newbie
undisambiguated
you live in an odd bubble
Urban v's the Commentariat
- Thread starter Belushi
- Start date
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
In what way is appeal debate then? Am i in a national debate with Justin Bieber? (he's my fav)
love detective
there's no love too small
has he ever been rescued by Ryan Gosling though?
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Yeah, one in which you confuse liking people on the internet with - hmm you are part of my debate. There's trying to be an understanding old fart too much. Sometimes.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
So you are in a debate with Queen and Iron Maiden right?
newbie
undisambiguated
damn, my point collapses
love detective
there's no love too small
to be fair that implies it had some kind of peak
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
No, you think people who have nothing to do with Clarkson live in a bubble. I'm not lying. So that makes you -the person living in a bubble that can't imagine a life without clarkson. Fuck off.
Nice one
Well-Known Member
i'm saying i watch top gear even though i don't drive. I'm saying i'd never read anything by laurie penny until you starting banging on about her on christmas day 2010, and every day since, like it mattered. Why does she matter to you? What does clarkson represent?
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Not really clear what you're saying at all here i'm afraid. Say it. Free-speaker.
you never had a point, you understand nothing.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
nice one said:
Two massive fucking lies btw
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
If you define influence strictly as being able to say whatever you want and have it change things, then no, I don't think Clarkson has influence. On the other hand he has the ability to change things when he addresses certain topics and tropes. And I don't think that influence means being able to say whatever you like, either - I can't think of anyone who could say anything on any topic and be greeted with the same level of interest and have the same level of impact.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
Stephen Fry. Today.
What? He can say things and change things or he can't?
newbie
undisambiguated
are you in debate with any of the commenatriat? Do they read you as you read them?
yet there is, self evidently, all sorts of debate going on. People talk to each other and they're far, far more likely to be responding to something Clarkson said on TG than to something LP says in the NS or a broadsheet. You haven't noticed?
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
What I said. He can change some things in some directions. He can't change other things and/or in other directions.
Sorry, I'm a bit puzzled by this now.
Do you have any examples of what you mean by Clarkson changing some things in one direction and not in others?
You're certainly puzzling me!
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
I didn't say that they were part of some debate we just all happened to be part of - you attributed that power to clarkson you weirdo.
So what? I said you have to live in some sort of crazy bubble to think that Clarkson dictates debates - either one where you think everyone else is a thick mug dictated too by top gear or some other crazy world wtf i don't care about him and never hear about him apart from people like you telling me again that he speaks for me. Double bubble.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
The ordinaries lap him up
There is a weird paternalism in newbies posts that assumes - this is what the norms do think and talk about. Looks at the likes.
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
I don't think it's all that controversial to say that his output on Top Gear and elsewhere has been influential in promoting and reinforcing a set of particular reactionary - anti-environmental, anti-feminist, casually racist - positions. I would also agree with what you said earlier, that sometimes he has said things in other directions, which have not had the same effect. They're not part of his media profile or backed by those who support that.
OK I see what you're saying, - I do disagree though with the idea that he is influential in that I don't see how he drives forward and shapes public debate, rather than simply being an entertainer who adds colour to certain popular and well established social tropes including some of those you mention.
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
I think he drives those tropes forward, and reinvigorates them. (Well, not any more really, but he used to.)
Like I said, maybe that doesn't mean he has personal influence since he's very limited in the areas that he's made a difference, but everyone is limited to some extent. Clarkson could probably have influence in other areas based on his position as a public figure if he put effort into it, but he doesn't seem to want to.
butchersapron
Bring back hanging
I'm interested in newbies idea that people who don't care what well paid celebs say are in some sort of elite bubble though.
I agree he could have influence if he wanted, but doesn't - I would imagine that he is more interested in earning a good living and having fun which seems fair enough.
You seem to be saying that he is a Schrodinger's Clarkson in the way he both does and doesn't have influence... Like some kind of "quantumn reactionary".
FridgeMagnet
Administrator
This is what I don't understand about what you're posting. People can have more influence in certain areas than others. Clarkson can say what he likes about 18th century romantic poetry and it will have barely more more effect on the world than if I said it. There's no consistent influence score.
You keep saying where he doesn't have influence but seem reluctant to spell out and provide examples where he does have influence?
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