England Cricket 2022
- Thread starter RileyOBlimey
- Start date
planetgeli
There's no future in England's dreaming
PSL. But yes.
surreybrowncap
“Those who believe in telekinetics, raise my hand"
Corrected in the scorebook : Van Damme
Stokes was indeed defending a couple of gay guys that had been singled out by a group of drunk hard cases. They backed him up later, saying they don’t know what would have happened to them if Stokes hadn’t intervened. Furthermore, Stokes only hit out when one of the aggressors started lashing out with a glass bottle.
This all ended up with Stokes being charged for affray and being found not guilty by a jury. It’s pretty low to still be trying to hang him for it. He was exonerated by the evidence in a court of law.
This all ended up with Stokes being charged for affray and being found not guilty by a jury. It’s pretty low to still be trying to hang him for it. He was exonerated by the evidence in a court of law.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
There’s a fair bit of scepticism regarding the ‘gay guys’ account. If it were true why didn’t they give that evidence at the trial. Weird that they only materialised much later. And in the video nobody is attacking him with a bottle. Stokes goes back to hit the bloke when he’s trying to retreat. That’s assault. He got lucky, imo.
Not how the jury saw it
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
As I say, he got lucky. Famous sportsman v two scrotes. It happens. The first witness on the scene was an off duty copper who testified that the bloke he hit was trying to get away when Stokes knocked him out. That’s also what the video showed. That alone is assault, regardless of what kicked it off. The period of supposed self defence was well over by the time of that punch, if it ever existed at all.
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Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Other than the 3 beers, 5 vodkas, and a couple of Jagerbombs. Nobody has suggested there was no provocation. The issue is the level of violence and duration of the response.
Yes. He remarkably calmy knocked out a bloke who was backing away.
It's also worth remembering that they were charged with affray, not assault. An element of affray is that other people must fear that they're endangered by the fight. It's understandable that a jury could have considered this unproven.
The CPS fucked-up here. Both Hales (who stuck the boot into a bloke who was lying on the ground), and Stokes should've been charged with assault, which is what they both clearly carried out. The CPS did try to change the charge to assault at the last minute but the judge threw it out on the basis that it was too late and his lawyers had already prepared an affray defence.
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WhyLikeThis
Something, something, something
The gay lads went to the media and were on a front page of a red top in the following days.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
I know. But they didn't give that evidence at the trial. That's almost beside the point though. Even if everything Stokes said about them was true, what happened next went way beyond self-defence. You can't bash someone up for calling people names, you can't kick someone who's on the ground, and you can't knock-out someone who's backing away after the threat has ended. That's assault.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
As you say, though, they were defending themselves against a charge of affray. The two lads probably didn't give evidence because the defence team didn't see it as relevant to the defence of the charge. It could even conceivably have made things worse.
I agree with you that if anything they were guilty of assault not affray. The affray charge always looked like an overreach to me. I find it hard to give a shit, though.
WhyLikeThis
Something, something, something
Nothin happened until the bottle came out. Anything sharp can kill. In my martial art we’re taught that if there is a real threat of violence you act first and do not stop until the threat is neutralised. In that light, Stokes acted responsibly and reasonably,
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
What you are taught in martial arts can land you in jail if you're not careful.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
There was no bottle in the hand of the guy that Stokes decked in the video and no bottle in the hand of the bloke Hales kicked when he was on the floor.
Saying "I was taught this in martial arts" isn't going to stack-up well in court.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Snap.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
It would be an aggravating factor. If you are trained in martial arts and go up on an assault charge, keep schtum about your training.
WhyLikeThis
Something, something, something
”I saw a flash of metal and had to act”
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Disagree there though. I'm actually quite pissed-off about it, and I say that as a big former Stokes fan.
Obviously there's the whole role model responsibility thing, kids look up to him, blah blah blah, but beyond that it's just thuggish behaviour that anyone should be held properly accountable for. I think it's important that people consider that he got away with assault, rather than being found not guilty of affray.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
I'm not sure I entirely agree with the law, mind you. The standard of reasonable violence in such a situation is pretty strict. Landing that extra punch or extra kick can get you into trouble, but if someone attacks you, making damn sure they don't get up at the end is pretty sensible.
Regarding martial arts training, your training should stop you from getting into such a situation in the first place. Stokes and Hales were looking for trouble, not trying to defuse it. In that sense, yes, they were fortunate.
Regarding martial arts training, your training should stop you from getting into such a situation in the first place. Stokes and Hales were looking for trouble, not trying to defuse it. In that sense, yes, they were fortunate.
Spymaster
Plastic Paddy
Well that's what should have been tested in court, isn't it. Was the amount of violence used reasonable or not? As it was, the jury considered 'whether or not other people were caused to fear for their safety'.
planetgeli
There's no future in England's dreaming
So Lancs recovered to 73 all out. Which was enough to beat Essex's 59 all out.
4 innings lasted the sum total of 125 overs. These are the 3rd and 4th best teams in the CC.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Looks like a right bunfight for relegation. If Som draw, Warks win, Yorks lose and Kent win (possible, possible, likely, likely), the four will respectively be on 137, 136, 135 and 134 points with one game to go.
Surrey have div 1 sewn up unless something strange happens. Notts are doing their best to keep the div 2 title race alive.
Surrey have div 1 sewn up unless something strange happens. Notts are doing their best to keep the div 2 title race alive.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Oh and a point about the Strauss review that I had missed before. It was a wide-ranging review in which everything was up for grabs. Everything that is except The Hundred, which has to stay the length it is and where it is in the calendar. So it wasn't a wide-ranging review at all. It was a review of how best (least badly) to compromise the rest of the game in order to persevere The Hundred exactly as it is, punching a five-week hole right into the heart of the season.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
So the review is now officially out. A six-team CC division one and two conferences for div 2, one up, one down each season. Some teams are basically never going to play in div 1 ever again. Games down from 14 to 10. Blast reduced from 14 to 10 games. 50-over comp to be played in April.
The Hundred is, of course, untouched. It takes up pretty much the whole of the school holidays.
All this is due to start from 2024. Fuck knows how they'll arrange next season. No promotion from div 2. Or five down, one up. Who knows?
The Hundred is, of course, untouched. It takes up pretty much the whole of the school holidays.
All this is due to start from 2024. Fuck knows how they'll arrange next season. No promotion from div 2. Or five down, one up. Who knows?
Monkeygrinder's Organ
Dodgy geezer swilling vapid lager
Is the Hundred actually working? From their point of view I mean. It will obviously be getting higher viewing figures than other formats because they've put it on free to air TV but is it getting the numbers they need to justify what they're doing with it - presumably the sort of level that the broadcasters will want to continue to show it longer term. Attendances look OK but I don't see a lot of interest in it generally and certainly not much sign it's reaching out to a wider audience.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Attendances are ok, but they're not so different from the Blast.
The Hundred has been brilliant for the women's game. And I don't blame the players involved, men and women, for bigging it up - it's a massive payday for them. Was this the only way to achieve these things, though? Of course not.
They're downgrading the Blast and shrinking the CC in order to protect the Hundred. Millions have been invested and contracts have been signed. It's too big to fail. And fuck everything else.
The Hundred has been brilliant for the women's game. And I don't blame the players involved, men and women, for bigging it up - it's a massive payday for them. Was this the only way to achieve these things, though? Of course not.
They're downgrading the Blast and shrinking the CC in order to protect the Hundred. Millions have been invested and contracts have been signed. It's too big to fail. And fuck everything else.
WhyLikeThis
Something, something, something
I’m a rare proponent of The Hundred but fuck me they’re making it hard.
Yes, a short tournament to compete with the likes of the IPL is no bad thing but disconnecting it from the Blast was a fuck up.
I’d love to see the minor counties duke it out in April for 6 weeks. The top 6 teams from that comp then get included with the 18 first class counties for the Blast.
The top 8 teams from the Blast get to be included in The Hundred at the end of the season.
Playing The Hundred during the school holidays is bollocks too. If you want to get kids into cricket you want to expose those without fans in their family who will take them to a game. The first cricket match I attended was with school. I wasn’t into cricket but there was a choice: go to school or have a day out dossing. Dossing it was and love of cricket was born. Play the Hundred when the schools go back so teachers can do this. Grounds should assign a stand for local schools for free. Free entry will lower the barrier further.
Anyways I shall await for littlebabyjesus to disagree with every point
Yes, a short tournament to compete with the likes of the IPL is no bad thing but disconnecting it from the Blast was a fuck up.
I’d love to see the minor counties duke it out in April for 6 weeks. The top 6 teams from that comp then get included with the 18 first class counties for the Blast.
The top 8 teams from the Blast get to be included in The Hundred at the end of the season.
Playing The Hundred during the school holidays is bollocks too. If you want to get kids into cricket you want to expose those without fans in their family who will take them to a game. The first cricket match I attended was with school. I wasn’t into cricket but there was a choice: go to school or have a day out dossing. Dossing it was and love of cricket was born. Play the Hundred when the schools go back so teachers can do this. Grounds should assign a stand for local schools for free. Free entry will lower the barrier further.
Anyways I shall await for littlebabyjesus to disagree with every point
