Feminism- experiences of man-whispering and the refusal to do so...

[Saul Goodman]

I was raised on female violence, from my mother among others, and I know among my peers I wasn't alone. I'm not talking about some formal "a smacked bottom", I'm talking about daily, casual lashing out at heads and faces for countless tiny infractions. My mother was way, way more likely to hit me than my father (who actually cried the one time he smacked me).

Anyway I think female violence towards adults is considerably less common than female violence towards kids. I still witness that in eg supermarkets with alarming frequency.

Off topic, but a response to the immediate subtopic above. Genuinely nervous to post on this thread tbh.

My mother broke one of those proper strong old wooden coat hangers across my head, and I needed 12 stitches in my head. I was 6 years old. At the hospital I was told I had to say I fell.
I've faced far more violence from women in my life than I have from men.

 

[Manter]

What never ceases to stagger me is male assumptions that they are entitled to a woman’s time and attention.

I settled down in a cafe today with a huge document to review. Coffee, headphones, seat out of everyone’s way. I was there about an hour and a half and in that time I was interrupted four times by three different men. One asked to borrow the pen I was writing with (!)- twice. Another tapped my arm when I didn’t respond. The final one got properly sworn at, and then *he* got all offended.

Why? Why are so many men like this?

 

[mango5]

I got a 'hey baby' from 2 different men this morning when I popped out for milk. I didn't challenge either of them as I didn't want to deal any backlash, and I thought it was likely

 

[kabbes]

I got a 'hey baby' from 2 different men this morning when I popped out for milk. I didn't challenge either of them as I didn't want to deal any backlash, and I thought it was likely

For the avoidance of doubt — you’re not actually at an age that is still appropriate to measure in months, right?

 

[mango5]

I was dressed like a toddler in a bright pink t-shirt and baggy orange trousers but clearly not on my way to school.

 

[Baronage-Phase]

Went out for a drink and meal with some colleagues yesterday..it was 4 o clock. Into a bar for food and I went to get drinks at the bar. A glass of Heineken, 2 diet cokes, one regular coke, a pint of miwadi, and a sparkling water.
A guy sitting at the bar went "Oh are you the designated driver?".
I looked puzzled. "The big glass of miwadi". ....ha ha.. big laugh.
So I said "there's only one person drinking ". And he still went on about miwadi.

I left with the drinks and he was still making a feck of the miwadi and me.

Ah well.

 

[Poot]

Went out for a drink and meal with some colleagues yesterday..it was 4 o clock. Into a bar for food and I went to get 5 drinks at the bar. A glass of Heineken, 2 diet cokes, one regular coke, a pint of miwadi, and a sparkling water.
A guy sitting at the bar went "Oh are you the designated driver?".
I looked puzzled. "The big glass of miwadi". ....ha ha.. big laugh.
So I said "there's only one person drinking ". And he still went on about miwadi.

I left with the drinks and he was still making a feck of the miwadi and me.

Ah well.

I had to look up miwadi. (either we don't have it or as I suspect my knowledge of soft drinks in a pub could do with some work). But yeah, I don't think a man would take the piss out of another man for not drinking, at least if they didn't know each other.

Yesterday in the street I walked past the man who tried to kill my friend with a screwdriver in front of their children. I nodded and smiled because I couldn't be bothered to have the 'why are you blanking me' conversation. Or worse. Then I spent all evening hating myself.

 

[chilango]

What never ceases to stagger me is male assumptions that they are entitled to a woman’s time and attention.

I settled down in a cafe today with a huge document to review. Coffee, headphones, seat out of everyone’s way. I was there about an hour and a half and in that time I was interrupted four times by three different men. One asked to borrow the pen I was writing with (!)- twice. Another tapped my arm when I didn’t respond. The final one got properly sworn at, and then *he* got all offended.

Why? Why are so many men like this?

Nobody ever speaks to me in cafes.

I even, accidentally, sat in one of those new fangled "chatty corners" a while back and was completely ignored.

When I spent a lot of time in cafes with my baby I was desperate for someone to speak to me, to say hello or smile, just to break the loneliness and isolation. But the gangs of mums in every cafe just blanked me.

 

[mango5]

Then I spent all evening hating myself.

This is the corrosive part. Beating ourselves up because we saved mental and physical energy by having to act with fake pleasantness and unassertiveness. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

 

[killer b]

I don't think a man would take the piss out of another man for not drinking, at least if they didn't know each other.

afraid this isn't true fwiw.

 

[Steel Icarus]

Yep. Even with your mates.

 

[Poot]

I know it happens with mates. But from a random sitting at the bar? I mean, it's a dick move whoever you are, obviously.

 

[killer b]

Yeah, randoms sitting at the bar too. Just randoms sitting at the bar these days actually, my mates don't bother anymore.

 

[Baronage-Phase]

I remember a friend of my ex saying he didnt trust anyone who didnt drink alcohol before he knew I couldnt drink. Then I told him I didnt drink for medical reasons. Red face... lol.

 

[Baronage-Phase]

I did start to drink just to feel accepted. It was stupid.
and fucking dangerous considering I already had liver disease.

 

[SheilaNaGig]

Last night I refused to man whisper. I now have cuts on one hand and bruises along the opposite arm. Three hour's sleep. Exhausted.

I rose up. I spoke up. I answered back. I spoke my mind.

I regret it all.

 

[Pickman's model]

Last night I refused to man whisper. I now have cuts on one hand and bruises along the opposite arm. Three hour's sleep. Exhausted.

I rose up. I spoke up. I answered back. I spoke my mind.

I regret it all.

(((SheilaNaGig)))

 

[ElizabethofYork]

Oh SheilaNaGig xxx

 

[Edie]

I had to look up miwadi. (either we don't have it or as I suspect my knowledge of soft drinks in a pub could do with some work). But yeah, I don't think a man would take the piss out of another man for not drinking, at least if they didn't know each other.

Yesterday in the street I walked past the man who tried to kill my friend with a screwdriver in front of their children. I nodded and smiled because I couldn't be bothered to have the 'why are you blanking me' conversation. Or worse. Then I spent all evening hating myself.

Bastard.

One of the most depressing things after my ex punched my 13yo son up so badly we had to go to hospital and have police photos done was the number of friends (read: almost everyone) who pretended it hadn’t happened and still went drinking with him.

Like there could be two sides to that story.

Fuck the patriarchy.

 

[Edie]

Last night I refused to man whisper. I now have cuts on one hand and bruises along the opposite arm. Three hour's sleep. Exhausted.

I rose up. I spoke up. I answered back. I spoke my mind.

I regret it all.

Shit sorry just seen this. Sending love <3

And still, fuck the patriarchy.

 

[Treacle Toes]

Last night I refused to man whisper. I now have cuts on one hand and bruises along the opposite arm. Three hour's sleep. Exhausted.

I rose up. I spoke up. I answered back. I spoke my mind.

I regret it all.

That's assault. ABH

Fucking abusive mateyprickcunt.

 

[Clair De Lune]

Shit SheilaNaGig that's horrendous. Was this someone you know?

 

[kebabking]

Went out for a drink and meal with some colleagues yesterday..it was 4 o clock. Into a bar for food and I went to get 5 drinks at the bar. A glass of Heineken, 2 diet cokes, one regular coke, a pint of miwadi, and a sparkling water.
A guy sitting at the bar went "Oh are you the designated driver?".
I looked puzzled. "The big glass of miwadi". ....ha ha.. big laugh.
So I said "there's only one person drinking ". And he still went on about miwadi.

I left with the drinks and he was still making a feck of the miwadi and me.

Ah well.

Me and Mrs K went to a bar a couple of weeks ago, I ordered (while Mrs K was looking for a table) a pint of lager and a pint of lemonade. Mrs K stood next to me as the young lad behind the bar poured the drinks - he did the lager first and put it in front of me, I moved it in front of Mrs K, and when the lemonade was finished he, despite the lager being very conspicuously in Mrs K's hand, put the lemonade in front of her with a completely mystified look on his face - he was (silently) asking why she was drinking my lager.

What a twat. The patriarchy bit is, I suppose, that I was irritated, but also amused, whereas Mrs K was just irritated.

 

[Baronage-Phase]

Last night I refused to man whisper. I now have cuts on one hand and bruises along the opposite arm. Three hour's sleep. Exhausted.

I rose up. I spoke up. I answered back. I spoke my mind.

I regret it all.

Shit that's awful (((SheilaNaGig )))

 

[campanula]

My partner has been unable to do landscaping work (we usually work together) but is also not allowed to claim any sort of benefits because we own a little woodland...even though he has ongoing health issues. So we are flat broke. I advertised my horticultural services with the intention of going back to solo jobbing gardening, especially if I can do consultation work. This week, I have been working every day and going out to look at jobs in the evening. Partner has done nothing. Not washed the dishes, not cooked, shopped, cleaned. He has sulked though. After working all morning, I announced I was off to the allotment - I haven't been for a week. he glanced up and said, in outraged astonushment ' but it's nearly 5 oclock'.
'So'
'but what about dinner'
'what about it'
well, are you not going to shop for it and cook it.
'No'
cue massive sulking that 'we never discussed you going back to work (a lie)
'You never said you were going to work all week' I had already said I was just setting up work and was a bit overwhelmed. Not a jot of support...just whining. And I know he is feeling a bit emasculated...but he could go and look for a bloody job, even part-time. The thing is, I dare not mention the fact that he has done nothing at all, has taken up no slack in the house, garden or anywhere else and has been even obstructive about the work I am doing FOR BOTH OF US.
Yet I absolute guarantee that if he was working, it would be 'hail the conquering hero, dinner on the table etc etc.
This is man-whispering - his ego is both fragile yet demanding and I have to actually step around his sulking, do nothing, without even daring to ask what about washing the fucking dishes. I don't bloody well want to work every day either. I have no time to do my own garden or allotment, he has not shown a shred of interest in my work, has offered no help or support yet he is still the wounded abandoned victim. yet I have to carry on as though I had all the time in the world, somehow earning money while being in denial that I am...
This is all wrong

 

[Manter]

Nobody ever speaks to me in cafes.

I even, accidentally, sat in one of those new fangled "chatty corners" a while back and was completely ignored.

When I spent a lot of time in cafes with my baby I was desperate for someone to speak to me, to say hello or smile, just to break the loneliness and isolation. But the gangs of mums in every cafe just blanked me.

Well send me your phone number as I seem to attract people desperate to chat

 

[polly]

Fucking hell SheilaNaGig I hope you're safe.

Yesterday in the street I walked past the man who tried to kill my friend with a screwdriver in front of their children. I nodded and smiled because I couldn't be bothered to have the 'why are you blanking me' conversation. Or worse. Then I spent all evening hating myself.

I can relate to this. I've got a few friends in abusive relationships, one of whom was raped last year by her husband. She got pregnant and really wanted to keep it but he forced her to get an abortion. Every time I go round there and he's there I have to make nice, because if I don't it puts her in danger. But I still feel like a cunt.

(I remember the story with your friend - I really really really hope she got away.)

 

[ElizabethofYork]

Fucking hell SheilaNaGig I hope you're safe.



I can relate to this. I've got a few friends in abusive relationships, one of whom was raped last year by her husband. She got pregnant and really wanted to keep it but he forced her to get an abortion. Every time I go round there and he's there I have to make nice, because if I don't it puts her in danger. But I still feel like a cunt.

(I remember the story with your friend - I really really really hope she got away.)

Oh God. Oh God.

 

[kalidarkone]

I have a friend that despite having left an abusive marriage is still regularly stalked, car keyed etc .....anyway the husband is dead to me .....as soon as I found out what had been going on and is still occurring. What I find really difficult are the 'on the fence friends' not wanting to take sides and by doing so not having our friends back and supporting that abusive behaviour.

However I agree that in a situation where the abused partner is still living with the perpetrator one has to be very cautious.

 

[JudithB]

If I have missed a post with within this thread, I do apologise. I cannot find it now to link to but that is probably because I am spectacularly rubbish at searching on twitter, please look up the thread by @JaneGodley. Very sweary Scottish comedian who started a thread about how charming the man was who murdered her mother and threw her body in the river.

This charming man...