TfL denied Uber operator license, ride hailing service wins on appeal (Sept 2020)

[not-bono-ever]

Black cab drivers praise for mayor of London over Uber decision

Well yes, but is there any backup for the existance of some kind of black cab interfering here ?

 

[cupid_stunt]

what is blatant ?

I wouldn't hold out for a straight answer on that one.

That poster claimed TfL 'runs the black cabs', rather than just licence them, his evidence for this is something to do with black cab drivers using the TfL cafe, fucking weird.

 

[killer b]

Guido says this is evidence of Khan being in the pocket of the Taxi unions, so they're in good company calling shenanigans here.

 

[Guineveretoo]

I don't really get the comparison between Uber and black cabs, were they really in competition all that much? Of the few people I know who use Uber none of them ever got black cabs, couldn't afford them plus even these days you only see the odd one down SE.

East Croydon station.

There used to be queues for the black cabs, particularly at night time. People, including me, would pay for a black cab because of the convenience and (relative) safety of doing so. To be honest, it was one of the things that attracted me to my house - that East Croydon station is open all night and has black cabs outside it.

These days, most people walk past the queuing black cabs to get to the pick up point where their uber car is.

 

[Guineveretoo]

I just feel strongly that more people should use the bus, to ensure the service continues. Bus services in London are great. You don't know how lucky you are to have a decent bus service.

Unfortunately, I don't have a decent bus service in my part of London, although I do catch the bus when I can.

But your point is well made, as this is not true for most of London

 

[Guineveretoo]

i was in a black cab couple of weeks ago (please do not shout at me this is not my usual way of getting around town). Asked the driver how's business, expecting him to say things were a bit shit and instead he said never been better, how he thinks his is the best job in the world, he was playing golf that morning had a leisurely lunch etc.
He said that uber was a bit of a wobble when it was new but not an issue anymore far as he can tell, he said people have started using black cabs again at the same levels they were before the novelty of uber appeared . That's just one bloke's take on it though obvs.

I guess in central London, people like to walk out and flag a cab, and are either rich or on expenses (or both) so happy with the cost.

 

[UrbaneFox]

Every driver has told me the opposite. If they feel like working for just 20 mins, they can.

I was told this by a driver in Leeds. Pah.

 

[agricola]

Guido says this is evidence of Khan being in the pocket of the Taxi unions, so they're in good company calling shenanigans here.

Guido, whose extreme pro-Uber stance was no doubt entirely on ethical grounds.

 

[cupid_stunt]

At the end of the day, it will all come out during the court appeal, but clearly there's some very serious concerns about how Uber operates in London, including how medical & criminal record reports are obtained, and more worrying the claims about them not reporting serious criminal offences.

The Met investigating a new claim of rape or sexual assault by a Uber driver on average every 11 days, is something that particularly stands out to me.

 

[Reiabuzz]

“In the coming weeks Uber will no doubt throw all its legal and corporate lobbying might to overturn this decision. We would urge the mayor of London and Transport for London to stand firm and continue to stand up for the safety of Londoners and the capital’s trusted cabbies.”

 

[tim]

Yep, and you'll have to wait ages for one, then it'll be full of screaming kids & you'll end up sat next to old chap smelling of wee who asks you to be his friend.

Back to the good old days for you!

He is that old man. It just means increased olfactory misery for the rest of us, and at least the uber driver was paid for having to listen to him.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Serious concerns raised by the police, invalid DBS checks & falsified medical certificates, any comments Reiabuzz?

Uber has repeatedly come under fire for its handling of allegations of sexual assault by its drivers against passengers.

Freedom of Information data obtained by The Sun last year showed that the Metropolitan Police investigated 32 drivers for rape or sexual assault of a passenger between May 2015 and May 2016.

In August, Metropolitan Police Inspector Neil Billany wrote to TfL about his concern that the company was failing to properly investigate allegations against its drivers.

He revealed the company had continued to employ a driver after he was accused of sexual assault. According to Inspector Billany, the same driver went on to assault another female passenger before he was removed.

The letter said: "By not reporting to police promptly, Uber are allowing situations to develop that clearly affect the safety and security of the public."

DBS checks and medical records
This month, TfL informed Uber that background checks on thousands of its drivers were invalid. The drivers were given 28 days to reapply for the procedure, or risk losing their licence.

In a separate controversy over the vetting of its employees, The Sun revealed Uber drivers were able to obtain falsified medical certificates which gave them the all-clear for service.

The scandal that brought Uber down

 

[Teaboy]

So, 40,000 people out of work if these fuckers get away with it. Which is highly unlikely once it's put in front of an independent body. No idea how anybody could support this decision.

Yeah, rules around safety are tiresome and get in the way of business. Just ask the residents of Grenfell.

 

[Guineveretoo]

The leasing side of it is huge but in turnover terms a back of a fag packet calculation suggests in London it's equivalent to about 15-20% of Uber's turnover and the turnover from leasing is lower than Uber's cut of the fare money. And that would be if every Uber driver leased, which they don't.

Unfortunately, the private hire firm nearest to me flouts the regulations in a frightening way, including cars which are not fit to be on the road, and drivers who are not licensed.

Another private hire firm I used late at night (just before I caved in and got an Uber account) left two disabled women stranded at a railway station, despite us having booked a cab to meet the train. One of those women was injured, having fallen down the stairs trying to catch the train. The firm just kept telling us that the cab was "on its way" and that it would be "a few minutes". We were there for 45 minutes.

Found out later that there had been a stabbing very near where we were, that same evening.

When I phoned up to complain, and asked to speak to the manager, he just kept telling me there was nothing he could do, because their system had told them that the cab was a few minutes away.

That was the last time I used a local private hire company. After that, I swallowed my principles and tried Uber and have had no such problems with them since.

Because of those principles, I always ask the driver what it is like working for Uber, and have always had positive feedback.

 

[Guineveretoo]

And presumably all the licensing stuff and lack of background checks on drivers is irrelevant?

I don't really mind either way but we spend a lot of time on this site complaining how shyster companies just trample over laws, tax laws etc, yet here we have an authority doing what they are supposed to do and actually standing up to a mega corporate beast yet its a "ridiculous decision". Bit odd unless I've missed something.

I would feel a lot happier about TfL if they were to cancel the licences of some of the private hire companies who blatantly breach the rules and regulations.

 

[cupid_stunt]

When I phoned up to complain, and asked to speak to the manager, he just kept telling me there was nothing he could do, because their system had told them that the cab was a few minutes away.

But, did you complain to TfL?

I would feel a lot happier about TfL if they were to cancel the licences of some of the private hire companies who blatantly breach the rules and regulations.

They would need complaints to investigate.

 

[redsquirrel]

Guido says this is evidence of Khan being in the pocket of the Taxi unions, so they're in good company calling shenanigans here.

What else can you expect from LibDem filth.

 

[agricola]

At the end of the day, it will all come out during the court appeal, but clearly there's some very serious concerns about how Uber operates in London, including how medical & criminal record reports are obtained, and more worrying the claims about them not reporting serious criminal offences.

The Met investigating a new claim of rape or sexual assault by a Uber driver on average every 11 days, is something that particularly stands out to me.

TBH the worrying thing about this is what they don't mention - the fact that Uber's employment model has been found to be illegal and the fact that it pays very little tax. A cynical mind would think that all the reasons given are things that could be "fixed" relatively quickly and with a minimum of fuss.

 

[Guineveretoo]

But, did you complain to TfL?



They would need complaints to investigate.

No, I didn't complain to TfL - both of us felt upset and frustrated that there was no-one to complain to.

If I am forced to go back to using the private hire firm who uses illegal drivers and cars not fit to be on the road, then I will complain to TfL, now that it has been suggested.

 

[Guineveretoo]

TBH the worrying thing about this is what they don't mention - the fact that Uber's employment model has been found to be illegal and the fact that it pays very little tax. A cynical mind would think that all the reasons given are things that could be "fixed" relatively quickly and with a minimum of fuss.

I agree that this needs resolving, but not just for Uber. And it is not going to be fixed by shutting it down.

 

[Maharani]

Uber is infinitely cheaper than fucking black cabs who I have nothing but contempt from the days when they'd ignore their own rules and refuse to drive me to Brixton.

And I keep hearing from my black and brown brothers and sisters black cabs don't pick us up. I never use them so wouldn't know. I hate black cabs.

 

[cupid_stunt]

TBH the worrying thing about this is what they don't mention - the fact that Uber's employment model has been found to be illegal and the fact that it pays very little tax. A cynical mind would think that all the reasons given are things that could be "fixed" relatively quickly and with a minimum of fuss.

TBF, Uber is appealing the ruling over the employment model, so that's not settled yet. And, them pushing revenue via Holland for tax dodging purposes would appear to be legal, although clearly shouldn't be.

 

[Maharani]

So does that mean we can't ride in Uber's from now?????

 

[redsquirrel]

I agree that this needs resolving, but not just for Uber. And it is not going to be fixed by shutting it down.

And what about it's anti-unionism? Is that not a good reason to shut it down?

(Not that it actually is being shut down, unfortunately)

 

[Maharani]

Obviously not. My app is active.

 

[Maharani]

Will this mean other companies like uber will now get a look in?

 

[cupid_stunt]

So does that mean we can't ride in Uber's from now?????

Their licence runs out on the 30th Sept., but they are appealing, and will be allowed to continue to operate whilst the appeal is being dealt with.

 

[Guineveretoo]

And I keep hearing from my black and brown brothers and sisters black cabs don't pick us up. I never use them so wouldn't know. I hate black cabs.

The only time I have ever heard someone saying "I am not racist but..." before coming out with lots of racist shit, was in the back of a black cab!

I was even told, by a black cab driver, that a nice white woman like me probably shouldn't move to the house I am currently living in!!

So yeah, black cabs are shit for many reasons.

 

[Teaboy]

It seems fairly obvious to me that tfl and the mayor would want uber. London needs a mixed transport model and uber has also pretty much killed the illegal / unlicensed cab (just about anyway), and they were responsible for some appalling sexual assault stats.

Of course these is also the money, someone said up thread it would amount to around £3m which is equivalent to the grant that tfl gets from Central London to run the tube, so a decent amount of money.

Its just uber being such shifty fuckers that even with all this tfl have decided something has got to change. It shows how fucked-up uber have been. All these people who are calling conspiracy and the like are just mad fuckers really.

 

[maomao]

Unfortunately, the private hire firm nearest to me flouts the regulations in a frightening way, including cars which are not fit to be on the road, and drivers who are not licensed.

Another private hire firm I used late at night (just before I caved in and got an Uber account) left two disabled women stranded at a railway station, despite us having booked a cab to meet the train. One of those women was injured, having fallen down the stairs trying to catch the train. The firm just kept telling us that the cab was "on its way" and that it would be "a few minutes". We were there for 45 minutes.

Found out later that there had been a stabbing very near where we were, that same evening.

When I phoned up to complain, and asked to speak to the manager, he just kept telling me there was nothing he could do, because their system had told them that the cab was a few minutes away.

That was the last time I used a local private hire company. After that, I swallowed my principles and tried Uber and have had no such problems with them since.

Because of those principles, I always ask the driver what it is like working for Uber, and have always had positive feedback.

Would love to know what company this is. Just for gossip value. You should really be reporting the use of unlicensed drivers yourself though.