The American mass shooting thread

[Pickman's model]

One gun firing sounds very different from several guns firing. Not that it really matters just appearing on the scene changes the dynamic from shooting fish in the barrell to combat for the school shooter so his accuracy goes to shit and he is shooting at the guy with the gun instead of students

Yeh. The acoustics of the building surely no bearing on the matter.

 

[agricola]

Of course not. Regardless of whether the guy had an air rifle or a rifle, a shotgun and an array of nail bombs, he should have gone in.

That is a much easier thing to type than do. If he was told not to go in until he had backup, to call him a coward for not going in is deeply unfair.

 

[Pickman's model]

I somehow doubt his contract specified a precise range of the number of shooters over which he had a duty to protect those kids.

Yeh. Do you think you might behave differently, were you as is easy to imagine the cop, if you felt you were facing two or three shooters from how you might if you felt there was one?

 

[8ball]

Yeh. The acoustics of the building surely no bearing on the matter.

Yeah, the way the sound of a gun is going to rattle around the inside of the building could well make the situation confusing.

I don’t agree that the right course of action is to wait until the shooter(s) has run out of bullets, though.

 

[not-bono-ever]

Referred to this earlier- plenty of ex squaddies and probably serving cops here( lolz) - how would a single person intervention like this, several minutes before the rest of the squad turned up be viewed afterwards ?

Bear in mind this was not Lewis Collins at the scene

 

[binka]

That is a much easier thing to type than do. If he was told not to go in until he had backup, to call him a coward for not going in is deeply unfair.

If he was ordered not to go in I will withdraw my comment calling him a coward. I would have thought that might have come out by now though

 

[8ball]

Yeh. Do you think you might behave differently, were you as is easy to imagine the cop, if you felt you were facing two or three shooters from how you might if you felt there was one?

I don’t know how I’d react as a bystander, never mind as a trained professional.

I’d expect my first thought might be “fuckfuckfuckfuck”, followed by thinking about when did I last clean my gun and how many rounds do I have...

I’d really hope I wouldn’t be standing around for 4 minutes as the shots rang out. Whatever happened, I’m sure it seemed to last as much of a lifetime for him as it did for the kids. Those that survived.

Anyone can freeze and I do have sympathy for the guy. Guess we’ll find out in time what went down, but it doesn’t look good.

 

[agricola]

If he was ordered not to go in I will withdraw my comment calling him a coward. I would have thought that might have come out by now though

That the radio transcripts haven't yet come out is unusual, as unusual as the Sheriff saying (when condemning the cop) that he couldn't believe the cop acted like that after watching the CCTV (ie: not after reading his statement, talking to him, reading or listening to the radio traffic from the incident or reading the summary of what had happened that they must have prepared for him).

 

[binka]

That the radio transcripts haven't yet come out is unusual, as unusual as the Sheriff saying (when condemning the cop) that he couldn't believe the cop acted like that after watching the CCTV (ie: not after reading his statement, talking to him, reading or listening to the radio traffic from the incident or reading the summary of what had happened that they must have prepared for him).

If I had been ordered not to enter and then was hung out to dry by those who made that order I wouldn't be keeping quiet about it

 

[agricola]

If I had been ordered not to enter and then was hung out to dry by those who made that order I wouldn't be keeping quiet about it

You might be if they were the ones paying your pension, and protecting your house from the mob they raised.

 

[editor]

I bet the NRA are lending their full shitty weight to the theory that it's all the cop's fault.

 

[dylanredefined]

Referred to this earlier- plenty of ex squaddies and probably serving cops here( lolz) - how would a single person intervention like this, several minutes before the rest of the squad turned up be viewed afterwards ?

Bear in mind this was not Lewis Collins at the scene

If he wins hero. If he loses arsehole. We don't really train for one on one scenarios.
Storming a building is normally a group activity

 

[binka]

You might be if they were the ones paying your pension, and protecting your house from the mob they raised.

So you think its possible he's pretty much been told to take the fall for this?

 

[agricola]

So you think its possible he's pretty much been told to take the fall for this?

That department had more than twenty previous interactions with Cruz and had apparently been told at least twice he wanted to shoot up the school, and what happened with him directly contradicts the theory that the NRA, its politicians and now Trump have been peddling.

In short someone is getting the blame for this, and he is the one that can't afford a PR campaign or decent lawyers.

 

[binka]

That department had more than twenty previous interactions with Cruz and had apparently been told at least twice he wanted to shoot up the school, and what happened with him directly contradicts the theory that the NRA, its politicians and now Trump have been peddling.

In short someone is getting the blame for this, and he is the one that can't afford a PR campaign or decent lawyers.

He doesn't need money to say "I was ordered to stay outside"

 

[Pickman's model]

He doesn't need money to say "I was ordered to stay outside"

He won't get money if he says that

 

[binka]

He won't get money if he says that

Can you elaborate on that?

 

[Pickman's model]

If I had been ordered not to enter and then was hung out to dry by those who made that order I wouldn't be keeping quiet about it

Yeh right

 

[Pickman's model]

Can you elaborate on that?

Yes

 

[binka]

Nice one pickmans

 

[agricola]

He doesn't need money to say "I was ordered to stay outside"

He doesn't, but they pay his pension and you assume that the media would accurately describe things if that is what happened (as opposed to "I was only following orders" says cop who hid).

 

[binka]

He doesn't, but they pay his pension and you assume that the media would accurately describe things if that is what happened (as opposed to "I was only following orders" says cop who hid).

Can they take his pension away if he doesn't keep quiet?

 

[Pickman's model]

Nice one pickmans

Yes, I can elaborate on it - if yer man's been told to take the fall it could have been made clear there are financial implications to rocking the boat.

 

[Yossarian]

Peterson's issued a statement, saying he was following his training:

Peterson said the initial report was of firecrackers, not gunshots, in the 1200 building, where the killer was shooting his victims. When he reached the building, he heard gunshots, but “believed that those gunshots were originating from outside of any of the buildings on the school campus,” the statement said, in a quotation attributed to Peterson.

In the event of outdoor gunshots, sheriff’s office training calls for deputies to “seek cover and assess the situation in order to communicate what one observes to other law enforcement,” the statement said. “Consistent with his training, Mr. Peterson ‘took up a tactical position between the 700-800 buildings corridor/corner."

He was the first sheriff’s office to advise BSO dispatch of shots fired and he initiated that code red that locked down the entire campus.

School deputy fights back after resigning over shooting

 

[binka]

Yes, I can elaborate on it - if yer man's been told to take the fall it could have been made clear there are financial implications to rocking the boat.

Nice conspiracy you have there

 

[agricola]

Can they take his pension away if he doesn't keep quiet?

No idea, but there are usually provisions in place to stop / reclaim pensions if bad behaviour comes to light.

 

[Pickman's model]

Nice conspiracy you have there

You clearly don't do comprehension.

 

[Pickman's model]

No idea, but there are usually provisions in place to stop / reclaim pensions if bad behaviour comes to light.

gross misconduct, however construed, for example

 

[editor]

Peterson's issued a statement, saying he was following his training:


School deputy fights back after resigning over shooting

So not a coward at all them but merely following hisa training. I feel sorry for the bloke. Even if he had fucked up, to have a blustering shithead of a president try to turn the entire nation against you by blaming you for the actions of a nutcase laden with NRA approved weapons is despicable.

 

[scifisam]

Peterson's issued a statement, saying he was following his training:


School deputy fights back after resigning over shooting

That sounds very believable to me.