editor
hiraethified
I'd be surprised if players who have reached the standard of their national team are going to 'intimidated' by a load of boo boys.
England fans: the racism and the violence
- Thread starter editor
- Start date
andysays
Love and solidarity
RedRedRose
Well-Known Member
The bigger question is, which countries?
tommers
Busta Rhymes is an unstoppable movement
Why are home records consistently better than away? Except for last season, which coincidentally happened to be the only season when supporters weren't allowed in the grounds?
The39thStep
Urban critical thinker
"The UK Football Policing Unit received 600 reports of racist comments sent to England's black players after the defeat and judged 207 to be criminal" Fair play to those who made the 600 complaints.
andysays
Love and solidarity
I'm sure plenty were - wouldn't want to downplay that aspect, but I still find it surprising that more than half appear to be from overseas.
ElizabethofYork
Old Crone
"The Premier League's data from their monitoring of abuse against players has shown that around 70% of cases involve abuse coming from social media users outside of the United Kingdom, a league source told Reuters on Tuesday".
"The abuse is global, with accounts from Indonesia to Argentina levelling racism and homophobia at players. The biggest number of discriminatory posts appeared in French and Spanish, followed by English," the report found.
www.reuters.com
"The abuse is global, with accounts from Indonesia to Argentina levelling racism and homophobia at players. The biggest number of discriminatory posts appeared in French and Spanish, followed by English," the report found.
English football faces up to global nature of online hate
The online racial abuse of English footballers led UK Prime Minister Boris Johnson to meet with social media companies on Tuesday, but while the focus is on the industry taking action, experts have warned the global nature of the problem makes it difficult to take legal steps against the...
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
Perhaps the title of this thread needs to be changed in light of the evidence that the majority of the racist posting isn't, in fact, from 'England fans'??
editor
hiraethified
Err, because you get to sleep in your own bed the night before, you have almost zero travelling, you're in a familiar place, you know the ground and the pitch inside out. For starters.
ElizabethofYork
Old Crone
An academic study:
Ryan Boyko, a research assistant in the Department of Psychology in the Faculty of Arts and Sciences at Harvard University, studied 5,000 English Premier League games from 1992 to 2006, to discern any officiating bias and the influence of home crowds. The data was published in the Journal of Sports Sciences and suggested that for every additional 10,000 people attending, home team advantage increased by 0.1 goals. Additionally, his study proved what many football fans already suspect: that home teams are likely to be awarded more penalty kicks, but crucially, this is more likely with inexperienced referees. So, consideration of referee profiles should clearly be a refinement for home field advantage statistics.[4]
The stadium or arena will typically be filled with home supporters, who are sometimes described as being as valuable as an extra player for the home team. The home fans can sometimes create a psychological lift by cheering loudly for their team when good things happen in the game. The home crowd can also intimidate visiting players by booing, whistling, or heckling.
Ryan Boyko, a research assistant in the Department of Psychology in the Faculty of Arts and Sciences at Harvard University, studied 5,000 English Premier League games from 1992 to 2006, to discern any officiating bias and the influence of home crowds. The data was published in the Journal of Sports Sciences and suggested that for every additional 10,000 people attending, home team advantage increased by 0.1 goals. Additionally, his study proved what many football fans already suspect: that home teams are likely to be awarded more penalty kicks, but crucially, this is more likely with inexperienced referees. So, consideration of referee profiles should clearly be a refinement for home field advantage statistics.[4]
The stadium or arena will typically be filled with home supporters, who are sometimes described as being as valuable as an extra player for the home team. The home fans can sometimes create a psychological lift by cheering loudly for their team when good things happen in the game. The home crowd can also intimidate visiting players by booing, whistling, or heckling.
Steel Icarus
we move
I'm not technologically minded but so many of these racist comments - could VPNs be a factor? Some dickhead posting from Clacton but it showing up as having been posted from Manila?
Steel Icarus
we move
I see likes and appreciative comments absent from certain posters on the positives around this story and the rallying round our young black footballers from so many fans
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
There's a whole load of different things going on here isn't there, which interlink with society in general in England and in the wider sense, as well as the particular thing of being an 'England Fan'. Which can mean active fans going to games but in a tournament context often doesn't mean much more than 'English people watching on TV. And there's no doubt that by either mark there's some pretty toxic behaviours by people who fall under that umbrella. I think the point though is that this is a contested space. There's been so much positive stuff as well around the team this tournament - from the behaviour of the team itself and the manager, through to the drowning out of the booing of taking the knee, and on to the huge amount of support given to the players afterwards. And then there's wider stuff like FLAF etc. There are loads of 'England fans' taking action in various ways to combat this stuff, which might be from posting positively online right through to active physical confrontation.
Given that the England team, fans, whatever aren't going anywhere the issue has to be to win that contest for that space. And it seems obvious to me that the gleeful 'look how awful England fans are' stuff is on the wrong side of this. It's all about trying to associate everyone with the negatives 'you should be ashamed, back away from that space, etc' And what's that going to achieve?
Given that the England team, fans, whatever aren't going anywhere the issue has to be to win that contest for that space. And it seems obvious to me that the gleeful 'look how awful England fans are' stuff is on the wrong side of this. It's all about trying to associate everyone with the negatives 'you should be ashamed, back away from that space, etc' And what's that going to achieve?
strung out
💩 🤣 🍆 💦 🧐 👻 🐝 🐈⬛
Maybe those Welsh footballers who were racially abused were victims of Cardiff fans using VPNs too.
The simplest answer is probably the correct one though - the rest of the world has a huge problem with racism against black people and homophobia, and England as the most popular footballing league/nation in the world acts as a vector for that racism and homophobia. That's not to say that some doesn't come from our own home grown racists and homophobes of course, but I don't think we need to start adding overseas racists into our own numbers.
Steel Icarus
we move
Yossarian
⏭️
"England fans" and "Premier League fans" aren't synonymous - and the study cited by Reuters wasn't only looking at Premier League teams.
planetgeli
There's no future in England's dreaming
Nah this is rubbish. All Premier League teams sleep in a hotel, home or away, the night before a game. Man City sometimes sleep in their training ground.
If you don't think 40,000 people booing your every move affects you, you're away with the fairies.
editor
hiraethified
Good job I never made that claim, then.
ElizabethofYork
Old Crone
That's what you said.
editor
hiraethified
Yes. And you linked to research about the Premier League. I was responding to the claims about booing national anthems at internationals.
Smokeandsteam
Working Class First
Which, of course, is what this thread was set up to do. As you say it's politically useless and merely drives wedges between people. It's a form of inverted exceptionalism that has become particular bitter and twisted since 2016.
Pickman's model
Starry Wisdom
yeh on match day i used to see the arsenal coach heading towards the emirates up new north road. which is strange since wenger and quite a few of the players lived up round totteridge, miles away to the north.
Buddy Bradley
Pantheistic solipsist
Ax^
Silly Rabbit
aye it the English fans who are the victim in all of this not the footballers receiving the abuse
Steel Icarus
we move
Irony: thread about football includes outrageous shifting of goalposts
Steel Icarus
we move
keybored
Well done. You remember cat good.
Possibly, although to anyone analysing the data it should be obvious which accounts are using VPNs as VPN providers tend to use the kind of ISPs that don't sell consumer connections.
Otherwise we might as well surmise that many of the abusive posts from UK IP addresses were overseas trolls using VPNs that terminate in the UK.
tommers
Busta Rhymes is an unstoppable movement
In the three seasons previous to the last one teams in the PL averaged about 0.4 - 0.5 extra points from every home game, compared to their away games.
In 20/21 PL teams got an average of 0.068 less points per game in home games than in away games (i.e. it was pretty much even).
And the difference between those seasons wasn't "not travelling" or "sleeping in a different bed". Supporters affect the performances of teams.
Premier League - home and away tables - historical 2018
Home and away tables in Premier League and relative home/away performance overview for each team.
www.soccerstats.com
