Ukraine and the Russian invasion, 2022-24

[Supine]

I don't think you'd need a complex system of background checks to weed out the Nazis swanning around with fuck-off great swastika flags.

Sometimes they go underground. See the Tory party for reference.

 

[strung out]

Another Russian general reportedly dead, although some doubt as they've got the photo wrong. If true, that's five now.

 

[bimble]

I do agree that headbanging isn't remotely exclusive to the left - but I imagine that he was talking about what we see here, where there are very few right-wing types, headbangers or otherwise.

Yeah, fair enough.
They will probably come out of this stronger, the nazis, whichever way things go, and that is shit. But there isn’t a thing that can be done about that at this moment is there. And if you look at the information war that’s happening right now, Azov is absolutely key to it, specifically to the Russian efforts to deny killing civilians and justify the whole war: There are thousands of posts saying it was azov who are to blame for the maternity hospital and the theatre and who are killing civilians as they attempt to leave Mariupol. So making them the focus of your concern right now is an interesting choice.

 

[teqniq]

I think this thread is as good as any to observe that the amount of pearoasts has gone up significantly over the past few years - even pearoasts that are fairly close to each other. I surmise that this is because people are using phones to read and post on threads and because the screen is smaller they just don't see as much and also can't be bothered to scroll up. /derail.

 

[frogwoman]

Translation: 'my apartment has undergone some cosmetic procedures'.

Graffiti says 'Z - don't betray your homeland bitch '

 

[existentialist]

Yeah, fair enough.
They will probably come out of this stronger, the nazis, whichever way things go, and that is shit. But there isn’t a thing that can be done about that at this moment is there. And if you look at the information war that’s happening right now, Azov is absolutely key to it, specifically to the Russian efforts to deny killing civilians and justify the whole war: There are thousands of posts saying it was azov who are to blame for the maternity hospital and the theatre and who are killing civilians as they attempt to leave Mariupol. So making them the focus of your concern right now is an interesting choice.

I don't know if your last sentence is in response to something I've said, but I'm certainly not making any political grouping the focus of my concern. TBH, at this point, the political niceties of what's going on on the ground are very much secondary to the practicalities. But those will need dealing with later, in any post-conflict phase.

 

[Pickman's model]

Attacks from the air are doing huge damage, but via cruise missiles, over a thousand fired so far, one took out a barracks today with rumours of 200 dead. Like the west, they like to avoid putting pilots in harms way so modern guided missiles provide the same impact. Even if Ukraine physically drives the Russian army back out of the country, these missiles and long-range artillery can still fly over the border or in from the sea mostly unimpeded - it’s why a military victory isn’t possible, and an end can only come via negotiation or regime change.

Yeh but war is not merely an act of policy but a true political instrument, a continuation of political intercourse, carried on with other means.

 

[bimble]

I don't know if your last sentence is in response to something I've said, but I'm certainly not making any political grouping the focus of my concern. TBH, at this point, the political niceties of what's going on on the ground are very much secondary to the practicalities. But those will need dealing with later, in any post-conflict phase.

Oh, no. I just mean well meaning anti nazis choosing to go on about azov at this time who are they helping.

 

[existentialist]

Oh, no. I just mean well meaning anti nazis choosing to go on about azov at this time who are they helping.

Yeah. It would be a mistake to assume that they are somehow "our friends", even if they might happen to be fighting the same enemy right now.

 

[Yossarian]

People going on about the Azov whilst the war is happening are an irritant because it seems pointless at the moment and it also plays perfectly into Russian propaganda. Some of them have gone the whole hog and are using the nazis as a way to try to stick to their established idea that the baddies are always whichever side America is on,

It's a prime example of "both-sides-ism" - yes, Ukraine is a chronically corrupt country that was far too accommodating of a far-right battalion.

But amplifying the importance of the Azov battalion and other far-right groups while downplaying the fact that Russia is bombing Ukrainian cities to dust and slaughtering thousand of civilians just seems to be echoing Russian propaganda - there is very clearly a good side and a bad side in this conflict and the good side is not the one that is bombing hospitals.

Putin is probably the best recruiting sergeant hardline Ukrainian nationalists have ever had - he's already radicalised whole generations of Ukrainians and the Syrian reinforcements haven't even arrived yet.

 

[Pickman's model]

It's a prime example of "both-sides-ism" - yes, Ukraine is a chronically corrupt country that was far too accommodating of a far-right battalion.

But amplifying the importance of the Azov battalion and other far-right groups while downplaying the fact that Russia is bombing Ukrainian cities to dust and slaughtering thousand of civilians just seems to be echoing Russian propaganda - there is very clearly a good side and a bad side in this conflict and the good side is not the one that is bombing hospitals.

Putin is probably the best recruiting sergeant hardline Ukrainian nationalists have ever had - he's already radicalised whole generations of Ukrainians and the Syrian reinforcements haven't even arrived yet.

They're very good for each other

 

[frogwoman]

It just reminds me of this tbh

 

[frogwoman]

Finding the most unsavoury elements of your opponents forces and using that to justify the war is a tale as old as time

 

[bimble]

Another Russian general reportedly dead, although some doubt as they've got the photo wrong. If true, that's five now.

Not very informative, anyone got a better answer ?

 

[Pickman's model]

Still smaller than the British army's bearskin

 

[SpackleFrog]

An absolutely barmy decision by a Portuguese judge

Judge gives neo-nazi leave to fight in Ukraine

Judge gives neo-nazi leave to fight in Ukraine: Suspends order obliging Mário Machado to report bi-monthly to authorities

www.portugalresident.com

That is bizarre.

Maybe he'll get killed?

 

[existentialist]

Not very informative, anyone got a better answer ?
View attachment 314937

I'm not entirely convinced - there are plenty of pictures of people with enormous hats from the Soviet era, too. Here's an enormous Soviet hat



And, TBF, they're not the only military with enormous hats:

 

[cupid_stunt]

Putin is probably the best recruiting sergeant hardline Ukrainian nationalists have ever had - he's already radicalised whole generations of Ukrainians and the Syrian reinforcements haven't even arrived yet.

Sadly, yes.

The bloody Azov Battalion was only formed after the last Russian invasion in 2014,

 

[Pickman's model]

I'm not entirely convinced - there are plenty of pictures of people with enormous hats from the Soviet era, too. Here's an enormous Soviet hat

View attachment 314940

Your bathroom?

 

[existentialist]

Still smaller than the British army's bearskin

Snap

 

[seeformiles]

Not very informative, anyone got a better answer ?
View attachment 314937

I always wondered why they were so huge. I’ve always found the rule “The bigger the hats, the more batshit and totalitarian the regime” is pretty reliable.

 

[frogwoman]

 

[cupid_stunt]

Finding the most unsavoury elements of your opponents forces and using that to justify the war is a tale as old as time

Indeed, and the Azov Battalion only had an estimated 900 members before this current invasion, in a country of over 40 million.

 

[dilute micro]

Russian dress uniforms could do so much better. They look like ebay ripoffs.

No bias here.

 

[frogwoman]

An invasion by a neighbouring country with a long history of trying to invade and occupy you is definitely the sort of thing that's going to put people off nationalism

 

[Pickman's model]

I always wondered why they were so huge. I’ve always found the rule “The bigger the hats, the more batshit and totalitarian the regime” is pretty reliable.

View attachment 314945

Those are in fact satellite transmitters

 

[Pickman's model]

I always wondered why they were so huge. I’ve always found the rule “The bigger the hats, the more batshit and totalitarian the regime” is pretty reliable.

View attachment 314945

You may be right

Spoiler

 

[The39thStep]

That is bizarre.

Maybe he'll get killed?

Would that be judged a good thing or a bad thing on here?

 

[Pickman's model]

Would that be judged a good thing or a bad thing on here?

Yes

 

[Yossarian]

An invasion by a neighbouring country with a long history of trying to invade and occupy you is definitely the sort of thing that's going to put people off nationalism

And destroying Ukrainian children's homes, killing their parents, and turning them into refugees is definitely going to bolster Putin's argument that they are one people and one country - all those people whose first memory was fleeing a bombed city with their traumatized parents will no doubt grow up with fond memories of the Russian motherland.