Conspiraloon 9/11- 7/7 Truther outed as Holocaust denier

[cesare]

In the same way that, some posters on this thread are "just" associating "911 Truth" with "holocaust denial".

It's ok though. When it's one of their conspiracy theories, "they" must be batshit insane "conspiraloons". When it's one of our conspiracy theories, all possible negative associations and opprobrium now (often erroneously) associated with the term "conspiracy theory" is avoided by pretending that "we" aren't referring to a "conspiracy theory" no matter how much it resembles one.

'Their', 'they' & you with the 'rescues dragons' St George tagline lol

 

[chico enrico]

doubt it .. he was a posh boy from kensington ( and it was north london poly)

haha, yes, Patrick 'Ducky' Harrington in his Herr Flick coat. what a spunk-bubble.

NB: isn't the (modern day) LAF another cover for that Troy Southgate goth nazi lot?

 

[Darios]

'Their', 'they' & you with the 'rescues dragons' St George tagline lol

 

[cesare]

In the same way that, some posters on this thread are "just" associating "911 Truth" with "holocaust denial".

It's ok though. When it's one of their conspiracy theories, "they" must be batshit insane "conspiraloons". When it's one of our conspiracy theories, all possible negative associations and opprobrium now (often erroneously) associated with the term "conspiracy theory" is avoided by pretending that "we" aren't referring to a "conspiracy theory" no matter how much it resembles one.

Blimey. I was sort of joking to make a point just now re your tag-line and criticisms; then I remembered that you were the anti-feminist, hard wired biology 'this is what men do' poster. Then I had a look at some of the rest of your posts. 'Weak' re that logo/swastika thread etc, as another example

 

[cesare]

Bet you log off again now, though. Blagsta picked that up as well, when you were challenged iirc

 

[FridgeMagnet]

In the same way that, some posters on this thread are "just" associating "911 Truth" with "holocaust denial".

It's ok though. When it's one of their conspiracy theories, "they" must be batshit insane "conspiraloons". When it's one of our conspiracy theories, all possible negative associations and opprobrium now (often erroneously) associated with the term "conspiracy theory" is avoided by pretending that "we" aren't referring to a "conspiracy theory" no matter how much it resembles one.

I don't see your point.

(a) While I'm not really involved in the green movement, I've heard a lot of people who are say that there have and are still attempts by the far right to infiltrate it. That isn't a conspiracy theory, it's a statement of fact, and doesn't say anything intrinsic about green politics (people have attempted to claim that but I disagree). There are attempts made by the far right to infiltrate all sorts of things - Israel/Palestine issues, monetary policy etc.

(b) There are certainly a lot of people who boost Troofer-type theories, are also far-right and try to blend in their whole theory about the Jews, usually via accusations of Mossad being involved in every fucking thing ever. This certainly isn't in doubt, just take a look around the net; I've spoken with 9/11/7/7 types who say the same thing, and that it's a disgrace and these people need to be weeded out because they discredit the whole thing (admittedly I think the whole thing discredits the whole thing but that's easier to show once you've kicked out those with ulterior motives).

 

[Mrs Magpie]

Just as a by-the-by thing, mainly for Badger Kitten....an image

 

[cesare]

Bet you log off again now, though. Blagsta picked that up as well, when you were challenged iirc

And Libertarian Alliance. You couldn't make it up.

 

[Darios]

Bet you log off again now, though. Blagsta picked that up as well, when you were challenged iirc

Huh? What, so I'm supposed to respond to your posts instantly and without fail?

And challenged about what precisely?

 

[Blagsta]

Huh? What, so I'm supposed to respond to your posts instantly and without fail?

And challenged about what precisely?

lol

 

[Darios]

I don't see your point.

....That isn't a conspiracy theory, it's a statement of fact

Based on:

I've heard a lot of people who are say that there have and are still attempts by the far right to infiltrate it

You see my point now, yes?

(b) There are certainly a lot of people who boost Troofer-type theories, are also far-right.....[snip]

There are also a lot of people who support some kind of '911 truth' who are nothing like your initial description and who are chasing entirely plausible and valid concerns regarding 9/11, 7/7, whatever etc etc.

 

[frogwoman]

I don't know either way Cesare. I have seen it happen first hand with one particular left-leaning group. I'm "suggesting" that if someone says "x" has happened because of "far-right infiltration into the Green or ecological movement" then that is a conspiracy theory.

It's not a conspiracy theory if it's true though, surely?

sorry ... i haven't read the thread past my last post so i might be saying something completely stupid

 

[frogwoman]

disagree with you on this one mate .. the left get fucked anyway so why not this guy .. i really fucking hate holcaust denial

So do i

 

[Darios]

Blimey. I was sort of joking to make a point just now re your tag-line and criticisms; then I remembered that you were the anti-feminist, hard wired biology 'this is what men do' poster. Then I had a look at some of the rest of your posts. 'Weak' re that logo/swastika thread etc, as another example

I disagree with you and now that makes me an "anti-feminist"?
"Couldn't make it up", etc etc, etc.

You guys are absolutely hilarious.

 

[frogwoman]

As for the left being infiltrated by the far right, that's nothing new. Sometimes it isn't even "infiltration", it's just the fact that the fash oppose the same things the left do, but they do so for different reasons. particularly environmentalism because of the whole rhetoric of "purity" and such like ...

 

[cesare]

lol

No common theme, oh none, none at all

 

[cesare]

I disagree with you and now that makes me an "anti-feminist"?
"Couldn't make it up", etc etc, etc.

You guys are absolutely hilarious.

I bet someone else apart from me decides to read your posting history.

 

[Darios]

I bet someone else apart from me decides to read your posting history.

Oh noes.

 

[cesare]

Oh noes.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

You see my point now, yes?

No. I don't see your point. That was why I posted that whole thing regarding not seeing your point.

There are also a lot of people who support some kind of '911 truth' who are nothing like your initial description and who are chasing entirely plausible and valid concerns regarding 9/11, 7/7, whatever etc etc.

Perhaps you could run my "initial description" by me again as I don't seem to recognise it in the slightest here.

 

[frogwoman]

To be completely fair, I also have "doubts" about 9/11. I'm sure that the people who crashed into the towers WERE islamic terrorists. The issue for me is how much knowledge the security services, or elements within them, had prior to the attacks, and whether they "allowed" the attacks to happen purely due to incompetence, or whether they knew but chose to say nothing for other motives.

How much influence do the Saudi and other relevant governments have high up in the CIA etc and would elements sympathetic to them in the organisation have been capable of suppressing intelligence they had about terrorist attacks. for me there does appear to be a possibility that SOME in the CIA MIGHT have known about it and I suspect that as time goes on we will come some way towards discovering the truth about it.

the racist, paranoid claims of the 9/11 truth movement, which are so often aimed at demonising either Jews or Saudis as a people do not help.

No matter what I think of the US government I don't think even they would have been capable of organising the deaths of three thousand of their own citizens.

However, I do think that there must be an investigation into 9/11 and exactly what happened, however it possibly should wait about ten years or something, becuase right now, so soon after the atrocity, any investigation, by ANY organisation is likely to be highly politicised ...

 

[Darios]

The issue for me is how much knowledge the security services, or elements within them, had prior to the attacks, and whether they "allowed" the attacks to happen purely due to incompetence, or whether they knew but chose to say nothing for other motives.

All worthy questions to ask, but apparently conspiraloonery around these parts.....

the racist, paranoid claims of the 9/11 truth movement, which are so often aimed at demonising either Jews or Saudis as a people do not help.

Yes, there are plenty of racists and paranoids who identify with the '9/11 truth movement. There are also a lot of non-racist and well balanced people who also do so.

 

[frogwoman]

Yes, there are plenty of racists and paranoids who identify with the '9/11 truth movement. There are also a lot of non-racist and well balanced people who also do so.

I agree with that.

I can't say I identify with the 9/11 truth movement as they tend to share a certain view about what happened that day and who was responsible that I do not share.

I do not believe the US government ordered it.

 

[pk]

9/11 "truthers" pick and choose the facts that support their arguments and when anyone shows their theories up to be hysterical bullshit they claim that they are working for the Black Ops people or whatever.

It's actually funny for a while, but sinister and dangerous when you think about the amount of gullible muppets swept up by it.

I hope there have been several efforts to alert this guy's employer to his vile beliefs.

That's Dr Nicholas Kollerstrom, Research Fellow at:

University College London
Gower Street
London
WC1E 6BT
Telephone: +44 (0)20 7679 2000

sts@ucl.ac.uk

Departmental offices are located in 22 Gordon Square.

Let's hope this makes the news too, might shake a few more people off the idea that these "truthers" are doing anything truthful, but instead spreading vile anti-semitic bullshit in order to sell a few books.
See David Icke for more details...

 

[Wilf]

As to whether this guy should be grassed up to his employers:

Does it cut both ways? Should union reps defend anybody? Dunno really. Instead, he should be sacked for being an absolutely fucking incompetent academic. Anybody who holds these views on WW2 (as well as 9/11) is as much a dullard as they are offensive and foul. Anyway, however the priciples fall, I'd be very happy to see a whole lot of shit heading his way.

[Actualy, if there's this much info about, i guess UCL already know. However they won't do anything about it out of some high minded intellectual principle, only if he becomes an embarassment. Lets name and shame]

 

[taffboy gwyrdd]

To be completely fair, I also have "doubts" about 9/11. I'm sure that the people who crashed into the towers WERE islamic terrorists. The issue for me is how much knowledge the security services, or elements within them, had prior to the attacks, and whether they "allowed" the attacks to happen purely due to incompetence, or whether they knew but chose to say nothing for other motives.

How much influence do the Saudi and other relevant governments have high up in the CIA etc and would elements sympathetic to them in the organisation have been capable of suppressing intelligence they had about terrorist attacks. for me there does appear to be a possibility that SOME in the CIA MIGHT have known about it and I suspect that as time goes on we will come some way towards discovering the truth about it.

the racist, paranoid claims of the 9/11 truth movement, which are so often aimed at demonising either Jews or Saudis as a people do not help.

No matter what I think of the US government I don't think even they would have been capable of organising the deaths of three thousand of their own citizens.

However, I do think that there must be an investigation into 9/11 and exactly what happened, however it possibly should wait about ten years or something, becuase right now, so soon after the atrocity, any investigation, by ANY organisation is likely to be highly politicised ...

this is pretty much where my position averages out, but lord knows i get flamed for it. When I have time for looking into it (not a lot recently) I sometimes come away thinking it was the "hidden government", sometimes that it was just an almighty cock-up. But you are right, there should be further investigation and plenty of perfectly sane people agree.

As for the bona fide loony troofers, they exist for sure. bona fide loonies probably exist for every shade of opinion there is on any matter. And some could be Counter Intel Pro of course

<awaits flaming for daring to suggest CIP exists, nope, never - its just not possible >

 

[frogwoman]

well I don't think it was "the hidden government" and I do think that tbh, it probably was a massive cockup. maybe someone inside the security services knew - i certainly don't think it was everyone in the organisation. its a question of how much they knew (becuase to be honest, given what i've read about the subject it's implausible IMO that NOBODY KNEW ANYTHING) and how much they chose to ignore and whether there was anyone who chose to actively assist, if so, they need to be found and punished. the fact is however that any investigation into it, by any side, at this moment in time will be very highly politicised, so maybe it should be conducted again in a few years.

I think the government is fucked up enough as it is. Most of what happens is on public view it's just that people choose to ignore it. Why add all this crazy shit about secret societies, Jews and the illuminati? The evidence of the hypocrisy and the lies is right there in front of us, we don't need to invent conspiracies to make them look "evil". The facts are enough IMO. Its not that people in government are evil. They're just like us - it's the fact that they're seduced by the trappings of power and wealth which makes them do terrible things, just like any one of us could be. and they close their eyes to the world's injustices in the same way as any of us could. placed in a similar position to the politicians, making a few wrong choices, getting involved in a web of deciet and that sort of thing, any of us could end up behaving in that sort of a way. i write some pretty harsh things but i honestly don't believe that people in the government are "evil" or different from anyone else.

the thing is, how much do any of us know, really?

 

[Y_I_Otter]

it probably was a massive cockup.

That's the most likely scenario. The various, top-heavy security services not sufficiently integrated, jealous of one another to the point of withholding information, tough competition for funding and executive favour. That sort of thing.

 

[Y_I_Otter]

9/11 "truthers" pick and choose the facts that support their arguments and when anyone shows their theories up to be hysterical bullshit they claim that they are working for the Black Ops people or whatever.

That's Holocaust denial in a nutshell as well: begin with an assumption (The Joos are lying), dwell long and hard on the minutiae that support your thesis and dismiss everything that doesn't, even if it's an avalanche of sound evidence.

Odd, isn't it, that such a massive hoax has escaped the notice of tens of thousands of bona fide historians and yet is revealed to a gaggle of professional antisemites.

 

[frogwoman]

i think selfishness, apathy, prejudice and greed are baiscally the biggest causes of world problems and that is more frightening because i think it's in human nature, nobody is perfect. we all have our prejudices. i mean i know i do ffs.

and then there's cognitive dissonance, people shutting their eyes and not wanting to see ...

it's that IMO which is the problem, and all the economic inequality, exploitation etc which has accumulated over literally centuries, not a massive world conspiracy.

it happens everywhere though and i'm not convicned that a major form of political change will get rid of it ... although i think that most people are basically decent (although everyone is flawed and normal people can be persuaded into doing or believing terrible things) but that gives me grounds for optimism as there are very few real bastards in the world. although they do exist, and unfortunately politics often tends to attract a certain type of person ...