Purnell: more attacks on the unemployed, etc

[FridgeMagnet]

Lenin's Tomb had a good old go at Hari - http://leninology.blogspot.com/2008/07/why-dont-they-simply-bring-back.html

Also, if I hear one more patronising cunt on the radio telling us how jobs cure depression and so this is all really _healthy_ for people I shall kill someone. Having no money can make you depressed; feeling pointless and worthless can make you depressed. A job sometimes helps on these points (though with the latter one it can make it worse) but I tell you what, being stuck on community service isn't going to help either.

 

[The Black Hand]

Lenin's Tomb had a good old go at Hari - http://leninology.blogspot.com/2008/07/why-dont-they-simply-bring-back.html

Also, if I hear one more patronising cunt on the radio telling us how jobs cure depression and so this is all really _healthy_ for people I shall kill someone. Having no money can make you depressed; feeling pointless and worthless can make you depressed. A job sometimes helps on these points (though with the latter one it can make it worse) but I tell you what, being stuck on community service isn't going to help either.

Yup.

 

[The Black Hand]

Well i dunno how but I'VE been allowed to put another comment on the Independant....and it's good to see that 95percent of posts are common sense. I think they will lose a lot of readers over this Tory scum editorial

Good.

 

[jiggajagga]

Lenin's Tomb had a good old go at Hari - http://leninology.blogspot.com/2008/07/why-dont-they-simply-bring-back.html

Also, if I hear one more patronising cunt on the radio telling us how jobs cure depression and so this is all really _healthy_ for people I shall kill someone. Having no money can make you depressed; feeling pointless and worthless can make you depressed. A job sometimes helps on these points (though with the latter one it can make it worse) but I tell you what, being stuck on community service isn't going to help either.

If we could all get patronising cunt jobs like they have on £50,000 a year I might agree. Standing in Mc Shites et al for 8 hrs a day should make anyone feel ill!!

 

[Alright]

I’d be interested in being matched to any job. How about if I list my pluses and minuses?

Pluses:
1. I can use a computer

Minuses:
1. Can’t work more than 16-hours per week
2. Can’t always guarantee I can get into work on a given day
3. Unable to give more than an hour or so notice when absent
4. Unable to make hours up through flexible working as am too physically wrecked on days I come in late
5. Can’t do lifting
6. Can’t do carrying
7. Can’t do standing
8. Can’t work in an environment that depends on the use of stairs
9. Can’t work in loud environments
10. Can’t do tele sales due to speech impairment
11. Need to use the toilet every 40-60 minutes
12. Will need a place to lie down when necessary
13. Can’t drive
14. Can’t operate machinery due to medication
15. Can’t concentrate due to severe pain
16. Can’t concentrate properly due to brain trauma
17. Undergo mood swings, so not suitable for ‘front of shop’ work
18. Not really a team person, see above
19. Would find retraining difficult due to all the above reasons

Apart from that, I’m game for any challenge. Any ideas anyone? Claims of there are hundreds of thousands of jobs out there don’t count as ideas – it’s a vague notion.

Nobody on this thread has come up with anything approximating a solution to my situation. Baldwin’s told me I can be accommodated within the system. Apparently, I could, despite having no qualifications or training, become a fund raiser; or, I could give disability advice over the phone – even though I’m extremely difficult to understand on the phone and have no training in disability advising.

Then, there is the question of earnings. Because I can only work 16-hours per week, I’d need to be paid between £20-25 per hour – which would put me on between £16-20k per annum. However, would my employer also pay me for the disability related time off? There may be an odd week when I could complete the 16-hours; however, on current form I’d struggle to put in 10-hours per week; yet, I could not live on 10-hours pay per week.

Hi Urbanblues. Just read your post. I can't even begin to imagine the hell you must be in. All I want to say is that I honestly can't believe that any government agency or agent would even dream of trying to put you in a job which you didn't want. Surely no other poster could believe otherwise?

No-one in the government can possibly believe that 100% employment is achievable. To take it to the blackest conclusion, you'd then have the JobCentre Outreachers knocking on the hospice door.

 

[Alright]

This post NOT aimed at Urbanblues, but a general comment to the thread:

The percentage difference between unemployed and vacancies decreases as the unemployed fill the vacancies.

In essence, what happens is that, when companies with vacancies fill those vacancies, the companies ramp up production, thus creating vacancies with suppliers, and the suppliers' suppliers.

 

[The Black Hand]

Lenin's Tomb had a good old go at Hari - http://leninology.blogspot.com/2008/07/why-dont-they-simply-bring-back.html

Great article which destroys Labour luvvies.

 

[shagnasty]

Excellent article .as for the idea of production increase causing more work for suppliers unless you have not noticed a million manufacturing jobs have been lost under labour.components are coming in from overseas leaving nothing but assembly to get a made in uk tag

 

[ViolentPanda]

Hi Urbanblues. Just read your post. I can't even begin to imagine the hell you must be in. All I want to say is that I honestly can't believe that any government agency or agent would even dream of trying to put you in a job which you didn't want. Surely no other poster could believe otherwise?

Problem is that people like myself and Urbanblues, who have complex "disabilities" and attendant health problems, do get hassled by "government agencies", even though I (and I suspect UB does too) qualify for the highest rates of Disability Living Allowance (which means, by the govt's own measures, I'm so fucked I don't actually have to renew my claim for Incapacity Benefit when it lapses, it's automatically renewed.
If the government were offering a SERVICE to disabled and long-term sick people that aimed to help them find employment (if that's what they wanted) that suited their particular abilities, then I'd be all for it, but as it is, we're talking about a set of practices that will shoehorn people into unsuitable employment purely to get them off the radar.

No-one in the government can possibly believe that 100% employment is achievable. To take it to the blackest conclusion, you'd then have the JobCentre Outreachers knocking on the hospice door.

Well, there have been cases in just about every region now, of people with terminal illnesses who receive DLA at the "terminal illness" rate, being told to go to their local JC+ for a "back to work" interview, so sending out people to hospices wouldn't be that much of a step.

 

[trevhagl]

Problem is that people like myself and Urbanblues, who have complex "disabilities" and attendant health problems, do get hassled by "government agencies", even though I (and I suspect UB does too) qualify for the highest rates of Disability Living Allowance (which means, by the govt's own measures, I'm so fucked I don't actually have to renew my claim for Incapacity Benefit when it lapses, it's automatically renewed.
If the government were offering a SERVICE to disabled and long-term sick people that aimed to help them find employment (if that's what they wanted) that suited their particular abilities, then I'd be all for it, but as it is, we're talking about a set of practices that will shoehorn people into unsuitable employment purely to get them off the radar.

Well, there have been cases in just about every region now, of people with terminal illnesses who receive DLA at the "terminal illness" rate, being told to go to their local JC+ for a "back to work" interview, so sending out people to hospices wouldn't be that much of a step.

The Tory types on here probably don't even realise this, they think you are making it up. I met someone the other day who is an alkie and the incapacity medical doctor even gave him 2 points for needing a drink before midday - and then they stopped his money, saying he's fit for work!! It's already madness
so i dread to think what will happen after the fascist reforms

 

[The Black Hand]

The Tory types on here probably don't even realise this, they think you are making it up. I met someone the other day who is an alkie and the incapacity medical doctor even gave him 2 points for needing a drink before midday - and then they stopped his money, saying he's fit for work!! It's already madness
so i dread to think what will happen after the fascist reforms

Yes its shit. Sorry to hear that Panda.

Can we start an U75 campaign group against these changes? I elect Panda as Chair and you can call the first thread if you want to start it off. The U75 Anti Welfare Cuts thread or something like that - get it on a sticky.

 

[FridgeMagnet]

I thought "I honestly can't believe that any government agency or agent would even dream of trying to put you in a job which you didn't want. Surely no other poster could believe otherwise?" was sarcasm myself....

 

[_angel_]

Problem is that people like myself and Urbanblues, who have complex "disabilities" and attendant health problems, do get hassled by "government agencies", even though I (and I suspect UB does too) qualify for the highest rates of Disability Living Allowance (which means, by the govt's own measures, I'm so fucked I don't actually have to renew my claim for Incapacity Benefit when it lapses, it's automatically renewed.
If the government were offering a SERVICE to disabled and long-term sick people that aimed to help them find employment (if that's what they wanted) that suited their particular abilities, then I'd be all for it, but as it is, we're talking about a set of practices that will shoehorn people into unsuitable employment purely to get them off the radar.

Well, there have been cases in just about every region now, of people with terminal illnesses who receive DLA at the "terminal illness" rate, being told to go to their local JC+ for a "back to work" interview, so sending out people to hospices wouldn't be that much of a step.

That's madness. Like those bastards who sent Jane Tomlinson hate letters for, er, not being dead quick enough.

 

[trevhagl]

Who's Jane Tomlinson?

 

[treelover]

Apparently A Significant Part Of The Glasgow East Voting Backlash Was Because Of The Welfare Reforms, Specifically, Welfare To Work As G/east Is To Be A Pilot Area.

 

[DotCommunist]

When Broon can't even hold a seat as safe as GE it's a sign just how fucked nulab are

 

[trevhagl]

Oh so did they lose it? GREAT!!!

 

[DotCommunist]

Oh so did they lose it? GREAT!!!

http://www.sundayherald.com/news/heraldnews/display.var.2409355.0.0.php

 

[trevhagl]

Thats great but how laughable are Dave Camerons comments? I mean the reason New Labour lost is because they ARE the Tory Party!!!

 

[ViolentPanda]

The Tory types on here probably don't even realise this, they think you are making it up.

Mostly because they don't realise just how fucked up you have to be to qualify for disability benefits, and because the less than one percent fraud doesn't get headlines, but individual cases do.

I met someone the other day who is an alkie and the incapacity medical doctor even gave him 2 points for needing a drink before midday - and then they stopped his money, saying he's fit for work!! It's already madness.

People are judgemental fucks, they assume that alcoholism is entirely down to the individual, and never bother to take into account stuff like genetic predisposition to addiction etc.
Personally, I'd much rather give an alcoholic £100 a week to stay at home and either drink themselves to oblivion or sober up, than force them into work and risk the harm to themselves and others that would likely result.

so i dread to think what will happen after the fascist reforms

I'm expecting something similar to New York city in the early 90s, loads of people with mental health problems living on the streets and begging.

...and dying in droves come winter, of course.

 

[The Black Hand]

Panda - what say you to this? "Can we start an U75 campaign group against these changes? I elect Panda as Chair and you can call the first thread if you want to start it off. The U75 Anti Welfare Cuts thread or something like that - get it on a sticky."

 

[ViolentPanda]

Yes its shit. Sorry to hear that Panda.

No worries, that's life.

Can we start an U75 campaign group against these changes? I elect Panda as Chair and you can call the first thread if you want to start it off. The U75 Anti Welfare Cuts thread or something like that - get it on a sticky.

You need Treelover for that, much better organisational mind, and better contacts.

 

[Cressi]

Its Slave Labour now....its not nu ....their stupid New Deals never worked.Just an excuse to design new slogan, logos.......print and push nu posh 3 col print paper. Tons + tons of it. Dont they realise a pretty colored logo isnt going to con us anymore? DWP (Die or Work Posse)The paperpushers. As for Purnells outbursts. How can men be supposedly intelligent but so stupid?

 

[ViolentPanda]

I thought "I honestly can't believe that any government agency or agent would even dream of trying to put you in a job which you didn't want. Surely no other poster could believe otherwise?" was sarcasm myself....

You'd think so, wouldn't you, but...

 

[ViolentPanda]

That's madness. Like those bastards who sent Jane Tomlinson hate letters for, er, not being dead quick enough.

People can be utter shits, especially if they react rather than engage their brains.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Who's Jane Tomlinson?

Terminal cancer sufferer, raised loads of money for cancer research, managed to live longer than predicted and carried on raising money until almost the end.

 

[ViolentPanda]

Its Slave Labour now....its not nu ....their stupid New Deals never worked.Just an excuse to design new slogan, logos.......print and push nu posh 3 col print paper. Tons + tons of it. Dont they realise a pretty colored logo isnt going to con us anymore? DWP (Die or Work Posse)The paperpushers. As for Purnells outbursts. How can men be supposedly intelligent but so stupid?

Because they're ideologically-driven, and the ideology they follow isn't one based on what's right or good.
"New Labour" was supposed to be about transcending ideology, about "what works", but that has become an ideology in and of itself, especially as "what works" is about "what works for the market", not "what works to bring social justice".

 

[treelover]

I like this letter in the Guardian

If it is acceptable to employ an investment banker to redesign our welfare system, surely we could create new jobs for long-term benefit claimants to revise the financial rules of the City, and perhaps oversee the running of the banks, to ensure public interest is maintained.
David Lund
Winscombe, Somerset

 

[Cressi]

Well Ive found a possible job vacancy.....email from Number 10....Purnells webcast questions..........spelling mistakes....so they need a proof reader.

Ideology.......James has swapped the word 'work' for 'full time activity' therefore evading min wages......and this new word 'sanctioned'....sounding similar to sectioned....but meaning no income for up to 6 months. Sort of slow torture tactic.......starve or co operate.

He keeps on mentioning Wretched Tax Credits as if they worked ..........and finally Im very peeved......the CSA .....puff gone....+ mums can keep the maintenance.....now why didnt they do that in my day?????

 

[_angel_]

Well Ive found a possible job vacancy.....email from Number 10....Purnells webcast questions..........spelling mistakes....so they need a proof reader.

Ideology.......James has swapped the word 'work' for 'full time activity' therefore evading min wages......and this new word 'sanctioned'....sounding similar to sectioned....but meaning no income for up to 6 months. Sort of slow torture tactic.......starve or co operate.

He keeps on mentioning Wretched Tax Credits as if they worked ..........and finally Im very peeved......the CSA .....puff gone....+ mums can keep the maintenance.....now why didnt they do that in my day?????

If you could find your own 'fulltime activity'; rather than have a punishment activity foisted on you, it might not be asuch a bad thing. If they stop people taking the initiative and finding their own voluntary work, that's where I have the problem with it, and I have heard of job centre staff getting pissy about claimants volunteering as it means they're 'not available for work', so how does sweeping the streets fulltime fit in with that?

If this scheme had been in place 12 odd years ago where I volunteered for several weeks, they'd have stopped my chances of getting a job at all - eventually I was offered fulltime work as a result of volunteering.