8ball
Decolonise colons!
Do you mean each block is originally credited to whomever mines it, and then it gets traded, adding information to the block?
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Do you mean each block is originally credited to whomever mines it, and then it gets traded, adding information to the block?
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
A whole 1020 transactions. With a total value of around £2 million (much of which will be people selling btc to one another, presumably, rather than using it to trade other stuff). You really need look no further to see why btc is a bubble.
Technical question: are transaction fees paid in btc? That matters, I think. It makes the thing even bubblier.
Technical question: are transaction fees paid in btc? That matters, I think. It makes the thing even bubblier.
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littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
As I understand it, the block is merely the updated ledger as it exists at each node, which is the only thing bitcoin is. I don't know the precise mechanism by which transactions are added to the block, but it doesn't belong to anyone as such.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
As I understand it, most people buying are following the "don't worry about what it *is* - it's going up in price!" rule that led to the last financial crisis. The basic articles on it are bit too simple to convey some of the stuff here, and the stuff with the actual maths and tech in looks way too involved...
Now you get it.It seems to be a pre-borked system designed to create irrational economic inequalities, burn up heaps of natural resources and waste a huge amount of time.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
There is a frightening amount of complete bullshit on the internet about bitcoin, from a variety of sources. It's pretty disgusting, tbh.As I understand it, most people buying are following the "don't worry about what it *is* - it's going up in price!" rule that led to the last financial crisis. The basic articles on it are bit too simple to convey some of the stuff here, and the stuff with the actual maths and tech in looks way too involved...
8ball
Decolonise colons!
I think I understood part of the first sentence there...
joustmaster
offcumdun
Oh, sorry. Will try to be more clear.
The thing I posted was the most recent block on the blockchain.
The person who mined it put 1020 transactions on the block. Those transactions are the people around the world who are sending bitcoins.
Between them, the 1020 people gave 1.7 bitcoins to the miner as an incentive to have their transactions recognised and added to the chain.
The miner also got 12.5bitcoin for being the person who mined the block.
Here is the link to it
Bitcoin Block #504831
You can scroll down and see all the 1020 transactions.
You can even click on the addresses sending the bitcoins and see the life and journey of all the bitcoins.
joustmaster
offcumdun
Yes. When you send a bitcoin transaction you but in the destination address and a voluntary fee in bitcoin.
The fee level is set by the people who are making transactions. Not set by the blockchain or bitcoin. A sort of public jostling for attention marketplace auction nightmare.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
No worries - thanks for the further explanation, though.
So it is really that you don't "mine bitcoins" in the same way you might, for example, look for prime numbers, but you record transactions in a ledger, get fees (in bitcoin) for doing so from the people making the transactions, and get new bitcoins from the "bitcoins not existing yet with limit of 21 million" mathspace (presumably via software/math processes) for mining the block?
Even if that's right, it raises lots of questions in my mind.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
RT article here linking to a paper (can only read the abstract for free) saying that the first boom in btc, which took it up to $1k in 2013, was driven by one single actor.
I don't quite understand how that can be, but it appears to have been a ruse to give the appearance of heavy trading. Bitcoin certainly seem very manipulable for something that's supposed to be secure.
I don't quite understand how that can be, but it appears to have been a ruse to give the appearance of heavy trading. Bitcoin certainly seem very manipulable for something that's supposed to be secure.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Thanks. I thought it was something like that. Do you know who decides which transactions go on each block - is it the successful miner?
joustmaster
offcumdun
Yeah, pretty much.
It takes a lot of processing power to do the "mining". And it isn't just one person doing it. Its a massive team of people pooling their computing devices together to make a massive powerful group and then sharing the winnings.
Here is a breakdown of the pools and their size
I was a member of slushpool in 2011 and made about 1 bitcoin a day
joustmaster
offcumdun
Yes. The miner pool decides what goes on there. I'm sure they just do the ones that are the most satoshi per byte.
But they don't have to include any, if they don't want to.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
Ah, so people are competing to see who gets to record the transactions?
8ball
Decolonise colons!
So groups compete to make an imaginary book of accounts, then don't put any accounts in it?
The whole thing is beginning to look like the dumbest thing I ever heard.
joustmaster
offcumdun
Yes.
When it first started people were using their PCs to try to win the block (record the transactions).
Then they teamed up and worked in different groups, sharing their PC power.
Then people realised you could make a graphics card in a computer do loads more calculations than a PC
Then they made special processors and chips to do even more calculations
joustmaster
offcumdun
I don't think anyone actually does that. But they could if they wanted.So groups compete to make an imaginary book of accounts, then don't put any accounts in it?
The whole thing is beginning to look like the dumbest thing I ever heard.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
And what is "satoshi per byte"? Sounds like it relates to how much you get paid for writing in the imaginary accounts book.
littlebabyjesus
one of Maxwell's demons
Well, it doesn't seem very smart not to put transactions on there as they want their reward of 12.5 btc to be worth something. There is an incentive aside from the transaction fees to bump up the transactions. The miners don't want btc to crash.So groups compete to make an imaginary book of accounts, then don't put any accounts in it?
The whole thing is beginning to look like the dumbest thing I ever heard.
8ball
Decolonise colons!
joustmaster
offcumdun
A satoshi is kind of like pence. But it isn't 2 decimal places like the £. Its something like 0.00000001 bitcoin
its the smallest division. You can't have less than 0.00000001 bitcoin
if you send 1000 bitcoin or 0.001 bitcoin your transaction fee is about the same. It isn't linked to the amount of BC you send.
It is linked to the number of bytes your transaction takes up on the block
Here is a transaction.
One address sending some BC to another address.
Bitcoin Transaction 9e410d391ffe7d226d59d4dabcf639f65b2773a069f8c2b8a302e19c562350c1
You can see the fee they chose to paid is 0.00211426 for 192 bytes
And here is a more complicated transation
Bitcoin Transaction bba1437e3e84f24e76969f356f4405833e9a178a5170e3e93dbcce780add0e83
This guy is sending bitcoin from three addresses to about 50 addresses
you can see the fee they chose to paid is 0.08692454 for 2131 bytes
joustmaster
offcumdun
mauvais
on reddit or something
Is this satire? I can't tell.
Ranbay
The same rules apply
i didn't make it go up, if everyone just kept using it for drugs and not an investment tool then it wouldn’t have gone up!
camouflage
gaslit at scale.
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