Privileged people calling less privileged people "stupid" doesn't seem to be working...
- Thread starter chilango
- Start date
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I have seen 'special snowflake' used in a non-right context, taking the piss re the alienating result of the Oppression Olympics played by liberal members of the middle class who no matter the situation have to be the centre of attention, and in my view deliberately construct an exclusionary politics only they are fully qualified to understand and direct. As fucking usual.
Raheem
Well-Known Member
if you're gonna vote with them, may as well learn the lingo.
I first came across the term Remoaner on this forum, it has been used by many others on here, same for special snowflake.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
The proles know not what they do. They are in need of the correct political education.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
I wasn't talking specifically about his background. I first came across Remoaner on here, used by ItWillNeverWork.
seventh bullet
sovietwave
Maybe you need to step back from your police role for a while?
Just another one to be worked to death.
Just another one to be worked to death.
If you must know I'm a Marxist and my politics are communist. During the last election I voted TUSC.
Treacle Toes
Time
That the Right are using this term is one thing, your point that it's been used around here since Brexit by many leave voters is no
secret... It's all over here, as an insult.
gosub
~#
The Remoaner's are alright, we are leaving and they ain't best pleased. Its the Remainiacs, the ones who seem hell bent on undoing what happened in June, they are the problem, they are as dangerous and potentially damaging as the "full speed ahead and damn the torpedos" hard Brexiteers.
billy_bob
Air of bewilderment model's own
I agree with your wider point that the reaction to the Leave vote has exposed just how illiberal a lot of liberals are.
But the attitude summed up in these particular words is hypocritical too. The type of people who now say this kind of thing whenever anyone who voted Remain dares to refuse to just change their mind now that the vote's over -- for DECADES before they won this particular vote it's been impossible to read/see almost any media for more than a few minutes without some of them popping up to complain about how they were the silent majority whose voices were never listened to.
One of the interesting aspects of the Leave vote, I thought, was to see how the people who always talked like that would react once they'd explicitly got what they asked for in something this important. The reaction of quite a lot of them, it seems, is 'it's not enough that I got my way - I now demand that you agree with me about it and that I never have to hear another word of dissent on the subject'.
So overall I'm not sure either the 'winners' or the 'losers' are managing not to behave like spoilt brats about the whole thing.
billy_bob
Air of bewilderment model's own
"Hey! Ho! Let's not go!"
andysays
Love and solidarity
Gabba Gabba Stay!!!
in what way have they explicitly got what they wanted? we haven't left, for one thing, but more widely than that, exactly the kind of silencing that people complain of has taken place. Whatever the 'leave vote' was or might have become, after the initial shock there has been a rapid process of closing off. Whether that can hold together for too long remains to be seen, and the way things have played out so far has enabled it to be framed as 'remoaners' when it is part of a wider consensus across the remain and leave camps of the ruling class, but its easy to see why that resonates.
billy_bob
Air of bewilderment model's own
OK, 'ostensibly' would be a better word than 'explicitly'. And I did start the post you've partially quoted by suggesting that I agree that a big part of the 'rapid process of closing off' is 'liberals' showing their true colours.
In my experience the Leave voters putting across the 'remoaners... you lost... shut up and deal with it' line are generally not the Leave voters of the left who have sensible objections to the neo-liberal cabal of the EU, but the Leave voters who 'want their country back', with the murky combination of justifiable anger at their powerlessness, and less honourable scapegoating of minorities and insular nationalism, that that entails. And I don't agree those people have always been silenced - over the last couple of decades they've very often been able to find platforms to loudly claim that immigration is out of control, political correctness has gone mad, human rights is just about putting Bulgarians before 'our own', etc. And they've seen those views reflected in mainstream policy of both Labour and Tory govts (not obviously with any significant effect on the global order, but with very significant effects in terms of punitive approaches to, and reinforcing negative perceptions of, immigration, human rights, etc.)
Before I get shouted down for caricaturing the Leave camp I'll stress again that I have never tarred all Leave voters as 'thick racists' (and have fallen out with quite a number of supposedly PC right-on 'friends' who have done so since June), and even those who were motivated by bigotry or nationalism in voting Leave, in my view alongside those less pleasant motivations generally still have reasonable complaints about the results of globalisation/neo-liberalism which, as I think you're alluding to, haven't been heeded.
Hope that's a bit more nuanced
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
I wanna be buried in an EU cemetery
The gap between what has 'ostensibly' happened and what has actually happened is kind of key though, isn't it? Ostensibly, the people have spoken and their voices have been heard. Ostensibly Theresa May and co are listening to us now, just like Cameron's 'workers party' was. We know that hasn't happened, they know it hasn't happened. In the same way that anti immigrant policies by the state are specifically intended not to address people's greivances but to keep them alive and make them useful - that's not really being listened to or having a voice.OK, 'ostensibly' would be a better word than 'explicitly'. And I did start the post you've partially quoted by suggesting that I agree that a big part of the 'rapid process of closing off' is 'liberals' showing their true colours.
In my experience the Leave voters putting across the 'remoaners... you lost... shut up and deal with it' line are generally not the Leave voters of the left who have sensible objections to the neo-liberal cabal of the EU, but the Leave voters who 'want their country back', with the murky combination of justifiable anger at their powerlessness, and less honourable scapegoating of minorities and insular nationalism, that that entails. And I don't agree those people have always been silenced - over the last couple of decades they've very often been able to find platforms to loudly claim that immigration is out of control, political correctness has gone mad, human rights is just about putting Bulgarians before 'our own', etc. And they've seen those views reflected in mainstream policy of both Labour and Tory govts (not obviously with any significant effect on the global order, but with very significant effects in terms of punitive approaches to, and reinforcing negative perceptions of, immigration, human rights, etc.)
Before I get shouted down for caricaturing the Leave camp I'll stress again that I have never tarred all Leave voters as 'thick racists' (and have fallen out with quite a number of supposedly PC right-on 'friends' who have done so since June), and even those who were motivated by bigotry or nationalism in voting Leave, in my view alongside those less pleasant motivations generally still have reasonable complaints about the results of globalisation/neo-liberalism which, as I think you're alluding to, haven't been heeded.
Hope that's a bit more nuanced
We can generally say these complaints about PC and all that have a basis in the reality of people's experience which is why they are so resilient against the deluge of liberal 'facts' etc, but does the fact that the bourgeois media such as the Mail use elements of this experience, narrows it down, and repurposes it, really mean we can say ordinary people have a voice there? The closing off is to take what can be made use of for capital and erase what is threatening to it.
I'm not sure how much we're actually disagreeing on this, but thought it worth emphasising at least.
Idaho
blah blah blah
Once again, random use of the term "liberal" creates confusion. Americans and the Internet.... The proto alt right of the early Internet made the term popular as a pejorative to describe socially liberal, economic centrists in America. The fringe left in the UK, wanting to distance themselves from the British centre left, eagerly adopted the term.
Consequently it now makes only vague sense (an ideal fit for the fringe left). Especially when suddenly the centre left are supposed to justify their "liberal" credentials. In the context of the referendum, it doesn't help anyones understanding.
Capital punishment would be a better example of the hypocrisy/paradox. Centrists have long opposed it, while upholding a belief in democracy (capital punishment being clearly popular).
As for coining a new term "remoaner".. What is the point other than to create a slogan to troll with? There's no intellectual content. It illuminates nothing and takes the discussion nowhere. It's the political equivalent of writing band names on the front of your exercise book.
Consequently it now makes only vague sense (an ideal fit for the fringe left). Especially when suddenly the centre left are supposed to justify their "liberal" credentials. In the context of the referendum, it doesn't help anyones understanding.
Capital punishment would be a better example of the hypocrisy/paradox. Centrists have long opposed it, while upholding a belief in democracy (capital punishment being clearly popular).
As for coining a new term "remoaner".. What is the point other than to create a slogan to troll with? There's no intellectual content. It illuminates nothing and takes the discussion nowhere. It's the political equivalent of writing band names on the front of your exercise book.
billy_bob
Air of bewilderment model's own
What has actually happened so far, anyway. My view is still (for now) that we will, eventually, leave. People who wanted to leave will get what they wanted in that sense - although whether by doing so they'll achieve what they imagined they'd achieve is a different matter.
rekil
to menny cranks
Unfortunately there's no stoppin' the cretins from votin'
Wilf
Slouching towards Billingham
Similar threads
