PM Boris Johnson - monster thread for a monster twat

[two sheds]

They replaced Blair with a mindless zombie automaton half way through. Well that's the rumour anyway.

 

[andysays]

And if he wins, under the current rules he can't be challenged for a year, so they will change the rules.

BTW - I haven't checked this, but is it a uniquely Tory thing to change their leader when in govt? I can't think offhand of Labour ever doing it, though obvs they haven't been in office so many times.

I can remember twice (Wilson and Blair) when a Labour PM resigned as leader mid-term and was replaced, but not when one was voted out.

 

[kabbes]

9 months ago:

Boris Johnson ‘wants to be PM for longer than Thatcher’

Conservative leader ‘plans to shape next election around Brexit’ to defeat Labour

www.independent.co.uk

 

[philosophical]

I suppose the hand gestures could be
The traditional ‘V’ sign.
The finger.
The wanker sign.

I reckon it was the finger.

 

[killer b]

And if he wins, under the current rules he can't be challenged for a year, so they will change the rules.

BTW - I haven't checked this, but is it a uniquely Tory thing to change their leader when in govt? I can't think offhand of Labour ever doing it, though obvs they haven't been in office so many times.

didn't Blair essentially go under duress?

 

[billy_bob]

didn't Blair essentially go under duress?

I don't think so? He'd said ahead of time he'd go at a certain point during that third term - I remember some grumbling at the time that it wasn't very democratic to decide in advance that he'd just be handing the premiership over to someone else.

 

[billy_bob]

didn't Blair essentially go under duress?

Also, wow - second conversation I've had here in two days where we've been talking about the Blair years as if they're way back in the mists of time and we can't remember the detail.

 

[bluescreen]

I don't think so? He'd said ahead of time he'd go at a certain point during that third term - I remember some grumbling at the time that it wasn't very democratic to decide in advance that he'd just be handing the premiership over to someone else.

Well, it isn't very democratic, is it? In the present case if Johnson loses, 200,000 Tories get to choose the next prime minister - subject only to the sifting down to two candidates by the current Tory MPS.

ETA - at least in Blair's case people knew in advance who he'd be handing over to.

 

[kabbes]

Also, wow - second conversation I've had here in two days where we've been talking about the Blair years as if they're way back in the mists of time and we can't remember the detail.

I doubt that current sixth-formers have any memory of Tony Blair as prime minister. Probably not even anyone under 21. That’s my definition of it being the olden days.

 

[flypanam]

I think de Pissall will scrape the vote. I think some tories might think of the damage he could do from the backbenches if they vote him down.

 

[steveseagull]

I suppose the hand gestures could be
The traditional ‘V’ sign.
The finger.
The wanker sign.

I reckon it was the finger.

Agree. if you are doing the wanker sign to more than one person, you have to do it with both hands to make it plural. My money is on the reverse middle finger.

 

[cupid_stunt]

I read this headline, and immediately concluded what a dumb thing to come out with, even if he wins the party is clearly not going to be united, so not surprised the Guardian writer concluded the same.

Johnson tells Tories they are unbeatable if they are 'united and focused on issues that matter'​

Boris Johnson welcomes the chance to make his case to MPs, Downing Street claims. In a statement a No 10 spokesperson said: "Tonight is a chance to end months of speculation and allow the government to draw a line and move on, delivering on the people’s priorities. The PM welcomes the opportunity to make his case to MPs and will remind them that when they’re united and focused on the issues that matter to voters there is no more formidable political force."

That final sentence is ambiguous. Is Johnson saying that there is no more formidable political force than himself, when the party is behind him, or no more formidable political force than a united Conservative party focused on the issues that matter?

His problem is that, no matter what the outcome of the ballot is tonight, it will not show that the party is united. LINK

 

[andysays]

And if he wins, under the current rules he can't be challenged for a year, so they will change the rules.

BTW - I haven't checked this, but is it a uniquely Tory thing to change their leader when in govt? I can't think offhand of Labour ever doing it, though obvs they haven't been in office so many times.

And unless I've forgotten someone, it's actually only Thatcher* who was deposed as PM by being voted out by their own MPs.

Major lost a GE and Cameron chose to resign after losing the Brexit referendum.

May won her VoNC, and then resigned six months or so later.

* so far, obviously...

 

[billy_bob]

I doubt that current sixth-formers have any memory of Tony Blair as prime minister. Probably not even anyone under 21. That’s my definition of it being the olden days.

Quite a hardline definition, if anyone over 21 is past it! Anyway, I'm well older than that innit and I assume killer b is too, and what struck me was that it's long enough ago that people like us, who were already adults in Blair's prime, are a bit sketchy on some of the detail.

 

[platinumsage]

I think de Pissall will scrape the vote. I think some tories might think of the damage he could do from the backbenches if they vote him down.

He won't do any damage from the back benches, he would have no interest in continuing to play the MP game and would only be thinking about how to maximize his income.

 

[billy_bob]

Well, it isn't very democratic, is it? In the present case if Johnson loses, 200,000 Tories get to choose the next prime minister - subject only to the sifting down to two candidates by the current Tory MPS.

ETA - at least in Blair's case people knew in advance who he'd be handing over to.

It's not, no. And it's coming back to me that Blair did actually announce the planned departure before that third GE, so people knew it not only in advance but before voting him in.

 

[billy_bob]

He won't do any damage from the back benches, he would have no interest in continuing to play the MP game and would only be thinking about how to maximize his income.

I think he'd quit PDQ, wouldn't he. It was only worth being there on the way up to the fancy PM chair.

 

[kabbes]

Quite a hardline definition, if anyone over 21 is past it! Anyway, I'm well older than that innit and I assume killer b is too, and what struck me was that it's long enough ago that people like us, who were already adults in Blair's prime, are a bit sketchy on some of the detail.

Not that people over 21 are past it. More that if nobody in the most recent two-ish generations has any memory of something, that something is definitely now not a recent thing.

 

[billy_bob]

Not that people over 21 are past it. More that if nobody in the most recent two-ish generations has any memory of something, that something is definitely now not a recent thing.

Look, I'm just trying not to admit I'm heading into the second half of middle-aged, OK

 

[cupid_stunt]

And unless I've forgotten someone, it's actually only Thatcher* who was deposed as PM by being voted out by their own MPs.

She wasn't voted out, she won the first round, and declared her intention to fight on in the second round, her cabinet persuaded her to withdraw.

 

[andysays]

She wasn't voted out, she won the first round, and declared her intention to fight on in the second round, her cabinet persuaded her to withdraw.

Yeah, you're right.

So in fact none of the Tory PMs have been voted out by their own MPs - maybe Johnson can be the first

 

[billy_bob]

I think I'm right in saying that Johnson has beaten Brown already in length of tenure, but if he goes soon he could come in behind Neville Chamberlain and Theresa May.

 

[cupid_stunt]

Yeah, you're right.

So in fact none of the Tory PMs have been voted out by their own MPs - maybe Johnson can be the first

That's the reason I've concluded I want him to lose, despite seeing the appeal of him just winning and carrying on mortally wounded, he would be absolutely devastated, it would be so bloody funny.

 

[Dystopiary]

I reckon with all those parties, he's got some serious juice on a load of them, that's why they've been reluctant to send letters in.

 

[Supine]

That's the reason I've concluded I want him to lose, despite seeing the appeal of him just winning and carrying on mortally wounded, he would be absolutely devastated, it would be so bloody funny.

Until he gets the sweetener. A knighthood.

 

[dessiato]

For those of us not in the UK, where can we watch the proceedings this afternoon? I'd love to be witness to it.

 

[platinumsage]

I think I'm right in saying that Johnson has beaten Brown already in length of tenure, but if he goes soon he could come in behind Neville Chamberlain and Theresa May.

He won't beat Brown until Wednesday!

 

[cupid_stunt]

For those of us not in the UK, where can we watch the proceedings this afternoon? I'd love to be witness to it.

The vote is between 6 & 8pm tonight, with the result soon after.

Sky News on youtube will probably be the best for you.

 

[dessiato]

The vote is between 6 & 8pm tonight, with the result soon after.

Sky News on youtube will probably be the best for you.

I'm quite excited to see it. I have to do a lot of revision for tomorrow, but I'll break for this. The conversation part of my exam, I think, might just revolve around British political history.

 

[Elpenor]

That's got more substance to it than the letter that was circulating anonymously (complaining about all the ways Johnson was making the party unelectable). Looks like a leadership bid.

Definitely a leadership bid or at least an attempt to float one

He mentions the policing bill I think (the noisy protest bit) as something he wasn’t happy with but surely he’d have voted for that?