Just from a sheer "I don't want to get n the way" perspective I'd have probably stayed put, even if absolutely bricking it. But especially if the fire brigade were going around in full kit saying don't move.

 

[ElizabethofYork]

So JRM is basically telling people to ignore instructions from emergency service personnel.

 

[existentialist]

So JRM is basically telling people to ignore instructions from emergency service personnel.

Yes. So that, next time around, when dozens of people are heaped at the bottom of a stairwell, dying of crush injuries and smoke inhalation, he can say "Well, you see, if these stupid people with no common sense can't obey simple instructions from the professionals on the scene, what are we supposed to do?".

Man's a cunt. But I suspect the Tory party know that, and have wheeled him out deliberately to boost the Cunt Tory vote, a significant part of the demographic.

 

[Lord Camomile]

I remember hearing about a ferry that sank, and bodies were found by the muster point, and thinking "that would have been me". Because in an emergency you trust the emergency procedures.

 

[brogdale]

Yes. So that, next time around, when dozens of people are heaped at the bottom of a stairwell, dying of crush injuries and smoke inhalation, he can say "Well, you see, if these stupid people with no common sense can't obey simple instructions from the professionals on the scene, what are we supposed to do?".

Man's a cunt. But I suspect the Tory party know that, and have wheeled him out deliberately to boost the Cunt Tory vote, a significant part of the demographic.

He's there for one reason only; to say that Johnson's (May) WAB "is Brexit" and neutralise the intra-party factional threat from the nut-job faction and Farage's noise off. They don't care that he's a cunt; they all are.

 

[Badgers]

So JRM is basically telling people to ignore instructions from emergency service personnel.

Zero chance of a resignation

 

[Pickman's model]

I remember hearing about a ferry that sank, and bodies were found by the muster point, and thinking "that would have been me". Because in an emergency you trust the emergency procedures.

yeh but sadly it wasn't jrm

 

[Lord Camomile]

Yes. So that, next time around, when dozens of people are heaped at the bottom of a stairwell, dying of crush injuries and smoke inhalation, he can say "Well, you see, if these stupid people with no common sense can't obey simple instructions from the professionals on the scene, what are we supposed to do?".

I do wish the follow up had been "do you understand why that was the advice given?". Maybe it was and I just haven't seen that reported; I'm not exactly trying to find out a lot of detail about the odious toad.

 

[not-bono-ever]

That cunt mogg has never seen the inside of a block of flats in his life I warrant.

 

[Pickman's model]

That cunt mogg has never seen the inside of a block of flats in his life I warrant.

hopefully he'll see one in the minutes before he shuffles off this mortal coil, as he climbs the stairs in the trellick tower before taking the swift way to the ground floor.

 

[brogdale]

hopefully he'll see one in the minutes before he shuffles off this mortal coil, as he climbs the stairs in the trellick tower before taking the swift way to the ground floor.

That'll be the full scale, Southern hemispheric replica of Trellick that he and his pals have previously built on the South Sandwich islands?

 

[Plumdaff]

They don't seem to get that much of the reason for anger is that the stay put policy should have kept people safe but did not, not because of the residents or fire service, but because of criminal behaviour of contractors and the council in the context of 40 years of housing being about profit, not people and their safety.

 

[Pickman's model]

That'll be the full scale, Southern hemispheric replica of Trellick that he and his pals have previously built on the South Sandwich islands?

Haven't decided yet