Charities: Govt rhetoric on welfare leading to inciting attacks on disabled people..

[ericjarvis]

froggy

the thing that got me about that aktion-T4 is that the economic justifications were clearly at the top of it, it was all like "look how much killing these people is gonna save the state"

obviously the situation now is nowhere near as bad but fucking hell naked economic considerations, or what

I see it as worse in one very important way. The scale is far smaller as yet, but the effect of the policy is to kill sick and disabled people without the politicians accepting any reponsibility. At least death camps would be honest.

Simple fact. I can no longer afford to keep enough food in the house to go a fortnight without at least three or four hypos. I'm pretty good at spotting them and have neighbours who will help out in an emergency. Not every diabetic on insulin is as lucky.

Whatever mealy mouthed excuses they make up, the policy of the last two governments has been to kill the sick and disabled in order to save money to pay for huge government contracts (and massive tax evasion) for large donors to political party funds. Morally it's not all that different from gassing us.

 

[_angel_]

In France children with autism are still 'treated' by psychiatrists in mental hospitals and any attempt by parents to remove autism from the classification of mental illness is fiercely opposed by psychiatrists...
eta
dunno about the position with adults with autism, my only knowledge is about children in this respect

Hey there's people on here who think it's something that can be willed away and is caused by capitalism. Of course there was never autism in the past. Just imbeciles, fools, and whatever other lovely terms they had.
And then it all being down to the mothers fault (Freud etc).

 

[Mrs Magpie]

And then it all being down to the mothers fault (Freud etc).

It was Leo Kanner....'refrigerator mothers'

 

[articul8]

And then it all being down to the mothers fault (Freud etc).

evidence of Freud saying this? He certainly recognised that there were forms of psychic disorder that were inherited/biological rather than neurotic.

 

[Pickman's model]

evidence of Freud saying this? He certainly recognised that there were forms of psychic disorder that were inherited/biological rather than neurotic.

i think larkin put it well:

They fuck you up, your mum and dad.
They may not mean to, but they do.
They fill you with the faults they had
And add some extra, just for you.

But they were fucked up in their turn
By fools in old-style hats and coats,
Who half the time were soppy-stern
And half at one another's throats.

Man hands on misery to man.
It deepens like a coastal shelf.
Get out as early as you can,
And don't have any kids yourself.

 

[toggle]

Hey there's people on here who think it's something that can be willed away and is caused by capitalism.

oh ffs.

 

[Bakunin]

judging from some of the comments bakunin has made about the treatment he got in one of the 'nicer' areas of plymouth, I think aspies can be at quite a risk as well.

To be fair, the 'nicer' areas of Plymouth are only the ones that aren't as soul-destroyingly shit as the worse parts, the 'nicer' areas also having a lower level of being infested by cunts. With Plymouth, as a general rule of thumb, the lower your expectations the less heartbreakingly disillusioned you're likely to become.

Aspies are at risk, no doubt about it. We simply don't pick up social warning signs that 'normal people' (a phrase I personally detest with a venom) will pick up naturally. Also, we're often so isolated that we're wide open to being used and manipulated by people who aren't what they seem because a lot of us are quite likely to be ecstatic at having SOMEBODY take an interest in us that doesn't seem openly hostile to start off with and that leads to us being royally fucked and possibly in serious trouble somewhere down the line. Personally, I've learned not to trust anybody readily, to cut people off completely if they seriously fuck me over once (sticking around for a second dose usually invites one, in my experience) and that the human species isn't my favourite one on the planet. Sounds misanthropic, I know, but it comes from a lifelong experience of being drip-fed endless hostility from people who are openly vile towards me and being fucked over pretty badly (and more than a few times) by people who enjoyed twisting my mind into spaghetti while ably pretending that they ever gave a damn in the first place.

 

[toggle]

To be fair, the 'nicer' areas of Plymouth are only the ones that aren't as soul-destroyingly shit as the worse parts, the 'nicer' areas also having a lower level of being infested by cunts. With Plymouth, as a general rule of thumb, the lower your expectations the less heartbreakingly disillusioned you're likely to become.

Aspies are at risk, no doubt about it. We simply don't pick up social warning signs that 'normal people' (a phrase I personally detest with a venom) will pick up naturally. Also, we're often so isolated that we're wide open to being used and manipulated by people who aren't what they seem because a lot of us are quite likely to be ecstatic at having SOMEBODY take an interest in us that doesn't seem openly hostile to start off with and that leads to us being royally fucked and possibly in serious trouble somewhere down the line. Personally, I've learned not to trust anybody readily, to cut people off completely if they seriously fuck me over once (sticking around for a second dose usually invites one, in my experience) and that the human species isn't my favourite one on the planet. Sounds misanthropic, I know, but it comes from a lifelong experience of being drip-fed endless hostility from people who are openly vile towards me and being fucked over pretty badly (and more than a few times) by people who enjoyed twisting my mind into spaghetti while ably pretending that they ever gave a damn in the first place.

makes me wonder why in the hell you let me into your life so fast tbh

 

[Bakunin]

makes me wonder why in the hell you let me into your life so fast tbh

I took a leap of faith for once.

For once, not only was I right to, but I've gained someone who makes all the previous shit in my life worth having been through.

 

[Libertad]

To be fair, the 'nicer' areas of Plymouth are only the ones that aren't as soul-destroyingly shit as the worse parts, the 'nicer' areas also having a lower level of being infested by cunts. With Plymouth, as a general rule of thumb, the lower your expectations the less heartbreakingly disillusioned you're likely to become.

That is so true.

 

[Libertad]

Aspies are at risk, no doubt about it. We simply don't pick up social warning signs that 'normal people' (a phrase I personally detest with a venom) will pick up naturally. Also, we're often so isolated that we're wide open to being used and manipulated by people who aren't what they seem because a lot of us are quite likely to be ecstatic at having SOMEBODY take an interest in us that doesn't seem openly hostile to start off with and that leads to us being royally fucked and possibly in serious trouble somewhere down the line. Personally, I've learned not to trust anybody readily, to cut people off completely if they seriously fuck me over once (sticking around for a second dose usually invites one, in my experience) and that the human species isn't my favourite one on the planet. Sounds misanthropic, I know, but it comes from a lifelong experience of being drip-fed endless hostility from people who are openly vile towards me and being fucked over pretty badly (and more than a few times) by people who enjoyed twisting my mind into spaghetti while ably pretending that they ever gave a damn in the first place.

No, that isn't misanthropy that's self-preservation.

 

[treelover]

froggy

the thing that got me about that aktion-T4 is that the economic justifications were clearly at the top of it, it was all like "look how much killing these people is gonna save the state"

obviously the situation now is nowhere near as bad but fucking hell naked economic considerations, or what

March 1914. Exhibition of the Reichsausschuss für Volksgesundheit (Reich Committee for National Health)

“Three-year old boy, deaf, crippled and completely idiotic. The nursing costs amounting to 8 Marks a day”, ​

http://mindinflux.wordpress.com/tag/black-triangle/​

​

​

it started well before the Nazis came to power..

 

[Mrs Magpie]

it started well before the Nazis came to power..

Eugenics was 'the new thing' all over Europe and that's partly why Marie Stopes got into birth control. The difference being that, distasteful though the idea of preventing the feckless lower orders from breeding is, the mass killing of children and lying to their parents about the cause of death started with Hitler, as far as I can ascertain.

 

[DotCommunist]

froggyposting

yes it did, prior to 1938 disabled people were "just" sterilised and usually there was a semblance of consent

which was still shit but it wasnt hadamar

 

[Frankie Jack]

Press portrayal of disabled people
A rise in hostility fuelled by austerity?
pdf by Disability Rights UK.

 

[ViolentPanda]

it started well before the Nazis came to power..

In the US states that conducted sterilisations, they worked out who to sterilise according to supposedly-actuarial calculations of projected cost over a lifetime, plus cost of the "average" number of chidren etc.
It's always about economics, even when it's dressed up as something else.

 

[frogwoman]

One early 16mm film Erbkrank (“The Hereditarily Ill” or “The
Genetically Diseased”), variously dated as 1934 (U.S. National Archives)
or 1936 (Bundesarchiv, Koblenz) was presented as an educational
documentary by the NSDAP, the agency for racial affairs of the National
Socialist Party. It begins by citing the influence of the “Jewish Liberal
thinking” that led to a situation in which mentally ill and handicapped
patients were being cared for in “palatial” sanatoriums by “the cream” of
the medical profession, the best-educated, best-trained, and healthiest
nurses and doctors. These idyllic scenes are intercut with contrasting
scenes of average, hard-working German families living in abject poverty
within over-crowded hovels, and the implication is that their situation is
the result of the same misguided policies: “Healthy families are housed in
sheds that are falling apart and in dark alleys, but for the insane... palaces
have been built.” This was a particularly telling argument for the average
German worker, impoverished during the terrible economic times of the
Weimar Republic.

fucking hell.

 

[Libertad]

fucking hell.

I would like to make comparisons with current developments in Britain but there is no need really, is there?

 

[NoXion]

Is it just me, or am I seeing parallels with the kind of rhetoric that depicts prison life as something akin to a holiday? That sort of talk has been going on since before the recession, as I remember.

 

[Greebo]

Is it just me, or am I seeing parallels with the kind of rhetoric that depicts prison life as something akin to a holiday? That sort of talk has been going on since before the recession, as I remember.

Not just you. It says something about how relentlessly tough life can be when people start thinking that at least in prison you'd be fed, have a roof over your head, and not have to work such long hours.

 

[Fedayn]

Yep. Poor show, LLETSA. It was only missing a picture of a burning disability aid as lols, like fucking Longdog's treatment of an advice thread re travellers. What is it that brings out the bloody worst in people like this, the ability to exercise power? Fuck's sake.

There was and is no comparison whatsoever between what Lletsa said and longdogs posts.

 

[cesare]

There was and is no comparison whatsoever between what Lletsa said and longdogs posts.

I suppose that depends if you were on the receiving end, or not, doesn't it?

 

[Frances Lengel]

Recieving end of what? I know feelings are (rightly) running high over issues pertaining to disability ATM but like I said somewhere else, opinions were ascribed to LLETSA which, if you read his posts properly, he didn't actually give voice to.

 

[Minnie_the_Minx]

Press portrayal of disabled people

A rise in hostility fuelled by austerity?
pdf by Disability Rights UK.

FFS! Because of Sonia Poulton's articles, the Daily Mail comes out 2nd on top for positive coverage

although it does also come 2nd on top for negative coverage

 

[DotCommunist]

Recieving end of what? I know feelings are (rightly) running high over issues pertaining to disability ATM but like I said somewhere else, opinions were ascribed to LLETSA which, if you read his posts properly, he didn't actually give voice to.

the frequency with which that happened on many many threads suggests either a) he is a poor communicator (don't buy that one) b) his audience are bad readers (some are some aren't) or c) he regularly trailed his coat to get a reaction.

I know which I think most likely.Don't think it should have been permanent mind

 

[Frances Lengel]

You've probably got a point. Maybe a week's ban would've been more fitting though.

 

[Mrs Magpie]

You've probably got a point. Maybe a week's ban would've been more fitting though.

Going by past performance on a temp ban, he re-registers pretty sharpish. This wasn't about one incident. It's a catalogue.

 

[Mrs Magpie]

Personally,I think he trolls deliberately.

 

[DotCommunist]

of course, its just a version of the lie by omission, where you don't say something but allude to it and allow people to think something.Then when pulled you can say 'ah but I didn't say that, I am not responsible for conclusions you have leapt to'. Cunts trick

 

[ViolentPanda]

Going by past performance on a temp ban, he re-registers pretty sharpish. This wasn't about one incident. It's a catalogue.

Wonder if he'll come back as a woman again?