Mentally ill people to get 'job coach' visits...

[Whagwan]

I got booted from the Labour party in 2015 for replying to a "Liz for Leader" email calling her a Tory cunt.

I maintain that is an accurate position.

 

[nogojones]

That phrase "economically inactive"; how fucking annoying is that?

Even when I'm in work I try my hardest to be economically inactive

 

[Oriole]

Let's face it, "hard working families" is a pretty nondenominational utterance. Also it wasn't the Tories who introduced fitness for work tests thing in 2008 and gave the contract to ATOS so it is totally on brand for Labour.

 

[Boris Sprinkler]

Not to mention the Medicine they dose you up on, often times leaves you incapable of much.
A hard working and diligent man whose head’s a tent. He spends his time wondering where it went.
Over 20 years experience of closed wards . Prefers STP to LSD. Can present in an arrangement of various character's.
Does not like the tiny pyramids they use to kontrol your mind.
Gis a job.

 

[Plumdaff]

Yes LakieLady the idea that MH services haven't already considered that meaningful and supportive activity and employment, with caveats, isn't helpful for people and there aren't already programmes in place is just so fucking clueless and patronising.

But clueless and patronising is the dictionary definition when you look up Liz Kendall, so why am I surprised.

 

[newme]

The job centre can't help you get a job, how the hell is this ever going to work?
My son's currently been forced into 3 full days of meetings about applying for NHS jobs, which he did already by visiting the website regularly.
We have one hospital and they kind of want clinical hires what with being a hospital. Today was 'remote' care roles, with remote apparently meaning having no fixed base. No pre screening for anyone who might say, not have a car or not be able to drive, since it costs a fortune to learn which people without jobs generally don't have. I spent 10 months to get a job with transport available, experience and certifications.

Who is supposed to be providing these jobs? Certainly not the government it seems if they are cutting back here there and everywhere.

 

[Dystopiary]

My local MP is at it again! She used to be referred to as "lazy Liz" by Labour activists round here, so it's ironic that she's now telling ill people to get back to fucking work.

From the off she's been awful at the helm of the DWP. I fear they'll go further than the Tories to harm benefit claimants.

 

[SpookyFrank]

But clueless and patronising is the dictionary definition when you look up Liz Kendall, so why am I surprised.

This goes beyond stupidity and well into outright malice territory.

As always, the alarming bit is that there are apparently no grown ups around in a position to say, what the fuck have you been smoking, no obviously you can't do that, go away and think about what you've done.

 

[SpookyFrank]

I'm assuming you don't need an enhanced DBS to be a DWP work coach.

You do to work unescorted on a psych ward. And the staff have more important shit to do than babysit these surplus cunts.

 

[Plumdaff]

This goes beyond stupidity and well into outright malice territory.

As always, the alarming bit is that there are apparently no grown ups around in a position to say, what the fuck have you been smoking, no obviously you can't do that, go away and think about what you've done.

There will be massive push back from civil servants, NHS management, service users, the professions. What do any of these people know?

 

[Dystopiary]

She would come, nod a bit and totally ignore anything you or you service users said.

I had to deal with the cunt Tony McNulty when he was Minister for Employment and Welfare Reform who visited a service I was involved with to get a press opportunity to sell the wonderful concept of Work Capability Assessments. All the service users who were extremely vulnerable and the staff told him that it was a terrible idea that would make everyone's situation substantially worse and would put lives at risk. He didn't even pretend to listen and just got his photo op and trotted out his pre-prepared statement about people on incapacity benefit getting something for nothing.

This was the same Tony McNulty who eight months later was caught claiming expenses on a second home, occupied by his parents, which was 8 miles away from his primary residence and had to resign.

I just checked again and I'm sorry to read that the cunt is still alive.

BIB- Labour came up with that too. Previous encumbents were called "Minister of State for Employment" or "Minister of State for Work."
It shows the direction they were keen to take.

 

[SpookyFrank]

Also all inpatients have their JSA claims paused and replaced by disability benefits for the duration of their stay. You can't stop a benefit that someone doesn't even get.

 

[newme]

BIB- Labour came up with that too. Previous encumbents were called "Minister of State for Employment" or "Minister of State for Work."
It show the direction they were keen to take.

Skim reading this I read the second one as "Minister of Silly Walks"

 

[Epona]

It's not "work" that helps - it's getting out of the house and feeling part of a community and having interesting things to do that (at least in many cases of mild mental health issues or situations of isolation and loneliness) can help.

Not going to work as in being exploited while serving burgers or doing up bolts on car parts for minimum wage in order to get you off the benefits system. That can be damaging to mental health.

 

[frogwoman]

They're also saying people should be given weight loss jabs to get them back to work. Labour have always been obsessed with this stuff though, the ATOS Assessments all started with them I think.

 

[8ball]

It's not "work" that helps - it's getting out of the house and feeling part of a community and having interesting things to do that (at least in many cases of mild mental health issues or situations of isolation and loneliness) can help.

Not going to work as in being exploited while serving burgers or doing up bolts on car parts for minimum wage in order to get you off the benefits system. That can be damaging to mental health.

Well, I think normal “job” things like having a routine, a range of people to be in contact with, some money coming in etc. can all be good too.

Does mean the jobs have to provide this and also be free of other toxic elements that can make things worse, though.

Any programme would need to be a fully rounded thing involving employers and many levels of support.

Edit: and not hassling hospital patients obv ffs!

 

[MickiQ]

This has got 'Focus Group' written all over it. What can we do to reduce unemployment and get people with mental health problems back into work but most importantly not cost much cos we're skint?
Let's have a focus group, indulge in some 'out of lane thinking', 'throw it out there and see if it sticks'. No idea is too daft to reject out of hand.

 

[frogwoman]

I personally need the routine and structure of work and definitely get more emotionally unstable when I've got less to do and less hours etc. If people are thrown into it with no support that's just as bad though, especially with the punitive approach that always seems to happen with these schemes and yeah...do they even know how ill you have to be to be on a psych ward??

 

[Epona]

I personally need the routine and structure of work and definitely get more emotionally unstable when I've got less to do and less hours etc. If people are thrown into it with no support that's just as bad though, especially with the punitive approach that always seems to happen with these schemes and yeah...do they even know how ill you have to be to be on a psych ward??

That doesn't need to take the format of being exploited by an employer the way that work currently works under capitalism though.
In a more sane society, etc. etc.

 

[AnnO'Neemus]

That phrase "economically inactive"; how fucking annoying is that?

It's more politically correct than 'Arbeit Macht Frei'.

 

[Lotte]

And what jobs could anyone who's severely ill enough to be admitted to hospital do, exactly?

 

[weltweit]

So are there resources for job coaches to visit psych wards?
What about some psychologists instead?

 

[PTK]

What evidence do they have for saying over and over that work helps? Sounds suspiciously like 'work makes you free.'

As for writing CVs. Some time ago, nearly 20 years ago, when signed off with depression and anxiety (grief related) aka 'a bit bluesy' I was desperate to return to work but couldn't talk to anyone without weeping and couldn't stop crying everyday , I voluntarily went to see the careers advisor at the job centre. He looked about twelve . He soon got stuck with my very practical questions ( in-between sobs) about how to list overlapping paid and voluntary roles. Nor how to explain why I left my last job because of bullying, partner at deaths door, followed by the death of my father and then two close friends (lots of weeping). He advised me to list my hobbies (did grown ups even still do that then?) he suggested I put 'listening to music ' and was incredulous when I said I didn't. It was a one off session and I didn't come out of it with a CV.

Wonder what AI would have advised.

Can you imagine a CV chat between a seriously mentally ill patient and AI? Really? Why would govt minister imagine that would help?

I have been on a number of “courses” on how to write a CV, some years ago.

One course will tell you that the heading needs to be centred. Then another will tell you that it needs to be to the left.

I had a real battle once to insist that I retain Times New Roman as my font. I think it easier to read, and more business-like, but Arial, I was told, was what I should use.

I put in the “interests” bit on my CV once that I was interested in Marxism, trade unionism, and Palestine and some of my favourite films were The Baader Meinhof Complex and The Battle of Algiers. No-one on one of these “courses” picked up on this.

 

[MrsArcanum]

Fucking hell, the very first sentence in that article has sent my rage levels through the roof:

"Job coaches will visit seriously ill patients on mental health wards to try to get them back to work, the government has said."

Have they any fucking idea how very unwell people have to be to be admitted to a psych unit? The first time I had to visit a client who'd been admitted, they were so unwell that they could do little more than rock backwards and forwards and giggle, they couldn't even give permission to the DWP to talk to me about their benefits. My brother is bipolar, and gets sectioned every few years. He's totally away with the fairies when he's that unwell.

If people with longstanding mental health conditions were well enough to consider working, they wouldn't be on mental health wards, for fuck's sake. This idea is so bonkers, if Liz Kendall is really serious about this she's probably unwell enough to get admitted herself.

It's as if the silly cow has thought "captive audience" for job coaching, with no clue as to their mental ill health.

 

[PTK]

There "job coaches" are pretty useless for people in the best of health.
They don't know much, and they are always working to the agenda of trying to force you into a job. They do not start from a position of doing what is in your best interests. You can get lullled into a false sense of security and reveal things about yourself that can be used against you.

 

[Lotte]

Work can definitely help, while having a job is crap not having one is oftern worse. I've had periods of depression where I turned down the offer of a sick note because sitting around at home on my own all day sounded so much worse than going to work.

I do have an issue with the mentality sometimes that people with physical or mental disabilities can't work, when in many cases they can it's just a question of finding the right job for them, so in theory I'm not against the idea of help for people to find work for their own sake. But I mean help, the government just use help when they mean coerce, and they do nothing to address the contradiction at the heart of their own policy. They want to push people into work but many employers will not be willing to make the adjustments necessary and they of course do nothing to help balance that side of the equation.

As for this particular policy it just seems daft either way, whether you actually want to help people or just try to force them into work people currently in hospital seem the worst people to target. It seems more like the sort of soundbite policy idea aimed at getting favourable headlines in the Mail than anything of real substance.

I've found a job I love - I'm a freelance translator - and I'm glad when I do get work because I don't like spending too much time trapped in my own head. But I dread going back into an office because I've had mental breakdowns in the past and signed off work because of it. I am not cut out for working in offices, especially open plan ones. They are really, really shit for autistic people. I have had meltdowns because of my current job but that was solved by getting my hard drive replaced (my computer kept crashing on me, especially when I had tight deadlines).

That said, it's taken me years to get to this point, and I am very lucky.

 

[RevolutionSound]

The irony is of course, that this support already exists.

 

[frogwoman]

That doesn't need to take the format of being exploited by an employer the way that work currently works under capitalism though.
In a more sane society, etc. etc.

Tbh, I think capitalism won't be overthrown/replaced in my lifetime, and maybe never will. But I do agree with you. It doesn't have to involve dickhead employers, it could be volunteering or community work/mutual aid or anything. Unfortunately I don't leave the house for my job and end up feeling very isolated at times, especially since my work feels very precarious at the moment. But I'm stuck with it unless I can find anything else that provides money. If I don't have anything to do that provides a structure, i get very depressed and unbalanced so I'd rather stick with that even though recently it's been quite shit.

 

[frogwoman]

And that's just me/my needs obviously. Of course other people will be different.

 

[Epona]

Tbh, I think capitalism won't be overthrown/replaced in my lifetime, and maybe never will. But I do agree with you. It doesn't have to involve dickhead employers, it could be volunteering or community work/mutual aid or anything. Unfortunately I don't leave the house for my job and end up feeling very isolated at times, especially since my work feels very precarious at the moment. But I'm stuck with it unless I can find anything else that provides money. If I don't have anything to do that provides a structure, i get very depressed and unbalanced so I'd rather stick with that even though recently it's been quite shit.

Like given in terms of understanding