Opposition to Islam is not Racism.

[Jeff Robinson]

Is there a difference between hating the beliefs of the established religions be they Islam, RC or Christian and hating the followers off those religions, how does this differ from hating the beliefs of extremist political parties and their folllowers.

Well firstly because political extremists (whatever that is supposed to be mean) are by definition a more homogenous bloc than followers of religion who are not necessarily, and statistically unlikely to be, extremist.

Why is it that many right on (Ha ha) people believe they must defend Islam by merely condemning the tyranny of established Christianity rather than defending Islam in its own right is it because its indefensible or because they just dont know about it but feel they HAVE to defend it

“Right on people” in the “West” might feel a little more comfortable about attacking Islam were it not for the fact that far right shitbags all over the shop are making their business to do this to batter an ethno-religious minority group. Maybe.

 

[upsidedownwalrus]

I'm Anti Catholic ..thats OK apparently because I went to a Catholic School ,I have a Catholic Set of First names.

I'm Anti Baptist ..Is that OK =after all I'm not one and never have had much connection with them but they seem an intolerant bunch with their avsurd literal belief in the Bible - thats OK too it seems.

I'm Anti Islam -for all the reasons that I'm anti catholic and Anti Baptist but apparently That's NOT OK .Even though I am Anti Islam because first and foremost it oppresses its own adherants I can be set upon by people who claim that my "islamaphobia' is all about "racism" apperently because most muslims are 'brown' and I am not.

Most Anglicans are Black but I can be Anti CofE without being racist too .Anyone care to explain why ?

Deckchair, popcorn etc...

 

[upsidedownwalrus]

It's the taking part that counts.

 

[Al Kahul]

I suppose you want this to be a springboard for you to express your badly informed opinions about how it's fine for women to be treated as livestock for the pleasure of men in the West because it's 'consensual'. Well go on then, empty your bowel.

I think ,if this is true,that we have a young woman who is sick to death with the abusive beliefs of her Father and has decided to rebel in the most effective way she can.

If you have puritanical , repressed ideals about sex then really that's a matter for you and your therapist.

 

[Al Kahul]

I suppose you want this to be a springboard for you to express your badly informed opinions about how it's fine for women to be treated as livestock for the pleasure of men in the West because it's 'consensual'. Well go on then, empty your bowel.

I think ,if this is true,that we have a young woman who is sick to death with the abusive beliefs of her Father and has decided to rebel in the most effective way she can.

If you have puritanical , repressed ideals about sex then really that's a matter for you and your therapist.

 

[Al Kahul]

Well firstly because political extremists (whatever that is supposed to be mean) are by definition a more homogenous bloc than followers of religion who are not necessarily, and statistically unlikely to be, extremist.

depends on what you mean by extremist teh vast majority of Southern baptists are on teh extreme when compared to mebers of teh Church of England

“Right on people” in the “West” might feel a little more comfortable about attacking Islam were it not for the fact that far right shitbags all over the shop are making their business to do this to batter an ethno-religious minority group. Maybe.

so you let the racist right set your agenda for you ? Thats impressive !

 

[danny la rouge]

If you have puritanical , repressed ideals about sex then really that's a matter for you and your therapist.

Yet again you fail to see structures in society. We are social animals, and we exist in social relation to each other, not as Robinson Crusoes with only goats as company. The structures that you aren't seeing include structures of authority, oppression, subjugation. This is strange for someone interested in liberty.

Your ideal of a mutual market place is blind to class, and your notions of sex are blind to gender oppression, paternalism, objectification.

You aren't stupid; look into these things.

 

[CUMBRIANDRAGON]

obviously not but 'anti racists' seem to think otherwise.

There seems to be a big gap between 'anti racists' and people who just aren't racist.

I was called a nazi a year back for telling a SWP person I was anti Islam.To alot on the left not anachist but socialists anti islam is regarded as racism.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

If you have puritanical , repressed ideals about sex then really that's a matter for you and your therapist.

Expressing a non-conformist opinion on sexuality has nothing to do with sexual repression so you can take your dark dead end sub-Freudian para-psychological mysticism and shove it up yer japs eye.

 

[ohmyliver]

depends on what you mean by extremist teh vast majority of Southern baptists are on teh extreme when compared to mebers of teh Church of England

You are capable of subdividing christianity into seperate entities (although on scriptural terms the baptist and the church of england varients of protetantism are fairly similar, well, similar when compaired with catholicism, or eastern orthodox christianity). To be consistant you should do the same with Islam.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

Yet again you fail to see structures in society. We are social animals, and we exist in social relation to each other, not as Robinson Crusoes with only goats as company. The structures that you aren't seeing include structures of authority, oppression, subjugation. This is strange for someone interested in liberty.

Your ideal of a mutual market place is blind to class, and your notions of sex are blind to gender oppression, paternalism, objectification.

Structural analysis - lovely stuff. Though to appriciate it you have to be aware that the 'bigger picture' means more than owning a wide screen t.v.

 

[Jeff Robinson]

.

 

[Nigel]

This is TOOO funny .I seem to have hit the resident lunatic.
What on earth can I have said that might possibly Identify myself as a Zionist.indeed I have already stated elsewhere that I don't think the Jews should have been 'awarded' palestine but should have been given Kallingrad from the Germans and Elba From the Italians. How is that zionist ?

Sorry I might of got you mixed up with someone else.(are you KBJ)
Regarding Zionism

 

[Stoat Boy]

I was called a nazi a year back for telling a SWP person I was anti Islam.To alot on the left not anachist but socialists anti islam is regarded as racism.

You need to remember that for many on the left the conventional ideals of socialism have been kicked into touch a long long time ago. Therefore they latch on to things such as fundamental Islam and the Greens as a way of continuing what they see as the main battle against capitalism. My enemies enemy and all that.

Of course to the casual observer it seems almost beyond parody to see SWP types marching side by side with Jihadists but politics always makes for strange bed fellows and it invariably goes horribly wrong as has been witnessed in East London recently.

 

[Nigel]

They are the same as my views on eveery oppressive religion -the other big Abrahamic religion for a start .

Are you a Twotskyite like Nigel ?

I'm not a Trotskyite, by any stretch of the imagination.

 

[Al Kahul]

Expressing a non-conformist opinion on sexuality has nothing to do with sexual repression so you can take your dark dead end sub-Freudian para-psychological mysticism and shove it up yer japs eye.

I tried that Already - Ill do anything ,me.

 

[Al Kahul]

I'm not a Trotskyite, by any stretch of the imagination.

If you say so

 

[Nigel]

Eh?

What bit don't you understand?

 

[Al Kahul]

Sorry I might of got you mixed up with someone else.(are you KBJ)
Regarding Zionism

What is a KBJ but whatever it is I am not a Zionist.

I am very bored of I/P issues which is why I won't post anywhere near it

 

[Nigel]

If you say so

So are you KBJ

 

[danny la rouge]

What bit don't you understand?

Its relevance.

 

[Al Kahul]

So are you KBJ

How can I tell you if I am 'KBJ" if I don't know what one is unless KBJ is the name of a poster here in which case no.

 

[butchersapron]

What do you think of the muslims in Guantanamo Bay al?

 

[exosculate]

What do you thin of the muslims in Guantanamo Bay al?

They are fundamentalists, I say lock em up.

 

[Zachor]

Sorry I might of got you mixed up with someone else.(are you KBJ)
Regarding Zionism

KBJ is someone else NOT this poster.

 

[bluestreak]

He's not KBJ, unless he's a sock-puppet. KBJ is now posting under a different name.

Muslims eh? Well, I think the religious are idiots. But I judge a man on his actions (like most right thinking Englishmen, I judge a woman on her abilities in the kitchen, or breasts, depending) and therefore, while my anti-Islam stance is generic, I am more against a greedy selfish athiest than a good-hearted Muslim.

 

[DotCommunist]

They are fundamentalists, I say lock em up.

what even that al jazira bloke who just happened to have the same name as an al queda bloke? whos being force fed and has been there 6 years facing ever shifting charges?

you tool

 

[exosculate]

what even that al jazira bloke who just happened to have the same name as an al queda bloke? whos being force fed and has been there 6 years facing ever shifting charges?

you tool

You cant make an omlette without.......

 

[Nigel]

Its relevance.

That the way religon and religous ideas are veiwed is blinkered.
That it is intertwined not just spiritual and ideolgical beleif systems, many of them Chauvanistic, but also with philosophical world outlooks involved in the development of civilisations. Islam can mean many things to many people, differs extremely in geographically, many pracitces which are rightly seem as outdated and/ bad such as female circumsision, wearing of burkhas etc. existed culturally before Islam and are renounced by any Muslims today.

Religous belief systems transform according to the environment and times they exist in; many of the classical & shcolary works were destroyed during the first few hundred years(but also kept safe in certain monastries in Iran), then had a period of enlightenment, trading, developed into sympathies with positive struggles against European colonialism, present day a minority are into a Funadmentalist outlook inspired by the Muslim Brotherhood(This is a very bad analysis of the the Islamic history)

To attack Islam is not just to attack bigotry, barbarity and a reactionary world outlook followed by a few, but on the development on whole civilisations, claiming that western civilisation( which practices and has supported many things just as,and maybe more negative than Islamic) as being superior.

I see civilisation as having to develop beyond any religous outlook, but this is a process, and the emancipation of peoples in Muslim countries should be led by those in that environment, not on the cultural chauvanism of those in the West.

 

[danny la rouge]

So if I say Muslim Theocrats shouldn't hang poofs, I'm being a Crusader?