I see more laughing people who seem to be having a good time, rather than upset and angry. Weird that.
Far-right response to Southport Outrage And Ongoing Violent Disorder
- Thread starter Agrippa57
- Start date
I see more laughing people who seem to be having a good time, rather than upset and angry. Weird that.
ddraig
kicking against the pricks...
from the BBC live reporting! Imagine if that was the left?!? and where were the statue protectors!!
PM to meet police as Southport protests spread, with more than 100 arrests in London
PM to meet police as Southport protests spread, with more than 100 arrests in London
ska invita
back on the other side
what role exactly are you suggesting the security services have played here?
klang
klang
Opportunism in policing and politics is nothing new
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Which part?
SpookyFrank
A cheap source of teeth for aquarium gravel
Rob Ray
Weight is meaningless
The 2024/25 police funding cycle was agreed in December and the incoming government's not said anything about the Inquiry that might raise hackles, so even if minded to look for spycops in the walls there's not much reason for them to be doing that sort of thing.
Artaxerxes
Look out, he's got a gnu!
The rioters aren’t socialists or women
It doesn't, thats another issue that needs addressing.
But I dont believe that the Tory government, Farage, etc has created the racism, its merely legitimised their voices. Hence my belief that racism needs to be tackled at its root.
Skinny Ethel
Well-Known Member
Not created but stirred it and cheerleaded it with a huge spoon and their backers have put a huge amount of money behind it.
klang
klang
By sending people on holidays?
LakieLady
Well-Known Member
My brother and I were brought up pretty much the same by our socially enlightened, Guardian-reading, Labour voting, lefty parents. I've been a Labour party member and activist since I was 16, apart from a few years where I didn't renew my membership because of Bomber Blair. I marched against the National Front in the 70s and have always despised the racist right.
My brother had a bit of a flirtation with the far-right in his teens, when he was a skinhead, and, despite having had black friends when he was younger, is really very racist and almost certainly voted for Farage (he lives in Jaywick). Our parents would be turning in their graves if they hadn't been cremated.
Our parents were comfortably off during the latter part of my childhood, we wanted for nothing, there was no neglect, addiction, abuse or other social issues in the family. The main difference in our upbringing was education. I passed the 11+ and went to a single sex grammar school. The 11+ was abolished soon after, so brother went to the local comp. I formed friendships with people who came from very different backgrounds, all his mates were from the same massive council estate where we lived.
Whether that is enough to account for him being a fash or not, I have no idea.
BigMoaner
What A Load of Old Bollocks
i think
agree there is a kind of surrealness to most things when it comes to politics, social issues. can't really put my finger on it, a breakdown in a sense of a shared reality? so it just feels, a feeling, that my political "enemies" or opponanants have never quite been so "othered" and seperate from me and out of any sort of possibility of reach. i don't want to beat up too much on social media because it does have positives, but before social media i just got the sense that we were both on the "same page" roughly reality wise, despite having differences in political outlooks. i might even hate you for your views, but there was a sense of living in the same sort of space and time. now - i am in my bubble (urban, etc), and you are in yours and i don't quite now how to build bridges. infact what i see of you online makes me hate you even more.
i just think we are living through the tech revolution and we are all still adjusting and trying to find a way. maybe its what the "accelerationists" talk about - we are just all slowly burning ourselves out before somethign truly new finally arrives.
agree there is a kind of surrealness to most things when it comes to politics, social issues. can't really put my finger on it, a breakdown in a sense of a shared reality? so it just feels, a feeling, that my political "enemies" or opponanants have never quite been so "othered" and seperate from me and out of any sort of possibility of reach. i don't want to beat up too much on social media because it does have positives, but before social media i just got the sense that we were both on the "same page" roughly reality wise, despite having differences in political outlooks. i might even hate you for your views, but there was a sense of living in the same sort of space and time. now - i am in my bubble (urban, etc), and you are in yours and i don't quite now how to build bridges. infact what i see of you online makes me hate you even more.
i just think we are living through the tech revolution and we are all still adjusting and trying to find a way. maybe its what the "accelerationists" talk about - we are just all slowly burning ourselves out before somethign truly new finally arrives.
I wasnt suggesting a holiday. I was suggesting a homestay.
There be no British pubs, newspapers, or expat communities in your homestay. You gotta live amongst the people, living as they do, you even gotta start talking their language.
The point was, by having intimate, first hand, experience with other cultures you learn the difference between what is said and how things actually are. You even make friends, and this too improves outlooks.
Whether it would work is another question, it was a random musing. Having lived in another culture away from much trace of the anglosphere, its not just a rewarding experience its an educating one too.
Slightly different point but related, but for the same reasons I think we should encourage student homestays and study abroad schemes more.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
If as you've suggested this occurred during an mh crisis then tbh it already has a wider political significance given the years of austerity and nhs cuts which may have affected the mh of the culprit, whether they were able to access mh services, if they were available etc. It may not have the political significance you refer to, it may not have come from islamist radicalisation, but that's been added on by certain people and groups and can't be ignored as a motivating factor is these assemblies and subsequent disorder. They may be wrong to add it but it seems to have taken on a life of its own and you won't shove thar genie back in the bottle
andysays
Love and solidarity
I don't think posters here are denying that many people are genuinely angry with many things that are going on in Britain today.
But those whose anger at the current state of the nation can be so quickly directed by the far right in the wake of the tragedy in Southport into violent "revenge" attacks on a mosque or demonstrations outside Downing Street are pretty much a lost cause to us now.
There may be some value in discussing how we can prevent the far right turning even more people's genuine and legitimate anger into actions of racist hate, but we also need to call out the boneheads who take part in these actions for what they are. There is no way their expressions of anger are in any way genuine or legitimate.
Whilst I dont agree with grammar schools, I agree with your sentiments. A lot of it comes down to education and having incoming racist views challenged. As you point out, those racist views can come from either family, or friends. But I think thats where it begins.
That twunt Katherine Birbalsingh is mouthing off now and going on about how Southport is a reason why multiculturalism has failed and how the protests in London aren't far right, which is a bit much considering how many of her pupils are black or Asian. I vaguely know Southport but isn't it mainly white? And when she gets called on it, she just doubles down.
Like she'd ever have the guts to go to Southport and talk to the mothers of the victims. None of them would.
Like she'd ever have the guts to go to Southport and talk to the mothers of the victims. None of them would.
Or black/Asian.
not a trot
Well-Known Member
White working class.
Serge Forward
Just enjoyin' my coffee.
Lumpen elements.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
That's a really good post.
I feel like it's a dual life. There is the real world - work, family, mates, football, pub, getting the bus - where people do have different views but we can talk about them and we find some common ground. Then there is also the world of social media which, and this might be my age, I find atomising, anomic, fucked up and where political (but also wider social, cultural and economic issues) discussions are utterly toxic. Difference is emphasised and weaponised everywhere by everyone. The saturation by competing identity groups and the way the algorithms feed back to you your views only is genuinely disturbing.
While I think (hope) most people can tell the difference, the concern is a) how many people increasingly or even exclusively inhabit the latter and are cut off from the other world and b) the retreat of political engagement and activity out of the real world and into the social media hellscape.
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
Likely to be a chunk of petty bourgeois isn't there, if we're going down that line.
klang
klang
I think it's more important to experience And feel comfortable in one's own culture, and to accept and appreciate its cultural diversity and history for all it has to offer, and to come to terms with and accept history, wherever one is.
klang
klang
And to realise that divisive politics is nothing more than class politics.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
The people rioting are maybe 2,000-odd in total across the country, if that? They are white supremacist fash. They are total scum, and I don't care what hardships they may or may not have faced in their lives. Not interested.
They do not represent or reflect wider issues in society, not really, except perhaps in the fact that they clearly feel emboldened right now to take to the streets. They don't represent legitimate grievances or anger. That's not to say that legitimate grievances and anger don't exist, merely that these people don't represent it. They are antisocial scumbags against whom the rest of us should be able to unite regardless of our own particular grievances.
I think a bit of clarity on this point is needed.
They do not represent or reflect wider issues in society, not really, except perhaps in the fact that they clearly feel emboldened right now to take to the streets. They don't represent legitimate grievances or anger. That's not to say that legitimate grievances and anger don't exist, merely that these people don't represent it. They are antisocial scumbags against whom the rest of us should be able to unite regardless of our own particular grievances.
I think a bit of clarity on this point is needed.
cesare
shady's dreams ♥
Other types of politics can be divisive too. Eg identity politics such as Trump's brand of evangelical white Christian nationalism.
klang
klang
Titally. Was sloppy
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